Relieve hyd pressure?

[bones1]

Needing to change a boom cylinder and a decal next to it says warning relieve hyd pressure first. Whats the best way to change a loader cylinder?
Thanks for any help. /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

 

[bones1]

Needing to change a boom cylinder and a decal next to it says warning relieve hyd pressure first. Whats the best way to change a loader cylinder?
Thanks for any help. /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

 

[john_bud]

Is it a backhoe boom, or a loader? Not that it matters a lot, but it is a tad confusing.

First, make sure it is sitting on the ground. No pressure due to gravity. If it is a backhoe boom, support the boom on blocks or hold it up with a cherry picker or equivalent. Then with the engine off, cycle the controls several times to release any hydraulic pressure. Then slowly loosen the hose connections. You can put an old towel over it if you are concerned about it squirting, and you will need a bucket under it to catch the drippings. Unhook the hoses, put caps into the cylinder holes and onto the hoses to keep dirt out. Take out the pins and remove the cylinder.

Set up the new cylinder to the length of the old one, so it will fit. It will be hard to move and you may have to use a come along or ratchet strap to pull it out. I use a engine hoist (cherry picker). Put the cylinder in place and insert the top pin (so it will hang down on it's own). Move the boom or loader to get the bottom pin to align with a hoist, floor jack, etc. DON'T use your finger to feel it, many people can only count to 9 due to that!!! If you can't move the loader / boom, hook up the hoses and use the hydraulics to extend/retract the cylinder to fit. You may have to extend and hold the control then retract and hold the control to purge out the air. Air in a dry cylinder makes them "jumpy" and hard to move small amounts.

What went wrong with the old cylinder? Bent? Leaking? or??

jb

 

[john_bud]

Is it a backhoe boom, or a loader? Not that it matters a lot, but it is a tad confusing.

First, make sure it is sitting on the ground. No pressure due to gravity. If it is a backhoe boom, support the boom on blocks or hold it up with a cherry picker or equivalent. Then with the engine off, cycle the controls several times to release any hydraulic pressure. Then slowly loosen the hose connections. You can put an old towel over it if you are concerned about it squirting, and you will need a bucket under it to catch the drippings. Unhook the hoses, put caps into the cylinder holes and onto the hoses to keep dirt out. Take out the pins and remove the cylinder.

Set up the new cylinder to the length of the old one, so it will fit. It will be hard to move and you may have to use a come along or ratchet strap to pull it out. I use a engine hoist (cherry picker). Put the cylinder in place and insert the top pin (so it will hang down on it's own). Move the boom or loader to get the bottom pin to align with a hoist, floor jack, etc. DON'T use your finger to feel it, many people can only count to 9 due to that!!! If you can't move the loader / boom, hook up the hoses and use the hydraulics to extend/retract the cylinder to fit. You may have to extend and hold the control then retract and hold the control to purge out the air. Air in a dry cylinder makes them "jumpy" and hard to move small amounts.

What went wrong with the old cylinder? Bent? Leaking? or??

jb

 

[bones1]

Hi John.This a new tractor. The lift cylinder, not the bucket cyl on the FEL has a small leak dribbling all over the tire.It is a Farmtrac 300 DTC and under warranty i'm told. I haven't called the dealer yet but since he is 120 miles away maybe he will just ship replacement cylinder.I would rather do this than trailer it to Richmond. Just wondering how hard these are to change.Do dealers ship warranty parts like this? I have no experience with tractor dealers.
Thanks again.

 

[bones1]

Hi John.This a new tractor. The lift cylinder, not the bucket cyl on the FEL has a small leak dribbling all over the tire.It is a Farmtrac 300 DTC and under warranty i'm told. I haven't called the dealer yet but since he is 120 miles away maybe he will just ship replacement cylinder.I would rather do this than trailer it to Richmond. Just wondering how hard these are to change.Do dealers ship warranty parts like this? I have no experience with tractor dealers.
Thanks again.

 

[mffarmall]

I have the presure valve on my new (used) top plate cut off with the screw part still inside. I need to pull it out. Any ideas? I don't have any rethreading material

 

[mffarmall]

I have the presure valve on my new (used) top plate cut off with the screw part still inside. I need to pull it out. Any ideas? I don't have any rethreading material

 

[normde2001]

Are you talking about merely removing a screw, or something much more sinister? Sounds like a job for a hammer and punch, or cut a slot in the screw and screw it out, or drill and insert an EZ-out.

 

[normde2001]

Are you talking about merely removing a screw, or something much more sinister? Sounds like a job for a hammer and punch, or cut a slot in the screw and screw it out, or drill and insert an EZ-out.

 

[bones1]

/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

 

[bones1]

/forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

 

[john_bud]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif )</font>


Bones, Ok, your cylinder should be fine, it is just leaking, right? It should stop the dribbles once it gets tightened up a bit.

Cylinders have a screw in end where the rod comes out. There are a couple methods of tightening it depending on how they are built. Typically it will either have 2 holes that a pin spanner can be used in or some slots that a regular spanner can grab. If it has an external screw on cap, you can use a big pipe wrench. First figure out how the end is attached, then buy the correct tool. It will be cheaper than driving 120 miles each way with the tractor and you get a new tool in the deal!

Can you post a pic of the cylinder in question and the area that is piddling ?


If you really don't want a tool that you won't ever use much, you can send it to me when you're done, or ask the dealer if he can mail you the correct tool and you can mail it back. Rental shops may have them too, but that is spotty depending on the area.

On your question on swapping out parts. I don't think that will happen. Could be wrong. If it does, the swap is a 10-15 minute job for a loader lift cylinder. Hardest part is aligning the second pin. Using the tractor hydraulics or a jack to move the loader frame does the trick there.

Don't dispare! Give it a go and ask Q's as they come up.

jb

 

[john_bud]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif )</font>


Bones, Ok, your cylinder should be fine, it is just leaking, right? It should stop the dribbles once it gets tightened up a bit.

Cylinders have a screw in end where the rod comes out. There are a couple methods of tightening it depending on how they are built. Typically it will either have 2 holes that a pin spanner can be used in or some slots that a regular spanner can grab. If it has an external screw on cap, you can use a big pipe wrench. First figure out how the end is attached, then buy the correct tool. It will be cheaper than driving 120 miles each way with the tractor and you get a new tool in the deal!

Can you post a pic of the cylinder in question and the area that is piddling ?


If you really don't want a tool that you won't ever use much, you can send it to me when you're done, or ask the dealer if he can mail you the correct tool and you can mail it back. Rental shops may have them too, but that is spotty depending on the area.

On your question on swapping out parts. I don't think that will happen. Could be wrong. If it does, the swap is a 10-15 minute job for a loader lift cylinder. Hardest part is aligning the second pin. Using the tractor hydraulics or a jack to move the loader frame does the trick there.

Don't dispare! Give it a go and ask Q's as they come up.

jb

 

[bones1]

John,your'e right,they will not ship cylinders but are sending me packing kits and seals.Looks like a spanner nut on there,are you telling me just tightening it up might seal the leaks? Both are now leaking pretty good where the rods come out at the bottom of the cylinders.What would make new cylinders leak anyway?Looks like loader was made in 2004,would just sitting around and not being used until now make the seals get hard or dry out?i have no clue how to do this but I will try to find a spanner wrench.Loosen e'm while still attached to the loader maybe,vise is not big enough.
Thanks John,any more advice will really help.
Steve in
Southern Maryland.
If I can't figure it out,maybe there is someone that can help nearby in southern Maryland,for gas and beer that can take a look.
Hope springs eternal.

 

[bones1]

John,your'e right,they will not ship cylinders but are sending me packing kits and seals.Looks like a spanner nut on there,are you telling me just tightening it up might seal the leaks? Both are now leaking pretty good where the rods come out at the bottom of the cylinders.What would make new cylinders leak anyway?Looks like loader was made in 2004,would just sitting around and not being used until now make the seals get hard or dry out?i have no clue how to do this but I will try to find a spanner wrench.Loosen e'm while still attached to the loader maybe,vise is not big enough.
Thanks John,any more advice will really help.
Steve in
Southern Maryland.
If I can't figure it out,maybe there is someone that can help nearby in southern Maryland,for gas and beer that can take a look.
Hope springs eternal.

 

[DaryleD]

Bones,
Just make sure to still wiggle the controlls to bleed off the hydraulic preasure just for safety sake. Tightening the nut is definately worth a try and I think most everyone would try that first; just due to it working most of the time without having to replace the seals.(I had an old excavator for a short while and that is all that it took to stop it spraying out.) I'm not sure if they are "O-ring" seals or not, but if they are, than I would recomend tightening it a quarter to half a turn and then check for leaks. Then repeat the process if it still leaks a couple more times. "O-rings" don't have to be mega-tight in order to work. Obviously if they don't work after tightening a 360 degree turn or two, than new seals might be your answer. Keep the seals even if you don't need them right now,as you might need them later on for it. Good luck!

PS. The reason that tightening it sometimes works is because it expands the seal; thus filling any void that the fluid could leak out of. The reason not to tighten too tight is that it can wreck your seal/o-ring.
Daryle.

 

[DiskDoctr]

Bones,

I moved from Finksburg, MD about 3 yrs ago or I'd swing by and give you a hand...

Seals that leak are normally caused by: rough/nicked cylinders, improperly assembled or tightened seals, wrong fluid, too much pressure, or worn out/dried out seals.

Since this is relatively new, your cylinders shouldn't be rough or the seals worn out, but extend your cylinder and check the rod for nicks, scratches, or rough spots. If so, that needs to be fixed or will rip out new seals, too.

Keep an eye on excessive dirt on the cylinders, which wears them faster, but shouldn't be within that time...

As long as you have the right fluid in the cylinder and your relief valve is working properly, that leaves either the assembly or tightening.

If the seal was rolled, nicked, or torn during installation, nothing you can do. If it didn't leak for quite a while when you first got it, probably unlikely.

So, tightening them is your first and most likely issue.

Relieve the pressure by rolling the bucket about midway to make bucket flat and extend about 1/4 way to make a slightly offsided triangle with the boom (where the bucket end is more verticle than the the main boom).

Might be helpful to set it next to tree, as if you have a cylinder failure, it won't be able to support itself, especially if you have to remove the cylinder.

If course, you should strap/chain the main boom and such to tree or whatever if removing a cylinder, but get into that if you have to later...

Once all is set well, shut off engine and work all joysticks in each direction. If nothing moves, pressure is relieved and structure is at rest. (Yes, for the hydraulic folks, there may be some inner cylinder pressure, but it will actually be "balanced" not relieved, but that's sufficient for non-assembly /forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif )

Follow the good advice above for tightening your nut, which holds the seals in place and cross your fingers.

If you have to replace the seals, write back and you'll get lots of good advice.

Hope this helps explain some things.

Let us know how you make out.

-JC

 

[bones1]

Thanks guys.I will try to tighten the nuts on the cylinders first as suggested and see if that stops the leaks.This machine has only 28 hours on it and maybe the nuts are a little loose....I hope.Have no spanner wrench so i will try to drift the slotted nuts with a chisel I suppose.
Thanks for all the support so far.
Steve.

 

[Farwell]

A chisel may work, but on a machine with only a few hours on it? Kind of makes sense to me that your machine may look better if you spent the money and purchased the correct tool. A chisel is a great tool as a last or emergency measure. IMO
Farwell