Retirement savings ....Yikes !

[Gale Hawkins]

Don't scare folks...the truth is ~ Life is a gamble and not always fair ~ So on that basis you might as well post everyone needs at least $5 million in reserve for possible health problems...I mean many insurance policies have a $5 million cap ...so why not...? That would scare about 90% of the population to the point of maybe just giving up...What % of folks do you think have $1 million in reserve....Answer ..about 1%...start googiling and you will find most folks 55 yrs. or older don't have a net worth over $25K...Imagine that...Life is a gamble...

I do not think my post scared the folks. It was just a number I estimated I would put back if someone gave me a few million dollars. As Medicaid. Medicare, Medi etc covers less and less of what they cover today i expect in 10 years operations consider necessary today will be considered medical options only available to self pay patients. The key as stated will be to stay healthy then die fast I would add.

 

[Gale Hawkins]

The recent 32 page article in Time magazine was pretty eye opening. Not sure if it is available on the web, but your local library may have a copy. The cover has a picture of a pill and the words "bitter pill".

Since is it not a public site will you hit the general theme and what we need to do about it?

 

[Redneck in training]

I do not think my post scared the folks. It was just a number I estimated I would put back if someone gave me a few million dollars. As Medicaid. Medicare, Medi etc covers less and less of what they cover today i expect in 10 years operations consider necessary today will be considered medical options only available to self pay patients. The key as stated will be to stay healthy then die fast I would add.

That is exactly the case. The hospital doesn't want to cure you they want you sick in the hospital to get paid. The insurance company wants you dead so they don't have to pay.

 

[brin]

I do not think my post scared the folks. It was just a number I estimated I would put back if someone gave me a few million dollars. As Medicaid. Medicare, Medi etc covers less and less of what they cover today i expect in 10 years operations consider necessary today will be considered medical options only available to self pay patients. The key as stated will be to stay healthy then die fast I would add.

The key as stated will be to stay healthy then die fast I would add.

Gale this is the truth...didn't use to be....it times past ...not so long ago the elderly and sick could afford whatever treatment they needed...but folks were removed from the process of negotiating for and purchasing their health care treatments....It used to be when we went to the Doc ..we waited until we were sure since we were paying for the dr. appt....we also paid for any prescription...there were not copay's...so we always negotiated the cost with the doc or drug store...the only time insurance entered the picture was if we were hospitalized the it was an 80%/20% split...on the cost....

Now since the government has entered health care in an ever increasing way...we are removed from the process of negotiating price, checking invoices or even caring what a procedure costs since the govt. madates our coverage and insurance companies decide which docs are in their group and what they will pay.

If you doubt what I am saying..next time you go to the doc. try asking him how much something will cost...LOL Then post back...LOL

 

[dmccarty]

...What % of folks do you think have $1 million in reserve....Answer ..about 1%...start googiling and you will find most folks 55 yrs. or older don't have a net worth over $25K...Imagine that...Life is a gamble...

My parents had to take over the finances for one of my surviving grandparents. What was shocking to me was how little money that they had for retirement. The amount would not buy a decent new car today. The grandparents in question had a small pension from a large company. My grandfather was a wood worker so the only had retirement money he was able to save and Social Security. They also lived within their means their entire life as far as I could tell and they had not had a mortgage in years. Recently I learned how little money my great grandparents had when the retired. They were poor when they were working and that did not change when they "retired."

On the other hand, another grandmother who was poor her entire life, was pretty well off in retirement because she had Social Security, two related pensions plus a bit of savings. I have no idea how much she had in the bank but I doubt she had much but she had cash flow from SS and the pensions.

Health disasters can happen at anytime, not just in old age.

Later,
Dan

 

[dmccarty]

Gale this is the truth...didn't use to be....it times past ...not so long ago the elderly and sick could afford whatever treatment they needed...but folks were removed from the process of negotiating for and purchasing their health care treatments....It used to be when we went to the Doc ..we waited until we were sure since we were paying for the dr. appt....we also paid for any prescription...there were not copay's...so we always negotiated the cost with the doc or drug store...the only time insurance entered the picture was if we were hospitalized the it was an 80%/20% split...on the cost....

Now since the government has entered health care in an ever increasing way...we are removed from the process of negotiating price, checking invoices or even caring what a procedure costs since the govt. madates our coverage and insurance companies decide which docs are in their group and what they will pay.

If you doubt what I am saying..next time you go to the doc. try asking him how much something will cost...LOL Then post back...LOL

This is very true. We had numerous phone calls to the doctor, hospital, and insurance company trying to figure out what we would own for one of my wifey's surgeries. Never got an answer either. The insurance company was forth coming with information but the doctor's office and the hospital did not have a clue. Can you imagine buying a car without knowing the price? The hospital and doctor have no incentive nor are they set up to deal with the questions we were asking. Just show up, give them your ID, let insurance pay off most of the bill after the hospital scratches off a huge percentage because we HAVE insurance, and then pay the remainder. Completely ridiculous and inefficient system.

Later,
Dan

 

[brin]

This is very true. We had numerous phone calls to the doctor, hospital, and insurance company trying to figure out what we would own for one of my wifey's surgeries. Never got an answer either. The insurance company was forth coming with information but the doctor's office and the hospital did not have a clue. Can you imagine buying a car without knowing the price? The hospital and doctor have no incentive nor are they set up to deal with the questions we were asking. Just show up, give them your ID, let insurance pay off most of the bill after the hospital scratches off a huge percentage because we HAVE insurance, and then pay the remainder. Completely ridiculous and inefficient system.

Later,
Dan

Dan ,

Can't you just see all the opportunities for fraud, theft and deception in our system...? As you described..you the consumer can get no answer...it is a closed pact between the insurance companies and the Docs and the hospitals know how to play them both to enrich themselves but in the end the Insurance companies have gamed the system and their CEO's are all getting huge bonuses yearly....mega millions...Docs are retiring in droves or becoming employees of hospitals ...like mine just did.

 

[dave1949]

Since is it not a public site will you hit the general theme and what we need to do about it?

Try the second link Travelover posted, you should be able to read the article there.
http://livingwithmcl.com/BitterPill.pdf

I would comment, but it would be another rant. Serenity Now. Thanks for posting the article.

 

[daugen]

I do not think my post scared the folks. It was just a number I estimated I would put back if someone gave me a few million dollars. As Medicaid. Medicare, Medi etc covers less and less of what they cover today i expect in 10 years operations consider necessary today will be considered medical options only available to self pay patients. The key as stated will be to stay healthy then die fast I would add.

Gale has his numbers correct. $1M is what financial planners use for a long term care incident, though the reality is often much less, but then not always...so if you have assets that you don't want to all go the medical establishment, it's pay now for insurance or pay the doctor later. If there aren't a lot of assets, things get easier, but not better...
If you are unfortunate enough to come down with ALS or Parkinsons with dementia, or any form of dementia, one can live many years before the body finally gives out. And remember, the incidence of Alzheimer's is equally scary large. one out of seven, one out of five, a huge number of people affected. Not scare tactics, simple facts.

I think the most important point to remember here is that it's always liquid or semi-liquid assets that count towards retirement, not your net worth. If you want to stay in your own home, like everyone has said, you'd better not have much debt.

Pretty depressing when you find you have a million dollars saved, you did all the right things, scrimped and saved, didn't buy the new car when you could have, and along with SS you have a retirement income of less than seventy grand a year. So ratchet that back a bunch to half a million, quarter of a million, and the income projections are scary low based on today's cost of living. Which is why I need to move in retirement to get the land in retirement I want, and be able to pay the taxes on it. I was born and raised in Bucks County and I sure can't afford to retire there. A song played over and over with many different verses...

 

[Travelover]

Since is it not a public site will you hit the general theme and what we need to do about it?

Sorry. I see that someone posted a good link - thanks! The upshot is that hospitals and big pharma charge as much as possible as a "base charge". The bigger the insurance company, the better discount they can negotiate, but the costs are still very high compared to other countries. If you have no insurance, they charge you full freight. Similarly drugs are much more expensive in the US, even taking in to account research costs for new drugs, etc. Congress forbids negotiating prices for drugs for Medicare, so we pay too much there. Nonprofit hospitals make huge profits and their CEOs are paid millions. The medical / pharmaceutical industry pays several times what the military suppliers do to lobby congress each year and congress protects them from cost cutting measures / restrictions. Lawyers lobby and keep out changes to medical liability laws.

The article takes several real patients and analyzes their bills and explains why they are so high. It is breathtaking reading. Whatever your thoughts on this, it is worth a read to to see how crazy the whole situation is.