RFI from Cree LED bulbs?

   / RFI from Cree LED bulbs?
  • Thread Starter
#51  
Sometimes it's the language engineers use to give names to things they work with regularly that takes a bit of getting used to.
I'll try and explain some of this in a way I hope anyone interested can understand.


The main thing with LEDs is that we have to limit the current they take, or they go pop.

Older, not very bright LEDs, have the current limited by what engineers call "Linear" circuits, such as a simple series resistor.
With linear circuits, the current stays steady all the time. A steady current does not produce any radio frequency interference (RFI) .

New, brighter LEDs need more current.
A linear circuit, like a resistor, would still work fine to limit the current, however it would have to be physically much bigger to handle the extra amps and it would get very hot.

Instead they use a "switching" circuit, which is far more efficient.
An electronic switch turns on the current, let's it build up, then before it get's too high, switches if off again.
After a short pause it turns back on again, then off, on, off, on, off, on, off ...
All this on-off-on-off switching is very fast, many thousands of times every second, so the human eye is not aware that anything is happening.


Have you ever thrown a power switch on an appliance or lighting circuit and noticed that occasionally this causes a flicker on the tv screen or a click on the radio ?
Throwing the switch changes the current. The more rapid the change in current, the greater the RFI it produces.

Imagaine now how much potential there is for RFI from an LED lamp that is internally switching on and off thousands of times every second.
Cheap and/or poorley designed LED circuits can generate an awful lot of RFI.
Better designed circuits limit the abruptness at which the switching takes place and so get rid of most the RFI.

I don't know what line of work you are in, but the next technical manual I read, I want you to be the one that wrote it!.. You did one heck of a job of making a fairly complex description of switching power supplies understandable by just about anyone. You sir have a gift!:thumbsup:
 
   / RFI from Cree LED bulbs?
  • Thread Starter
#52  
Interesting, not bad for $8 I see. The one LED bulb I have is Cree but not this model. I do like it but haven't burned all my old school stock pile yet.

What I do wonder is if new houses will eventually be wired for DC LED's and have a power supply elsewhere to power them. Imagine the savings in house wire if all ceiling lights ran DC instead. Just have a power supply or 2 near your circuit box. Interesting thought anyway.

It is an interesting thought, but I am not sure we will ever get off the "standards" of socket, and voltages we run things on now. Time will tell I guess.
 
   / RFI from Cree LED bulbs? #53  
I found that the bulbs in my kitchen that seem to be eternal, are 130v bulbs. That explains quit a bit.
 
   / RFI from Cree LED bulbs?
  • Thread Starter
#54  
I found that the bulbs in my kitchen that seem to be eternal, are 130v bulbs. That explains quit a bit.

yep, they used them in traffic lights too. They are a bit dimmer, but sure last a lot longer.
 
   / RFI from Cree LED bulbs? #57  
Speaking about RFI from switching power supplies (in ex. LED drivers or dimmers). When we built our house I installed about 35 Lutron dimmers bought in HD. Our AM radio buzzed anytime any light was on. Shortly after we got hit by a lightning and all the dimmers burned. I called Lutron and surprisingly they shipped new dimmers to us no question asked. After I replaced the dimmers there was no buzz in radio even when I put it just few inches from the dimmer or wiring. The dimmers were the same part number but apparently they were not the same. I installed whole house surge protector shortly after the lightning hit. It saved us from a disaster several years later when contractor hired by the utility to clean the right of way dropped a tree in the line. The power spike damaged electronic equipment in about a mile away from the substation. Our house (located about 300 ft away from the place the tree was dropped in the line) had no damage except the surge protector components were melted. The utility was happy to replace it.
 
   / RFI from Cree LED bulbs? #58  
The LED I have with bad RFI is an early EcoSmart from Home Depot, not a Cree.

Looking it up online, I found there is a recall for many of the early EcoSmart bulbs. (not mine). The recall is because they overheat and can scorch the socket or enclosure, in a few cases leading to a fire.

This bulb runs extremely hot and isn't as energy efficient as the more recent Cree's - 13.5 watts/850 lumens vs 9 watts/800 lumens for Cree.
 
   / RFI from Cree LED bulbs? #59  
I don't know what line of work you are in, but the next technical manual I read, I want you to be the one that wrote it!.. You did one heck of a job of making a fairly complex description of switching power supplies understandable by just about anyone. You sir have a gift!:thumbsup:

Well said! Eric did a great job.
 
   / RFI from Cree LED bulbs? #60  
We have two lamps in our bedroom that have no switches. Each had two 40 watt candelabra base bulbs. And after 14-15 years, one bulb finally burned out. With no switch, you touch a lamp anywhere on it and it comes on, touch it again and it brightens, a third time brightens more, and a fourth touch turns it off. With this type 3-way, I was sure I didn't want 3-way bulbs and wasn't sure whether dimmable LEDs would work. But today I stopped by Home Depot again and bought four 40 watt dimmable bulbs (high priced suckers at $10.97 each plus tax, but they work just fine in these lamps.

So now that's 53 LED light bulbs and I think that's every bulb in the house except the 2 refrigerators, microwave, and range oven lights, and one plant light. And of course we have nine 4 foot, two tube florescent lights, one four foot three tube florescent light, two 8 foot two tube florescent lights, and still have the two incandescent bulbs in the Liftmaster garage door opener.
 

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