Roofing help

Mrwurm · May 22, 2003

I need to shingle an area of my roof where a chimney has been removed. It is very similiar to the condition shown in the attached picture. I need to shingle the area directly above the dormer in the picture. I know how to create the valleys for the dormer. I know how to cap the peak of the dormer. What I don't know is how to create the transition where the peak, the valleys, and the main roof intersect. Any help ?

rancar · May 23, 2003

OK Jerry....I think I know what your need is but am confused about the bit about the chimney being removed. Is this the area you want to re-roof or is it the area directly above the dormer? If directly above the dormer, the following is what I've seen roofers do. Right at that point of transition, I have seen roofers use one of three methods for the underlayment: a) roofing felt cut at diagonols so they overlay at least a couple times, b) use of a curvilinear aluminum or copper flashing that's special made for this type of installation, or c) installing a molded rubber membrane. Over this underlayment then are your shingles where you would slightly extend and bend the dormer cap shingle a slight bit above this transition point and then overlap with horizontal placement of roof shingles that are directly above the dormer.

...Bob

knucklehead · May 23, 2003

Hi Jerry

There's a discussion of roofing going on here on CBN; not really related to your question but and several pictures of dormers and a concentration of roofing interest that may help you.

I'll take a whack at it here and maybe stir some more responses. Generally, it's enough if you do the dormer first (even the caps), then the main roof, allowing one of the main roof courses to lay over the dormer peak to provide a little more protection.

Whether you weave shingles in the valleys, flash the valley with rolled roofing or metal and cut your shingle courses back to leave a trough, or do a "California cut" (lapping the dormer courses onto the roof and cutting the main courses to form a single cut line running down the valley), you'll have some sort of material overlap at the peak. Specifics depend on how you do your valleys. You can cut and match the meeting materials to keep bulk down, or you can overlap them. A little flexible roofing tar or similar product will help stick things down and seal the joints. An extra amount of protection would be to cut a 12"x12" piece of lead flashing, fold it and mold it over the back of last dormer cap piece and up onto the main roof over the valley work, then run the main roof courses over everything. You'll won't see much or any of the lead from the ground if you fiddle with it.

The thing to remember about peaks and dormers is that there isn't a lot of runoff there as it is up high on the roof, and not a lot of icing like at the eaves where runoff refreezes. They're generally pretty easy places to seal well.

knucklehead · May 23, 2003

Just saw rancar's response - which reminded me, you could always beg or borrow a small piece of ice and water shield - the stuff used near eaves and under low pitched roofing instead of lead if you can't get lead.

If you have some kind of flexible material - lead or rubber or ice & water shield, a little tar, a sharp knife, a straight edge, and a backing board, you'll figure it out really quick when you get up there.

Have you considered using the chimney hole for roof access - a cupola or other type of removeable cap that would allow you to get to the roof without climbing from the outside?

Mrwurm · May 23, 2003

""" Have you considered using the chimney hole for roof access - a cupola or other type of removeable cap that would allow you to get to the roof without climbing from the outside?"""

Or maybe a widows walk for the wife to pine away the hours when I am gone.

I'm getting a good idea of what I need to do. Thanks to all for the help. To clear things up a bit I guess I shold have mentioned that the picture is not of my house, sorry about that. On my house there is a wood framed chimney box and stove pipe just above the peak of the dormer. Actually, the wood framing stops right at the peak of the dormer, hence my trouble.

At the moment, I have demolished the chimney structure, then it started to rain many hours sooner than predicted. The whole thing is under a tarp right now which gives me time to go to the hardware for some lead or membrane.

I used a 6 x 6 tarp with 2.5 lb weights tied to each corner with string. I layed the tarp across the peak of the main roof and it drapes down far enough to cover the exposed end of the dormer peak. Works good so far, though it's not too windy. I wonder how a roofer would attach the tarp?

Thanks

knucklehead · May 23, 2003

<font color="blue"> I wonder how a roofer would attach the tarp? </font>

Depends on whether it's their house or yours. /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

Mrwurm · May 23, 2003

Well, can't get lead anywhere around here. Roofing membrane? nope, no one will sell me just a small piece. I did find a place that had rolled copper 12 in wide for about $9 per foot. Not as malleable as lead but it might work. What do you think?

rancar · May 23, 2003

<font color="blue">"...rolled copper 12 in wide for about $9 per foot. Not as malleable as lead but it might work. What do you think?" </font>

Jerry,

I've seen roofers mold and shape copper flashing in a way that's similar to what you need. It may do the job. However, they have special tools and equipment to create nifty flashing modifications. If you're careful you can likely mold what you need by hand. Be careful you don't put an incision in the copper. Otherwise, all's for nought.

...Bob

knucklehead · May 24, 2003

Jerry - even the Big Orange Box didn't have lead? I got a bunch in a 5-gal bucket from the chimney work I did. Probably toxic or something. No friends with Ice n' Water shield left over? Then you probably will be fine with an intelligent fitting job and some fiberous tar. Mine is Tru Bond Wet n Dry Fibered Roof Cement, from True Value Hardware. I'm sure the Big Orange has a similar asphalt and fiber compound available. Use throw-away gloves, a stiff plastic disposable putty knife, and don't get it on your clothes, unless you like them black and have a separate washing machine in your garage. It's kinda hard to stir up, so do that on the ground with a stout stick - it's no fun trying to fish out a broken paint stick - someone told me about that happening to them. /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Since your joint is up high, there's not going to be a lot of water get in there anyway. And that asphalt product is good to have around for miscellaneous leaks and things that need pluggin'.

Copper is lovely, but I've never worked with it. It's probably as good as lead if you can mold it - I'd use a plastic hammer and go easy.

Mrwurm · May 24, 2003

Well, the job is done. I handled the tricky corner by layering several shapes and courses to build up the corner so it all runs downhill. The current roof is a second layer so I had opportunity to double-up the coverage without it looking funny. That being said, here is what I learned...

1. Working on a roof is difficult. (I have a steep pitch)
2. Working on a roof is stressful. (had to deal with rain)
3. My work is not as pretty as the pro's /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif
4. Arthritus and roof work don't mix /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif
5. A two hour job for a pro took me two days

Final conclusion...

Call a roofer next time. Pay whatever it costs /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif

Also, the architectural shingles that were installed three years ago are no longer made. I bought a different brand that matched great. No one in my family can tell where the new shingles are /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif