Sad reminder of the importance of welding

[Capricious]

...just a thought..a bar tender fixes a drink, the waitress takes it to the customer....the customer leaves drunk, hits and kills someone..the bar tender goes to jail...he was at fault...this can apply to the welder here, even if he built it to the owners specs...right or wrong. Now back to the bar...why wouldn't the waitress who serves the drink be liable? The bar tender has no clue on who the customer is, or if he?she is drunk...but the waitress does!

I am not so sure the bar tender would be liable if he/she had no knowledge of, or could not be reasonable expected to be aware of, the customer's inebriated condition.

The reason that ANYONE might be liable in that situation would be because they would be aware of, or should be aware of, the customer's (assumed temporary) reduced mental abilities.

The welder, on the other hand, would have no reason to assume that the buyer of the trailer would use it in an inappropriate manner.

Automobiles are equipped with steering wheels (for the most part). The manufacturers of automobiles assume, and have the right to assume, that the operators of those vehicles are aware that suddenly turning that steering wheel to full-lock, while driving @70 mph on the highway, is an inappropriate action that will most likely lead to an unpleasant outcome. At some point the operator of the equipment becomes responsible for the safe operation of the equipment.

Occasionally juries decide that the "point" is rather distant but those instances are often outliers, which is the very reason one often hears of them.

 

[MinnesotaDaveChalmers]

At some point the operator of the equipment becomes responsible for the safe operation of the equipment.

I tend to agree.
When I used to drive semi trucks in the Air Force (sounds weird right) I picked up a large tilt-deck trailer from it's annual inspection in the maintenance yard.

I did my pre-trip and found the welds around the entire tilt assembly were cracked right through the center on both sides of the trailer!
That's many feet of cracked weld, not inches of cracks!

Gravity and friction were all that held the axle assembly under the deck (both axles and the tilt were one large unit under the trailer).

Knowing my temper may get in the way of progress, I went and got my master sergeant (my direct supervisor) and showed him.
He went ballistic.

Now - if the trailer had passed my pre-trip and I signed off on it - who would have been to blame if there was an accident?
I say it would have been me because I took control of the trailer.

 

[BWSSR]

I am not so sure the bar tender would be liable if he/she had no knowledge of, or could not be reasonable expected to be aware of, the customer's inebriated condition.

The reason that ANYONE might be liable in that situation would be because they would be aware of, or should be aware of, the customer's (assumed temporary) reduced mental abilities.

The welder, on the other hand, would have no reason to assume that the buyer of the trailer would use it in an inappropriate manner.

Automobiles are equipped with steering wheels (for the most part). The manufacturers of automobiles assume, and have the right to assume, that the operators of those vehicles are aware that suddenly turning that steering wheel to full-lock, while driving @70 mph on the highway, is an inappropriate action that will most likely lead to an unpleasant outcome. At some point the operator of the equipment becomes responsible for the safe operation of the equipment.

Occasionally juries decide that the "point" is rather distant but those instances are often outliers, which is the very reason one often hears of them.

Sadly, in Texas they are....

 

[dragoneggs]

...just a thought..a bar tender fixes a drink, the waitress takes it to the customer....the customer leaves drunk, hits and kills someone..the bar tender goes to jail...he was at fault...this can apply to the welder here, even if he built it to the owners specs...right or wrong. Now back to the bar...why wouldn't the waitress who serves the drink be liable? The bar tender has no clue on who the customer is, or if he?she is drunk...but the waitress does!

The bar owner will be the one who will be targeted with the law suit... at least in these parts. That is where the money is. You won't get much suing the bartender or the waitress unless they are the owner.

 

[ultrarunner]

^^^ Follow the money

I've never lost in court when I managed residential rental property and always received a Judgment with most not being worth the paper it is written on.

Getting sued and losing doesn't mean a lot to many because they are Judgement Proof.

 

[Sodo]

The bar owner will be the one who will be targeted with the law suit... at least in these parts. That is where the money is. You won't get much suing the bartender or the waitress unless they are the owner.

To motivate a lawsuit, there MUST be a pot of money somewhere, and no "protection". The bar owner has to be successful (with lots of money) and insufficient insurance too.

 

[dragoneggs]

To motivate a lawsuit, there MUST be a pot of money somewhere, and no "protection". The bar owner has to be successful (with lots of money) and insufficient insurance too.

Yep but it isn't a matter of protection... unfortunately I am indirectly involved in just this situation as we speak... tavern owner may be in big trouble because a patron driving home from his proprietorship hit and killed one person (my niece) and critically injured another who were walking home from same tavern. Sad, sad story and there is nothing good about it. Lawsuit won't fix anything.

 

[Sodo]

Very sorry to hear that.

Anytime I've ever dealt with lawyers there has been weeks and months of lost sleep, lost attention to one's family, and nothing good for anyone except for those charging $500/hr.

 

[ultrarunner]

Very sorry for your loss...

 

[dragoneggs]

Very sorry to hear that.

Anytime I've ever dealt with lawyers there has been weeks and months of lost sleep, lost attention to one's family, and nothing good for anyone except for those charging $500/hr.

Without saying too much... I totally agree about who wins in these situations. Not my call thankfully. I just need to support whatever decision and course of action is taken. This is still way too fresh.