Saw one today.. pretty nice

[5030]

Posters in general come on here to air issues and get advice, not to praise any brand. Like I've stated in my comments, they are all good, but they all have issues arise at times, most of which can be addressed by reading the owners manual which people today don't seem to read for some odd reason and then misplace it and never provide it when trading in or selling a unit. I do, along with ALL the service records. That increase the trade in worth and provides the next buyer with everything they require as far as service intervals plus I always include my phone number as I have nothing to hide anyway.

 

[2manyrocks]

FWIW, Power Trac has an enthusiastic owner group on TBN, but their new factory warranty is one year parts only. They do not have a dealer network to sell or service their equipment. Their machine is based around hydraulic pumps, motors, cylinders and hoses which are user serviceable. Frequently Asked Questions

Summit is in a different situation where buyers will be expecting a labor/parts warranty backed by service support. Plus, any HST tractor is a different beast when it comes to the mechanical knowledge required to service it.

However, I thought it worth mentioning Power Trac's parts only warranty and direct factory support without any dealers involved in either sales or service.

 

[5030]

However, I thought it worth mentioning Power Trac's parts only warranty and direct factory support without any dealers involved in either sales or service.

Don't believe that applies to Summit Tractors as the only places I see them offered for the most part are farm supply retailers and box stores and neither of them have service departments that can actually do preventive maintenance or parts replacements or even diagnose issues other than take the failed part off and exchange it for a new part and even that is iffy as sales associates are not usually mechanically inclined at all.

The Summit folks need to start (or attempt to initiate) sales relationships with established dealers that have and operate service departments with qualified technicians or they will eventually wind up with the 'Cabelas Syndrome'...

I know it's difficult to get any established dealer selling an established line to take on a new line and then have to have their technicians trained in servicing the Summit units and make no mistake, they will require warranty service at some point no matter how trouble free they appear to be. I know at my Kubota dealer, the service people are always going to Kubota service classes and I also know that the owner foots that bill, plus lodging and air fare or mileage if the classes are close. All a part of selling (and servicing tractors that will need dealer intervention at some point). Same with Cub Cadet which they sell but not as frequently and CC's classes are pretty local to me anyway. They are either in Cleveland at MTD in Parma, Ohio or in Willard, Ohio at their main manufacturing facility, both an easy day drive from here and both have lodging near by as well as good, cheap beaneries to eat at.

Like I said, they need to expand their horizons a bit, even if it means discounting their units even more than what they sell them to box store / ag equipment retailers like TSC that have NO service departments.

Just my view and nothing else.

 

[2manyrocks]

I recently experienced the difficulty of getting a Mahindra tractor repaired.

Once the warranty is up, it looks like owners would be on their own finding someone reliable to work on their tractors. These aren't like lawn mowers where only basic skills will get by or where the problems are so common that there are multiple YT videos on how to repair them.

When my Mahindra dealer continued to not respond to me about replacing seals on the bull pinion shafts, none of the Kubota dealers around me would touch it even though the repair procedure was somewhat obvious. I could not find an independent repair shop in my area that I was comfortable using. I ended up trading it at a loss just to be free of it because of not being able to obtain repair service known to be reliable.

Never tried it, but I almost wonder what would happen if I asked a Kubota dealer to change the engine oil in my Yanmar. If I didn't have the correct filter with me, they might say no. Anything more complicated, they don't have the service manuals and don't want to spend the time chasing parts while a repair bay stays tied up when they could be doing service on Kubotas.

 

[Maka]

The L2501 has a significantly larger engine that is also underrated by the factory to fall below the 26HP threshold for no DPF. It also has direct injection vs the Summit indirect injection. The 2501 has more PTO power and is rated at a lower engine RPM. It has a larger fuel tank, and significantly larger tires, and weighs a little more. The 2501 has a longer wheelbase and the loader lifts nearly 10" higher. It has more hydraulic flow. One of the biggest differences is the transmission. Summit has a crappy two-range hydrostatic while every Kubota except the very small entry level BX series has a 3-range. I think the Summit is more comparable to the large B series frame Kubota, now called the "LX." Its a cheap tractor that is trying to sell on being feature rich and having a decent warranty. There are always tradeoffs when you buy something that's cheap. Summit has to buy the tractor from ITL, pay to have it shipped over here, pay the middleman retailers like Home Depot to carry it and advertise it, and pay the service facilities they have made arrangements with. In order to do all this and still undercut the competition, they have to cut costs somewhere. So the average non-savvy buyer sees the machine at Home Depot, it has some fancy projector headlights on the front and features like the 3rd function and rear remote and leveling loader that the mainstream guys either don't have or you pay more for...and see the price and think "I want that." But anyone who uses a tractor commercially is not going to want this. And contracting out with an automotive repair facility for service is not quite the same as a JD dealership with all the special tools needed for complete servicing along with years of experience of working on these machines and a complete stockroom full of common parts vs Joe's Garage that primarily works on Ford's and Dodges but can squeeze in a Summit tractor that needs a seal on the PTO shaft replaced but has never done one before.

It seems the new model for introducing products into the US marketplace is now you contract out with some Chinese or Indian company who is already making basically what you want...you give them some specific features or specs your version needs to have, plus colors and sticker graphics...set up a basic distribution plan in the US with some method of attempting to service these things as needed...and sell it as a premium product. Northern tool has been doing this for years with their Chinese made NorTrac machines. Granted, this Summit tractor looks better than the NorTracs, but frankly if I wanted a cheap foreign tractor I'd just order the kit online, assemble it myself, and gamble on getting parts or being able to fix it myself and

The L2501 has a significantly larger engine that is also underrated by the factory to fall below the 26HP threshold for no DPF. It also has direct injection vs the Summit indirect injection. The 2501 has more PTO power and is rated at a lower engine RPM. It has a larger fuel tank, and significantly larger tires, and weighs a little more. The 2501 has a longer wheelbase and the loader lifts nearly 10" higher. It has more hydraulic flow. One of the biggest differences is the transmission. Summit has a crappy two-range hydrostatic while every Kubota except the very small entry level BX series has a 3-range. I think the Summit is more comparable to the large B series frame Kubota, now called the "LX." Its a cheap tractor that is trying to sell on being feature rich and having a decent warranty. There are always tradeoffs when you buy something that's cheap. Summit has to buy the tractor from ITL, pay to have it shipped over here, pay the middleman retailers like Home Depot to carry it and advertise it, and pay the service facilities they have made arrangements with. In order to do all this and still undercut the competition, they have to cut costs somewhere. So the average non-savvy buyer sees the machine at Home Depot, it has some fancy projector headlights on the front and features like the 3rd function and rear remote and leveling loader that the mainstream guys either don't have or you pay more for...and see the price and think "I want that." But anyone who uses a tractor commercially is not going to want this. And contracting out with an automotive repair facility for service is not quite the same as a JD dealership with all the special tools needed for complete servicing along with years of experience of working on these machines and a complete stockroom full of common parts vs Joe's Garage that primarily works on Ford's and Dodges but can squeeze in a Summit tractor that needs a seal on the PTO shaft replaced but has never done one before.

It seems the new model for introducing products into the US marketplace is now you contract out with some Chinese or Indian company who is already making basically what you want...you give them some specific features or specs your version needs to have, plus colors and sticker graphics...set up a basic distribution plan in the US with some method of attempting to service these things as needed...and sell it as a premium product. Northern tool has been doing this for years with their Chinese made NorTrac machines. Granted, this Summit tractor looks better than the NorTracs, but frankly if I wanted a cheap foreign tractor I'd just order the kit online, assemble it myself, and gamble on getting parts or being able to fix it myself and probably lop off $5k or more.

Lots of stuff here and won't try to unpack it. It's throw a pizza on the wall and see what sticks.

This is not a cheap foreign tractor. In fact, as a Summit it is an affordable high quality foreign manufactured tractor.

In fact, it has more features than B series, I'd say as good as fit and finish, equal or better components and a better price apple's to apples.

Before you react take a look under the sheet metal.

--Interstate Battery no introduction necessary.

--Bosch Electronics (Volvo, Mercedes, Audi, Benely, BMW, Jaguar, Land Rover, Porsche, Ford and others)

--Donaldson filtration (aerospace, agriculture, construction, food and beverage, manufacturing and transportation fields)

--KYB hydrostat (33.4% Yamaha owned, known for shocks and hydraulics and more)

--Mitsubishi S3L2 3cyl----you know them right?

Would you agree that these are very high end components? I'm sure you recognize these highly respected names.

Throwing Chinese manufactured NorTracs is not in same universe and just a backhanded attempt to associate ITL/Summit/Solis as a cheap product

If you have physically seen one, operated one and looked closely at one you can speak. If not, well......

 

[ruffdog]

The use of brand name components during a product roll-out does not mean that they will always continue to do so. Time will tell. Maybe they will switch suppliers....they did for the FEL.

 

[tacticalturnip]

The new supplier is Alo; I'd argue they went up in quality.

 

[5030]

I believe my Kubota dealer would most likely do a basic service on any make, but anything complex, no. They are Kubota trained not Not Mahindra or TYM or Barnson or any other make and they all require special tools to work on anyway and my dealer is always busy in the service department fixing stuff that owners fock up anyway.

Just delivered a new Kubota diesel side by side yesterday afternoon and spied Dennis with a big late model M series with the entire transmission and rear axle out. Seems as though the owner poked a hole in the transmission case low down somehow and they asked me if I could fix it. I declined because the transmission housing is cast and I'd have to machine the boss for the range shift after I welded it and my machine tools aren't of large enough capacity to handle the large tranny case anyway. Not gonna tell you what a new case costs as Kubota won't warrant damage cause by negligence on the part of the owner, no exceptions to that, except to say Dennis told me with a new primary case and all the parts that had to be replaced (including a new PTO hydraulic clutch pack and drum plus all the gears that ran dry and focked up, the total bill, labor included would be over 15 grand. Kubota did warrant some internal parts, but no case and no clutch linings either. Believe me, extracting a tranny and main case from under ANY cab model Kubota is an exercise in cussing and very labor intensive as well. Kubota adds the cab and all necessary options AFTER the main chassis is complete and ready to roll.

He didn't have the cab off but it was completely unbolted and hanging by the overhead crane. Only way you can access the components underneath and there is a ton of stuff under there too. At least Dennis didn't ask me to help doing anything as far as taking it apart. glad of that, looked like a huge mess to me anyway but I'm sure Dennis knows where everything goes as he's done that many times in the past. I do get to use his tools so my toolbox stays home where I need it anyway. Dennis trusts me with his tools, he knows how I am plus he's a personal friend and we shoot together when he and I have time.

 

[Summit Tractors Support]

Don't believe that applies to Summit Tractors as the only places I see them offered for the most part are farm supply retailers and box stores and neither of them have service departments that can actually do preventive maintenance or parts replacements or even diagnose issues other than take the failed part off and exchange it for a new part and even that is iffy as sales associates are not usually mechanically inclined at all.

The Summit folks need to start (or attempt to initiate) sales relationships with established dealers that have and operate service departments with qualified technicians or they will eventually wind up with the 'Cabelas Syndrome'...

I know it's difficult to get any established dealer selling an established line to take on a new line and then have to have their technicians trained in servicing the Summit units and make no mistake, they will require warranty service at some point no matter how trouble free they appear to be. I know at my Kubota dealer, the service people are always going to Kubota service classes and I also know that the owner foots that bill, plus lodging and air fare or mileage if the classes are close. All a part of selling (and servicing tractors that will need dealer intervention at some point). Same with Cub Cadet which they sell but not as frequently and CC's classes are pretty local to me anyway. They are either in Cleveland at MTD in Parma, Ohio or in Willard, Ohio at their main manufacturing facility, both an easy day drive from here and both have lodging near by as well as good, cheap beaneries to eat at.

Like I said, they need to expand their horizons a bit, even if it means discounting their units even more than what they sell them to box store / ag equipment retailers like TSC that have NO service departments.

Just my view and nothing else.

Thank you very much for your post and comments. Summit Tractors has a growing independent Service Dealer network that includes many tractor dealers selling many different brands of competitive tractors.

Each Service Dealer uses Summit's dealer management system, where they can create work orders, order parts, file warranty claims just as any other brand does.

If anyone is curious as to why a competing tractor dealer would agreed to service Summit brand tractors, it is because dealerships see a large share of their income based upon parts and service support not, just selling the equipment itself.

Summit also has its own mobile techs.

Again, thank you for your well focused comments about service, we agree and have already built this growing service network.

 

[5030]

My Kubota dealer won't. Besides servicing Kubota Tractors and attachments, he's always busy servicing Case tractors and harvest equipment. Just rebuilt a Case Magnum (Cummins powered) tractor muffler for them. The replacement muffler alone (no attachment brackets or turbine outlet seals was over so they asked me to fix the hole in the can, which I did. Just a quick high temperature braze job, took about 10 minutes start to finish and saved their customer a ton of money too. I'm sure they charged the customer for my work and I'm all good with that because of the 'perks' I get there, plus a paycheck (which is never a lot) because I enjoy delivering new tractors and implements to customers plus I get to talk to them and show them hoe to work their new stuff. Nice being on call and even nicer of I have something going on and cannot go in because the owner fully understands and will do the deliveries if I cannot.

Sure wish I would have worked for them instead of my retired from employer but then they could never afford what I was paid or the benefits I received (and still do), but I pay half now.