Seeking opinions on house-garage-shop building.

[MarkV]

You might want to check into the insurance implications as well as financing, if required, before moving too far forward. Some companies are going to be hesitant to work with a structure that combines a shop and living quarters.

MarkV

 

[medicshawn]

Another thing you might consider is building something smaller now for a different use later. Could you build closer to a conventional Garage With a Loft/Studio apartment etc. above it. Confortable enough to live in now but be able to rent it out later. Maybe buld it on a different part of your property so it would be seperate. You could use it as temporary housing now, and retirement income later. It could be a guest cottage, Pool house, home office inlaw suite etc.

 

[demoman357]

Other posters have given you good advice. Rectangle with expensive protuberences is an especially accurate metaphor. Spheres are a good bang for the buck, but are hard to build. You should decide over some time what your minimum needs are. A big kitchen, or a bigger bedroom. Establishing some mimimum criteria will help you decide upon how to proceed. Basements are popular and great for dangerous weather, but they are expensive. Concrete is always a large bill. How about a small protective shelter like a 150 square-foot basement instead? (minimum needs)

If you can perform the labor yourself over time, you will save a lot of $$.
Do not be afraid to try your hand at it, you may actually be good. Try a small project first, say a storage shed, for a taste and measure of your abilities. Seek out used, dicarded, and discounted materials. We erected a 24 foot by 72 foot wood frame barn using 90% recycled building materials. The slab was new concrete, but we used old rebar. Total costs was $5674.

On the west coast it is popoular to erect a metal barn/storage building and place a used mobile home (trailer house) beside it, or even inside it. Build your house and eventually move the trailer to the other end of the property and let the relatives and guests use it while visiting.

I have had many trials by fire in my life and have learned that fear is the largest obsticle in the way of completing anything. You can do anything you want if you do not tell yourself that it is impossible or will be too hard. The power of scavanging is one lesson I learned. All you have to do is ask. Sure a lot of the time you are told no, but in the end, it works. It is just a lot more hassle and it takes a lot more time and storage room. But the goal was to get as much as possible for your post-retirement dollar, right?

 

[mojoinco]

I have seen a couple of interesting building methods that might lend themselves to your needs. One is to use post and beam construction (similar to how many log homes are structured. I looked at one that was a walk out basement (often in CO you see the lot modified so that the upper story is a walk in/garage level, and the bottom is a walk out-- which really opens up the space and makes it accessible to the outdoors). The house was loosely based on a hogan style: hex or octagon perimeter wall, with a concrete core that all the plumbing, hvac, etc was in -- that could also be designed for as a safe/tornado room. And you could build it as a 1 level. Less concrete than a basement.


Another are SIP walls. Can't remember what is stands for (structural insulated panels?). I have followed some tv shows that used this, as well as talked to some suppliers and folks that have done it. You could save a lot of time with this method, and presumably money. It can be used as the roof for open ceilings. You may even be able to stand it up with your tractor and a hired framer. It is really easy, especially if it is a ranch.

You could build the shop as an open ended structure (just build in tool space), then finish it off as you go (save money with the tax man, as it wouldn't be an enclosed building). Or, you can cut some costs by doing things like just concreting what you need, use sliding doors (they have some advantages anyhow), etc. Even put up a shipping container or semi trailer. 35 acres gives you different status in Colorado than under 35 acres does.

Plenty of books on alternative or 'green' building methods out there. Which brings up -- what tax advantages are out there for materials, designs, etc? Including checking with your utility companies.

Years ago I was looking around for a modular home (there are 3 classifications to manufactured homes: mobile, modular, and UBC). Basically, the UBC meets certain FHA/HUD requirements (pitch of roof, materials, etc), plus is on a wood frame. Suitable for setting on a footing. You can even set it on a basement wall. Or a really deep crawl space. And a lot of hvac units are designed for short spaces now (mine even had an attic option). One salesman offered that folks sometimes build mud rooms on and have basement access from there (they would order extra siding so that it would match). And they usually offer good prices on the demo units. Also, most counties give you up to 2 years to put a temporary home on the property -- maybe more with 35 acres.

Regardless of what you do, you will want a little bit of flash -- a strategically placed window or a porch break things up (a porch can be added on later, just plan for it). Makes resale better.

Alternative materials may make some good sense too -- steel studs for example, on non-load bearing walls. Things can be done to make the spaces significantly sound resistant, but have to be designed in up front (like using 2x6 top and bottom plates, but 2x4 studs alternating to be flush with each side, then use resilient channels) for maximum affect.

When you have power put in, have it go to a central panel, then parse it out as you go (better distribution, less feedback). This is one of those places where there is no cheap way to go -- get the largest service they have.

No matter what, it will be an interesting challenge.

 

[mojoinco]

One thing I have been thinking a lot about is alternative heating & cooling. Something that you might think of doing is leaving an option for adding in solar (especially water) or heat pump (vertical shaft drilled similar to a well). I considered that in a remodel, but too much work to get to that point. There may be be$$er incentives down the road.

 

[mjncad]

All good suggestions for us to consider Mojoinco.

Thanks!

 

[flusher]

Like a lot of us, the current decession (depression-recession) has put a crimp in my wife's and my plans to construct our retirement home on the 35-acres we own.

Originally the plan was to construct a 60x40 outbuilding first to act as a non-commercial shop, materials storage and construction office while the separate house & attached garage is being constructed.

Now I'm rethinking ways to construct what we want with less monetary outlay. I'd like opinions on the latest ideas please.

1. Instead of two buildings, construct the house, garage and shop in one building.

2. Put up the building as a closed in shell that can be finished in a leisurely manner.

3. Basements are common in Colorado; but I'm less enamored with them as I get older, and wondering if we should go slab on grade. The downside of that is loss of storage space, resale value and tornado shelter. The upside is simpler construction and no stairs as this would be a single level building. The building site is essentially flat.

4. I've checked with the county zoning and building departments and they have no problem with the idea. The building department had the same concern I do with an attached shop and that is fire protection. That can be handled with proper construction techniques.

5. The assessor's office claims it won't matter tax wise whether it's two buildings or one as they'll look at usage and square footage for each use.

Thanks for the opinions!

How much floorspace in the house?

Have you considered manufactured housing to minimize cost? My 1800 sf place is double wide, 8-1/2 ft ceilings, 2x6 exterior walls, OSB sheathing, Hardiplank and Hardipanel exterior built on a 2-ft high crawl space foundation with concrete pony walls and concrete runners to support the house (no toad pads under my place). Cost in 2005: $75 per SF (house and foundation).

My 24x42 ft shop is detached from the house. Cost, including 6" thick slab/4000 psi concrete--$24 per SF.I had it built first to store the tractor and brush hog. I rented an apartment in town (3 miles away) during house construction.

My neighbor lived in his shop while his stick-built house was under construction (you can see that shop in the background of the 3rd photo).

My son lives in the Oklahoma Panhandle and has a nice underground concrete tornado shelter in the backyard (130 SF, $6K). His house is all brick, built on a slab.

 

[mjncad]

How much floorspace in the house?

Have you considered manufactured housing to minimize cost? My 1800 sf place is double wide, 8-1/2 ft ceilings, 2x6 exterior walls, OSB sheathing, Hardiplank and Hardipanel exterior built on a 2-ft high crawl space foundation with concrete pony walls and concrete runners to support the house (no toad pads under my place). Cost in 2005: $75 per SF (house and foundation).

My 24x42 ft shop is detached from the house. Cost, including 6" thick slab/4000 psi concrete--$24 per SF.I had it built first to store the tractor and brush hog. I rented an apartment in town (3 miles away) during house construction.

My neighbor lived in his shop while his stick-built house was under construction (you can see that shop in the background of the 3rd photo).

My son lives in the Oklahoma Panhandle and has a nice underground concrete tornado shelter in the backyard (130 SF, $6K). His house is all brick, built on a slab.

That's a nice looking manufactured home you have. I wish all of them looked as good. I haven't totally ruled out manufactured housing; but I want to do some things (e.g. radiant heat) that most manufacturers seem unwilling to tackle.

Originally the house was to be in the 2,400 square foot range, and the same for the shop. The attached garage with plenty of room to open car doors without having to be a contortionist to get in and out of the car was in the neighborhood of 1,100 square feet for a 3-bay area.

I know, a lot of space all around.

 

[riptides]

Shoot, call me silly, but I'd continue on trying to build out as planned. Maybe downsize on square footage, and make cost-cutting on "features", but stick with the basic plan.

Personally, I cannot have enough separate buildings. When the money is right (when is it ever?) I re-visit as needed. My structures were already in place (a remodelling, ), but I have to re-visit them for everything back to basic framing. It took me five years to get electric back into some of them, but now it is done.

If you stick with a plan, and you know what you need (and want), time is your friend.

 

[EddieWalker]

Shoot, call me silly, but I'd continue on trying to build out as planned. Maybe downsize on square footage, and make cost-cutting on "features", but stick with the basic plan.

Personally, I cannot have enough separate buildings. When the money is right (when is it ever?) I re-visit as needed. My structures were already in place (a remodelling, ), but I have to re-visit them for everything back to basic framing. It took me five years to get electric back into some of them, but now it is done.

If you stick with a plan, and you know what you need (and want), time is your friend.

Really good advice!!!

If you know what you want, then don't build something else. You won't be happy. I think that if it takes ten times longer, it doesn't matter, since you are building your dream. I've met people who built their dream homes, but only finished off one bedroom, a bathroom and the kitchen. From the outside, you'd think it was a mansion, but on the inside, you can still see the 2x4 studs in the living room where they watch TV.

Eddie