Backhoe Should a 448 Backhoe be able to lift a 4320?

[Seabeckredneck]

Hi Matt,
Thanks for the info. I would think it should move it around easily but I don't have much experience to compare to. As far as other functions again I don't have experience with other back hoes to determine whether it seems weak.

 

[Seabeckredneck]

Hi Vince,
I'm sorry, but I don't know for sure if the tires are loaded or not. Is there an easy way of determining? I'm guessing putting the valve stem at 6 o'clock and checking that way?

 

[bdog]

The 448 has a dipstick digging force of 2435 lbs and a bucket digging force of 3730lbs. The 4320 has a listed weight of 3850 lbs plus the backhoe weighs 1420 lbs. I don;t know how the weight of the machine is distributed between the front and rear but if 50% is on the rear that weight plus the backhoe is 3345 lbs. It might not be able to lift it.

 

[Seabeckredneck]

Hey bdog,
Thanks for the info! I had no idea what the digging force was with my back hoe, but with that math it looks like you're right and it won't. I appreciate the reply. I've been digging a ditch and not only was I having difficulty with a thick layer of hard pan but there was a time where it would have been convenient to lift and shift the rear of the tractor over a bit.

 

[LD1]

Not lifting the tractor with the dipper function so that spec dont apply. You lift it with the boom. And even if it lists a max lift spec, that is irrelevant. Because lifting a load is compressing the boom cylinder. Cylinders have alot more force under extension. And lifting with the boom, you aint lifting much of the weight of the hoe, cause you are pressing it into the ground.

I suspect the problem is either:
1: you were extended too far. Lots of leverage working against you. And if you need to lift yourself, I cannot think of a reason why you would want to be extended. Cause you are either wanting to swing side to side, or push yourself along. You want to be in close to push yourself and not at the end of your travel. And for swing, again, leverage thing. Even if you could lift yourself fully extended, I doubt the swing cylinders would move you.

-or-

2: your loader was on the ground. lots harder to lift as others mentioned. And even if it did, again, harder to swing to the side with the loader on the ground. Kinda an echo of above, but I cannot think of a reason why you would want to lift the rear with the loader on the ground. Cause if you are lifting the rear, you are either wanting to push forward or swing, both of which you want the loader off the ground.

Do mess with the pressure without first checking it with a gauge.

 

[bdog]

All valid points LD1. I know that dipstick and bucket are not what is used to lift the machine I was just listing the general specs that are published for his machine. The boom lift on it is only rated at 820 lbs. As you said that is retraction and not extension so extension is much higher but just looking at all these numbers as a whole it doesn't seem that that the backhoe has a lot of force.

 

[jenkinsph]

We could arm chair debate this all day but to answer the thread just try it out.

Setting up the buckets
With the bh bucket rolled up with the teeth toward you use the flat surface to swivel on. The front bucket should be flat to the ground too, meaning don't roll it under with the cutting edge digging into the ground. Both buckets need to be able to slide on their flat surfaces. The front bucket should contact the ground when you lift the rear of the machine enough to prevent too much side to side tipping. This is most important when climbing out of a ditch.

Setting up the dipper stick and boom
Raise the boom up and set the dipper close to plumb with the bucket rolled flat and see if you have enough radius from the pivot point to swing the backhoe side to side. This can vary some depending on how much you need to move. Usually you want to be close to the machine for easier lifting but if the radius is too short you wont get enough swing to get the job done. On flat ground try lifting the backhoe and see if you can swivel side to side. If you can lift it play with it to see how much you can move and get a feel for it. Get some practice before you try to work on a ditch.

Getting off the ditch
The first thing to consider is if the place you pick is narrow enough to work safely. You should pick this spot carefully and plan for it before starting the dig. With plumbing work for instance, often both ends need to be wide and/or opened up to make connections but the middle of the line can be a simple pipe run. Better to work one direction halfway then work from the opposite end leaving a way off the ditch in a clear area.

With the stabilizers touching the ground I will move the machine so that one of these can be moved as close to the edge of the ditch as possible while still providing support for the machine. In the next move I need to be able to get the tire from that side across the ditch to the other side for support. You have to be able to do this in no more than the two moves to be successful. With both rear tires on one bank you can move a little farther over to aid in getting the front tires on the bank. Back up the machine allowing the front bucket to support the tractor while getting both front tires on the bank. Then you can raise the front bucket and clean out the mess you made.

 

[LD1]

The boom lift on it is only rated at 820 lbs.

That is at max extension, AND lifting the dead weight of the boom, dipper, AND bucket too.

In tight, with more power extending the cylinder, and not lifting the dead weight of the hoe, I thinks it should lift the tractor just fine if the pressure is at 2250psi spec and the loader is off the ground.

 

[DK35vince]

Hi Vince,
I'm sorry, but I don't know for sure if the tires are loaded or not. Is there an easy way of determining? I'm guessing putting the valve stem at 6 o'clock and checking that way?

The reason I ask is my tractor weighs around 3600 ibs (not including loader and the weight of the backhoe).
I have an additional 6 or 700 lbs of fluid in my R-4 tires.
My Rhino 85 backhoe (8 1/2' digging depth) has good power and speed, but it struggles to lift the rear of my tractor off the ground.

 

[dlrfarms]

I have a JD 4300 with a 48 hoe on the back. Fully loaded rear tires and a cab on it. Custom made mounts; Woods subframe against JD hoe. Too many horror stories about JD mounts tearing up the tractor. I can set the hoe on the ground and move the tractor any way I want to with ease. Done a lot of rough work with it and haven't broke anything yet, except for teeth.