Siromer 204s starting problem

[scottie9]

can you easily remove the hyd pump and try starting without it?

 

[paulmowers]

can you easily remove the hyd pump and try starting without it?

Reasonably easily, catching spilled oil during the process, but yes it is possible.

While I can see how the pump could cause the slow churning starting fault, causing excessive pressure and drag

I don't quite see how that could be the cause of a brand new starter spinning free or disengaging when cranking at normal speed.

I think I am going to try cranking it by a live wire straight to the solenoid coil terminal (eliminating all the tractors wiring and the ignition switch), just to see what it does then.

The old starter had burnt out, but by the look of it, it was the original starter from 2004, plus the brushes were worn down almost too far too contact and the commutator was badly burnt, the customer reported it had been getting slower and slower cranking until finally it just clicked when turning the key, so my guess is that the worn out brushes caused the motor burn out?
No problems with cranking (except getting slower) or non engagement or jumping out spinning free were noticed with the old starter, all of these manifested themselves with the new starter.

This is where I'm at now, as I said I think to bypass the tractor switch and wiring with a wire straight from battery to energise the solenoid, If that works then probably a new ign switch and rewiring, or the new starter is either wrong for that tractor or faulty from new!

Cheers Paul.

 

[scottie9]

if you think it is the new starter, open it up and check the brushes, and put a little lube on the shaft at the Bendix drive. is it a Chinese starter?

 

[paulmowers]

is it a Chinese starter?

Yes Scottie, it is a genuine chinese starter.

I now have it at my workshop which is going to make fixing it so much easier, it only lives 1/2 mile from me but loading gear into my truck, trundling over there, then realising I'd forgot something I needed!!! Somewhat time consuming and unproductive!
So anyhow the owner tried starting it day before yesterday with no luck, cranked without heat but kept disengaging at the almost running point! Slow churn with heat.
Last night I went to try the wire trick from batt+ on solenoid to energise terminal, It cranked perfectly and never disengaged, it still plays up on the keyswitch but it started by heating on key, then cranking and he drove to the workshop.
So I think that rules out a faulty starter, it is looking like I need to do a bit of rewiring and possibly replace the ignition switch.

At least that seems to rule out anything major like ring gear damage!

Cheers Paul

 

[paulmowers]

I have now got to the bottom of this tractors issues - so am writing an update in case anyone else has similar issues.

It turned out that the genuine siromer new starter was either badly made or badly stored!
After hours of checking and replacing numerous connections and inline fuses I pulled the starter apart, desoldered the solenoid end cap and you would have been shocked at the amount of white corrosion that fell out!
Corrosion and burnt connections where the disc had been trying to make good contact with the contacts, a good clean up and reasemble, refit to the tractor and no sign of the previous slow churning crank or disengaging that had been evident, with or without heat a good reliable cranking over and it started!

I think the biggest lesson I have learnt here is NEVER trust a new chinese spare part!

The loss of hydraulics was caused by wear in the centre of the drive shaft to the pump, there is a large screwdriver slot in the end of the shaft with 2 drive lugs machined in it, these had worn away so the shaft was spinning without turning the pump!
I removed the shaft and tested hardness with a file and it didn't seem particularly hard so removed the bearings and gear and built up the worn parts with weld and filed back to profile, reasembled and we have working 3p hitch and power steering!

The oil level wasn't anywhere near low - so wrong on that one!


Thanks for all the advice Paul.

 

[scottie9]

its really no big surprise, I have seen this on several "new" Chinese starters before. glad it worked out for you. the pump drive issue has also surfaced before