something wrong with cooling system

[ugabulldog]

Not sure if I have bad sensor, gauge or thermostat, something else, or neither....temp gauge moves but only to line between blue (cold) and green, not into green. I ran for 30 min today, block was warm, upper hose was slightly warm and lower hose was cold. I removed rad cap and nothing spewed out and coolant wasn't circulating with engine on?

 

[Dave M7040]

Not sure if I have bad sensor, gauge or thermostat, something else, or neither....temp gauge moves but only to line between blue (cold) and green, not into green. I ran for 30 min today, block was warm, upper hose was slightly warm and lower hose was cold. I removed rad cap and nothing spewed out and coolant wasn't circulating with engine on?

Buy a infra red temp gun and then get some real numbers. $15 at amazon.com
Amazon.com: Etekcity Lasergrip 774 Non-contact Digital Laser Infrared Thermometer Temperature Gun -58℉~ 716℉ (-5℃ ~ 38℃), Yellow and Black: Kitchen & Dining

If you have warm water in the rad and the engine is not up to normal temp, then thermostat is opening too soon.

To do any reasonable trouble shooting you need some basic tools

Dave M7040

 

[ugabulldog]

how long should engine have to run to build up pressure in radiator? maybe it is just not running long enough?

 

[Jerry/MT]

Not sure if I have bad sensor, gauge or thermostat, something else, or neither....temp gauge moves but only to line between blue (cold) and green, not into green. I ran for 30 min today, block was warm, upper hose was slightly warm and lower hose was cold. I removed rad cap and nothing spewed out and coolant wasn't circulating with engine on?

Unlike spark ignition engines, compression ignition engines( diesels) run with widely variable peak gas temperatures. Therefore it's hard to warm a diesel up at idle or low power. The peak gas temperature is low at low power output. So if you are not working the snot out of the engine it will run cool. That's normal for a diesel. If you are working it hard and the coolant temperature is low, I'd suspect a defective thermostat-one that is opening too soon or is stuck open.

 

[ugabulldog]

Unlike spark ignition engines, compression ignition engines( diesels) run with widely variable peak gas temperatures. Therefore it's hard to warm a diesel up at idle or low power. The peak gas temperature is low at low power output. So if you are not working the snot out of the engine it will run cool. That's normal for a diesel. If you are working it hard and the coolant temperature is low, I'd suspect a defective thermostat-one that is opening too soon or is stuck open.

Thanks Jerry, so how long should it take at say 1800 rpms to build up pressure in radiator where it spews when opening cap?

 

[Billrog]

I often plow snow at 3500 rpm for and hr. or more and the temp. gauge never gets up to the center but during summer it would be in the normal operating range in 15 to 20 mins. at 1800 rpm.

 

[jaxs]

Pressure when removing cap isn't a reliable test.

 

[ugabulldog]

is there a way to to make sure thermostat is working and not open or closed without removing it?

 

[Jerry/MT]

Thanks Jerry, so how long should it take at say 1800 rpms to build up pressure in radiator where it spews when opening cap?

Depends on the load at 1800 rpms. If it's not under load at 1800 rpms the peak gas temperatures will still be low. If the tractor is in neutral and you advance thee throttle, it doesn't take much fuel to get to max rpm and hold it there. As you add load the fuel flow increases and the peak temperature increases.

 

[Jerry/MT]

is there a way to to make sure thermostat is working and not open or closed without removing it?

Not without measuring the coolant temperature at the thermostat. The thermostat should start to open at the temperature it is spec'ed at. If you have an infra thermometer (~$20 at HF) you can point it at the coolant outlet elbow ahead of the thermostat and measure the temperature. It will be close to the coolant temperature coming out of the head. If that temperature measurement is less than the thermostat opening temperature than the thermostat should be closed. Now open the rad cap (CAREFULLY!)and see if coolant is entering the radiator because it should not be. If it is entering the radiator than thermostat is bad. If the temperature is above the spec'ed opening temperature and there is no coolant entering the radiator than the thermostat is bad.

 

[ugabulldog]

Not without measuring the coolant temperature at the thermostat. The thermostat should start to open at the temperature it is spec'ed at. If you have an infra thermometer (~$20 at HF) you can point it at the coolant outlet elbow ahead of the thermostat and measure the temperature. It will be close to the coolant temperature coming out of the head. If that temperature measurement is less than the thermostat opening temperature than the thermostat should be closed. Now open the rad cap (CAREFULLY!)and see if coolant is entering the radiator because it should not be. If it is entering the radiator than thermostat is bad. If the temperature is above the spec'ed opening temperature and there is no coolant entering the radiator than the thermostat is bad.

when you say entering the radiator, do you mean see fluid moving rather than just sitting still when i take cap off?

 

[the old grind]

Pretty sure what he means is to carefully wrap a garbage bag around your alternator (coolant bath no blessing on brushes), put a wide catch-pan underneath, change the thermostat, and be sure to recheck your coolant level after some run time and maybe a cool-off or two. The usual advice for this classic symptom and no, not like buying a $600 control module on a wild guess.

btw, I'm sure you'd know when your tractor has run long enough to warm up. It takes a very warm engine to generate an obvious flow into the radiator's top tank. Pressure won't happen until the engine is so warm that the thermostat is fully open and pressure containment raises the boiling point. If the thermostat 'sticks' it likely won't open fully or close thus a trickle to see from the hose and 'over-cooling'.

also btw, not much of this has changed since the '60s, and when I brought my little Case/IH home a year ago I saw just what you have ... got my alternator 'wet', too ...

 

[Texasmark]

Thanks Jerry, so how long should it take at say 1800 rpms to build up pressure in radiator where it spews when opening cap?

I block off my radiator with a piece of cardboard and still can run around for half an hour or so working mid rpms including 3 mile trips out and back to deliver hay and my 6530 doesn't even get into the thermostat opening temperature. Wait till you are baling hay or plowing this summer to decide whether or not you have a problem.

On tractor cooling, my 6530 is now 11 years old and I was thinking I was having cooling issues due to corrosion in my cooling system this past summer. Turns out I accidentally bumped my fan the other day and it moved with the engine off and not turning. Wink! New fan belt and proper tension should solve that problem.

 

[the old grind]

'Blocking' a radiator in warm climate seems odd, since the radiator is there to cool the engine as needed, but ... the thermostat is there to get and keep it up to operating temp.

If it runs 'cool' it runs 'dirty' due to incomplete combustion, including 'blackening' your oil more thoroughly. Same applies to gas engines, btw. Physics vs lore.

 

[RandyT]

Keep in mind that some of these tractors don't run real warm even with everything correct. My Kioti has a factory thermostat of 160 degrees and mine never even reaches the two dots on my temp gauge which would be the normal range unless I am working the tractor hard and above 80 degrees outside.

 

[Gary Fowler]

'Blocking' a radiator in warm climate seems odd, since the radiator is there to cool the engine as needed, but ... the thermostat is there to get and keep it up to operating temp.

If it runs 'cool' it runs 'dirty' due to incomplete combustion, including 'blackening' your oil more thoroughly. Same applies to gas engines, btw. Physics vs lore.

North Texas might seem like a warm climate to you, but it can get in the teens many times and blocking or partially blocking the radiator will help keep the temps up to prescribed limits. You see truckers running all the time with a partially blocked radiator.

You don't have to see below zero temps to need some air flow blockage so the engine runs at operating temps. As you stated, if it is running cool, it is running dirty so regardless of where you are, helping to get that engine up to temperature quickly and keeping it there is optimum.

 

[PILOON]

My car (a Kia) thermostat leaves somethin to desire.
Compared to my previous vehicle (Jimmy) it wants another 4-5 miles B4 I get heat.
Intentions are always to simply install a new 'stat as I suspect it will be that simple.
LOL, there is so much plastic on modern engins that I don't even see where it is.

 

[Jerry/MT]

when you say entering the radiator, do you mean see fluid moving rather than just sitting still when i take cap off?

Yes if the thermostat is open then you'll see coolant moving onto the top part of the radiator core. To be on the safe side run with the cap off and check the temperature ahead of the thermostat and observe the coolant in the radiator.

 

[Texasmark]

Considering I live in N. TX. and there are lots and lots of farms north of me. I know full well that lots of folks don't give their engines time to come up to operating temperature and as a result don't burn off condensation moisture that gets into the combustion chambers and lubricants and operate in temps much colder than mine. Besides being good for the equipment, it gets the heater hot in the cab quicker. Wink!