Startup Cattle

[Thowle]

Hey guys,

I'm contemplating buying 90 acres or so, some haying equipment, fencing in about 30 acres and getting 20 head of beef cattle. I'd like to just buy calves, feed them and sell after a few years, then get more. Don't want to bother with breeding.

What would I need to do this correctly and efficiently; I know nothing about cattle or haying, or the procedures.

Someone said to just split the acres into 3 fields, dig a pond, build a shelter and rotate the cows once a field is consumed. Then just an annual vet bill for shots, and haying some land to feed in the winter.

Am I totally over simplifying it?

 

[bsrfarms97]

The cattle business can be as simple or as complicated as you want to make it. Rotational grazing is definitely the way to go to maximize your head per acre. I would advise to get intouch with your local county agent. They can come out and advise you a good plan for the land your going to farm.
However since you do not want to get involved in a cow/calf type operation, I would look at raising all steers. They would bring you more money per pound.

 

[MattLynch]

I would say you are over simplifying it, but you have the jist of it. If you wanted to make a profit you would be better off using it all as pasture and buying hay. It is easiest to set up a perimeter fence and then cross fence paddocks with nylon. I wouldn't recommend a pond as a water source unless it was your only option. You should also learn how to give needles and some basic handling skills before you start. Ask another farmer, most will be more then willing to show you a few things and give advice.

 

[farmall 55a case]

Some great advice here!

 

[rtimgray]

I've got about 20 cows (and a bull, so we have calves), and a small cattle operation can be pretty simple, once you get started. As mentioned, if you're interested in it, I would start with fencing in some acreage, buying a few steer calves and raising them for sale. I don't know if you ever been around cows to much of a degree, but in my experience, steer calves are dumber than a bag of hair, and if they get out of their fences, it can be a trick to get them back in without the calming influence of older cows to follow.

My cattle are pretty low maintenance, other than occasionally having to help a heifer with calving, putting up hay in the summer, and feeding in the winter.

BTW, I'm not too far from Paducah.

Good luck with your decision. Take care.

 

[Grumpy Old Man]

I have been buying a few steers yearly from a neighbor and he lets me keep them in his pastures until they are butchered and I help him with tractor work the calving and any help i can give him all year long for the favor .I have been talking with him over the last month to take over 1 pasture and part of his herd as he is now 92 and just about done with the daily work . This man worked his 500 acres his whole life built his own barns ,home ,and out buildings using his home built sawmill .He used to do everything pretty much by himself and has lived a long life and his greatest fear is that his farm will become a new subdivision when he's gone .The land I'm wanting has a large hay barn with chutes 3 corrals city water and feeding stations it also has a running clear stream and the fences are intact but need work , I have been picking this mans brain for a few years and at one time he was completely self sufficient ,I'll watch this thread closely I'm trying to do the same thing !

 

[Beltman60]

the pond would work if you fence it off and only use it to pump water out into the troughs

My grandfather was self efficient with cattle
He grew his own corn and oats and made his own hay
He would only feed the corn and oats the last 60 days to get the marbling we liked in the meat
last 30 days they would be confined in the barn

 

[Grumpy Old Man]

Cattle will trash a pond fast ,nothing you would want to swim in or fish out of .

 

[Bison]

Do the math,...there's no money in cattle!

 

[Grumpy Old Man]

Do the math,...there's no money in cattle!

There's no money in cattle ? really ? I have a few dozen small herd (less than 50) cattle owners within 5 miles of my house and a cattle auction ! 3 miles away who would laugh at that statement ! keep buying those cheap steaks from Mexico at $9.99 a pound ! They eat horse meat in Canada don't they ? $150.00 calf purchased from auction dropped in grass pasture for 18 months turns into about $1,000.00 ? Yep your right no money there . ROFLMAO !

 

[Soggy Bottom Outdoors]

Well, if you'll let an old time cattleman pass along a few helpful hints. I live about 40 miles west of Louisville, so I am "near" you. First thing, build as good property line/border fence as you can afford. Reasoning, there are two kinds of "outs" (and they will get out) when it comes to cattle, out on you (wrong field), out on a neighbor, (wrong farm). The former is much better than the later. Make your facilities as centrally located as you can in the middle of the farm if you can. Barns, buildings, corrals, working pens, feed storage, main water source, electricity, keep it all together if you can. Cross fence with electric, cheap, easy to use, the possibilities are endless, (buy two fence boxes, lightening will get one) Cattle will get sick, more so with the stocker/backgrounders you're considering. Respitory, eyes and feet will cover most of your doctoring. Find the best way for you catch and hold them, learn to do your own vet work, by yourself most times. Sometimes you can't wait on help. Set some goals/ guidlines for the venture. I.E. I try to asemble 50, 450-500lb black/black baldy steers (steers when I get them) by no later than May 1, I have several producers that I can by right off the farm, from people I know, I prefer them weaned. My average death loss is less than 1%. "Chronics" ,repeated illness calfs are culled, 3 strikes you're out, they won't ever catch up or come back around. More to come if you need it.

 

[Grumpy Old Man]

Well, if you'll let an old time cattleman pass along a few helpful hints. I live about 40 miles west of Louisville, so I am "near" you. First thing, build as good property line/border fence as you can afford. Reasoning, there are two kinds of "outs" (and they will get out) when it comes to cattle, out on you (wrong field), out on a neighbor, (wrong farm). The former is much better than the later. Make your facilities as centrally located as you can in the middle of the farm if you can. Barns, buildings, corrals, working pens, feed storage, main water source, electricity, keep it all together if you can. Cross fence with electric, cheap, easy to use, the possibilities are endless, (buy two fence boxes, lightening will get one) Cattle will get sick, more so with the stocker/backgrounders you're considering. Respitory, eyes and feet will cover most of your doctoring. Find the best way for you catch and hold them, learn to do your own vet work, by yourself most times. Sometimes you can't wait on help. Set some goals/ guidlines for the venture. I.E. I try to asemble 50, 450-500lb black/black baldy steers (steers when I get them) by no later than May 1, I have several producers that I can by right off the farm, from people I know, I prefer them weaned. My average death loss is less than 1%. "Chronics" ,repeated illness calfs are culled, 3 strikes you're out, they won't ever catch up or come back around. More to come if you need it.

So What do you think about there being no money in cattle ? How long are you keeping your steers ? feed ? are you auctioning them ?at what age /weight ? I'm interested in anything you'll tell me ,I'm very interested in continuing my neighbors cattle but at 92 yo he can't remember everything I want to know .

 

[bigbull338]

ive been in the cattle business all my life.an yes there was a time when cattle would pay for land an equipment.but times have changed an land prices have gone through the roof.if you jump in an buy a place.you need to have all the fences in place water in place a pen an barn in place.an as said talk to the cattlemen in the area your going to buy land in.

 

[MattLynch]

One of the bigger beef farmers in my area just went under. 1000 cows on 1000 acres and grass/forage finished. It is possible to make money with beef, but after all expenses you don't have a huge profit. Grass isn't free either, fertilizer and lime are pretty pricey.

Not trying to discourage you but your not going to make a living on 90 acres, however you can make a profit if you do it right.

 

[Soggy Bottom Outdoors]

First let me say that I'm no expert, but I have been doing it a lot of years successfully (and my banker thinks). Don't get me wrong, and it's not meant to brag but I have made more money cattle the last 5 years than at any time I've been raising cattle. Set goals and guidelines and keep detailed records and don't do all the same things Granddad did. Example. Grandpaw was satisfied with weaning weights of 450lb, our best to date is 820lb from Mar 15(birth) to Nov 15 sale weight. No creep feed, no meds, no steroids, just grass and mommas milk. Previous best was 802lb. Most of my operation is cow/calf, but I do background. Calfing season starts March 1 through June 1, any cow that calfs after June 1 is culled. Preg check in Oct anything open is culled. All cows are between 1200-1500lbs and are some mixture of angus, gelbveigh, and charlois. More later maybe.

 

[Ed of all trades]

As someone already said don't just fence the pasture put a fence around it all.
If you don't want to rotational system, fence it in small lots so that the cows -calves can eat it in one week instead of one or two big fields.
Buy steers from a local, not the auction to start, a lot less trouble.
Buy in spring, when you have grass to feed them and sell in fall - winter when you run out of grass. Start with out hay and add that later, it will already be a lot.
Don't buy heifers, delivering calves from young unbred heifers is no fun even for the long time cowboy.
If you don't want to be there every day or at least most days, don't start. There are people who don't count their stock every day but IMHO that is no way to run cattle.

 

[Soggy Bottom Outdoors]

Thowle, sounds like you're interested in stockers/backgrounding. I don't know anything about your experience level so don't feel as if I'm talking down to you. As I said before I start assembling them in April around the 500lb mark and expect them to go near 1000lb at 210 days. You would have no cattle during the winter. They wont be considered "finished" cattle but they still bring a good price. Rotational grazing works and I use a lot of it.....but do these things first, you must have good to great pasture first, fertility needs to be 100%, pH needs to be 6.8-7, more man hours, it only works if it rains.

 

[greasemonkeyok]

All of the above posts have good information, some from people who have a whole lot more experience than I.

About the only thing constructive that I can add is to maybe refocus your perception of the business.

You are in the forage business (from your land), and cattle are just the containers you use to send the forage to market. All real profit comes out of your ground.

That said, you might also ask you extension agent about renting your pasture to neighbors that are in the cattle business (producers). There are different business models, but one is to charge a fixed price per head per day that the cattle are on your land. This type of a deal usually includes the producer paying for all supplements, minerals, and vet costs. Another model is to charge so much per pound of wieight gain while the cattle are on you property, but that requires the use of a scale. Any deal you strike will need to address who bears the loss when one of them dies.

The local feed store will likely know who the local producers are. Don't be afraid to ask as they are happy to help their customers.

PS Don't expect to get a fair break when you buy or sell cattle at the stockyards. Because you are new, some of them will steal from you just like anyone else.

 

[Soggy Bottom Outdoors]

Greasemonkey makes a good point, I have one 65 acre place I rent, 55 acres in grass, barn and corrals, well fenced, 3 ponds, option of putting 25% in row crops, 5 year lease, hunting and fishing priviledges included. Cash lease at $50 per acre annually.

 

[Bison]

There's no money in cattle ? really ? I have a few dozen small herd (less than 50) cattle owners within 5 miles of my house and a cattle auction ! 3 miles away who would laugh at that statement ! keep buying those cheap steaks from Mexico at $9.99 a pound ! They eat horse meat in Canada don't they ? $150.00 calf purchased from auction dropped in grass pasture for 18 months turns into about $1,000.00 ? Yep your right no money there . ROFLMAO !

I said do the math! Go Buy land and go feed cattle for a living, see how you make out,...Don't quit your day job!!
Raising a few calves is just a hobby, your "profit" won't even pay the interest on the acres used to feed that calf.

And no, Canadians don't eat horse meat,..can't even buy it here.
I eat bison,..raise them too,....much better than beef anyway,...more profit as well.
.