Steiner Front-wheel-drive versus PT AWD

Bob_Skurka · Mar 13, 2004

Charlie, I probably should have been more clear in what I wrote about the ROPS. I actually am a believer in those things, it is one reason why I never recommend the grey market tractors to people.

I just looked at the configuration of the Ventrac (and the same goes for PT) and was trying to figure out how to carry some garden tools or whatever while riding the tractor. Because of the articulation, and because of the rear mounted motor, it would be possible to mount a tool basket directly on top of the motor's cover, but that might not be prudent because of heat. If one wanted to attach a basket or box of reasonable size (2+ bushels) on a PT or Ventrac, logically the box could be attached to the back of the ROPS (if the ROPS is attached behind the drivers seat) and suspended OVER the motor housing. The box/basket would have to be removable for access to the motor. Also by attaching it to the ROPS, it would move with the driver, but if it was attached to the motor housing, it would potentially hit the ROPS, the back of the drivers seat, etc as the tractor was turned from side to side if the mounting was not set far enough back.

I gues I look at things and think about how they COULD be, rather than how they ARE. That may be why I keep messing around with my tractors. I've added a large tool box, 5 lights, switches, etc. I'm in the process of adding a cigarette lighter as a power outlet, and couldn't find a spray rig I liked so I am just starting to build a Dual Tank spray rig with gun type spray nozzles that will spray liquids up to 35'. As I look at the PTs and the Ventrac, I say that is nice . . . but wouldn't it be great if only . . . .

eambrose · Mar 13, 2004

Bob - I think in the end - either tractor will work fine for you -
Steiner has that box mounted on the back of the 430max
for tools - check it out - maybe you can buy it and stick it on the Ventrac if you go with that one since they are really very similar tractors - heck maybe you can spray it green or black and stick it in the PT if you go with that one

MossRoad · Mar 13, 2004

That's a challenge. Press Aebi and see if it interrupts your thought process. 

Stir it up some more, Charlie... stir it up some more! /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

MossRoad · Mar 13, 2004

There is actually a dealer in Indiana, although I have no idea where that town is they are located in. 

Between Indianapolis and Louisville...

MossRoad · Mar 13, 2004

Bob, I like the way you are reasoning through this decision. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

One of my goals was to find one machine that would do it all so that I could elminate many of my smaller yard implements, such as lawn mower, snow blower, etc... and my larger tractor, which had become too large for the jobs at hand. I only wanted one power plant to maintain.

I think you have more of an extreme situation with your hills than I will ever run into. So far, it sounds like the Ventrac will handle the hills better than the PT. I've never seen a Ventrac in person, but have never heard anything bad about them, only good. And the few people that have seen both machines say the Ventrac is a better mower. I think the PT is a more versatile machine than the Ventrac, but if it won't climb your hills, what good is it to you, right? You really need to test them in person to make that decision before you buy. As you said, the PT425 PROBABLY will climb the hill, but what if it won't? OUCH! Then we'd all feel like mud /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif

If you already have a larger tractor to do your tractoring and an older cub that does the mowing, let's re-visit that again...

Why are you replacing the machine that works?

 my current Cub Cadet (which I have no complaints about, but it is simply not designed to do what I use it for). 

You have no complaints about it. Is it wearing out, or do you feel it is dangerous on the slopes?

If it were me, being the frugal type, if it works, but is wearing out, consider restoring it to near original condition. If it is dangerous, replace it with a safer machine.

Bob_Skurka · Mar 14, 2004

Moss

Several reasons for moving the Cub Cadet out of the favored mowing position and picking the Ventrac (so far).

The Cub is a good mower for most areas, but doesn't turn quite as tight as I'd like.

It gets the job done, but not as well or as fast as something else better suited would do it.

I figure I have a couple more years left in it the way I push it. It really strains on the hill side.

I have money to spend this year, I don't know if I'll have $10,000 sitting around in 2 years, and I only buy what I have cash on hand for so I would never consider financing a car, truck, tractor, mower or other toy.

I have need for the snowblowing capabilities of the Cub Cadet at my office. Using the Cub as a Snowblower will extend the useful life of it for another decade or more with modest care.

I have a flat grass field behind my office that is about 1 acre, it needs to be mowed twice a year. The Cub can also take over that duty with ease.

The Cub tears up the grass on my slope with the wheel slippage, even with wheel weights & tire chains.

4 wheel drive articulated units won't tear up the grass.

Slope mowers are more stable than the Cub on my slopes and designed to climb the hills.

The Ventrac has an extremely tight turning radius and will mow around the landscaping without doing the drive-in-then-back-up and drive-in-to back-up manuvers that the Cub Cadet has to do (which also tears up the yard and also is a slow process for mowing around tight radius curves).

The Ventrac is about a foot shorter than a PT425 saving me garage space.

The Ventrac 3000 has a tighter turning radius than the PT425.

The Ventrac costs about $700 less than a PT425. (Plus delivery cost savings in addition to that).

Now if the PT422 could navigate the slopes without wearing out the wheel motors, that would tip the economics to the PT units, but as has been discussed, it uses smaller wheels and lower torque wheel motors and MIGHT do the job, but if it does, then the question would be "for how long" would it continue to do the job? My Cub does the job of mowing the slope, it just does it badly . . . but that is better than the John Deere's we tested that wouldn't even climb the hill!!! All that said, I have not tested a Ventrac yet, if it fails the slope test then I'll probably start the process over, but it will probably be limited to the Steiner & Ventrac traditional style articulated tractors because there is no doubt that those will climb the hill and mow the lawn, they just cost more and won't mow quite as quickly as the Ventrac 3000, which is designed more as a mower than a tractor.

Despite the fact that I am spending a lot of money for a lawn mower, I am known for being frugal, because I only buy what I need and only when I can afford it. I will continue to use the Cub, but in a place better suited for its capabilities, and without the need for a restoration job. I want to cut down the time spent taking care of my property, so the right tool for the right job seems like the right answer to accomplish the job, better, faster & safer.

So that is my logic.

Bob_Skurka · Mar 14, 2004

Moss . . . one more thing. I think I am fairly **** retentive and that is why I go through such a painful and intense thought process.

Bob999 · Mar 14, 2004

Bob Skurka said: 4 wheel drive articulated units won't tear up the grass. 

My experience generally supports your statement with an important caveat: on steep slopes my PT1845 will sometimes slide when working cross slope and spin a wheel when working up or down slope and when it does it tears up the grass. I would also note that I sometimes had the same experience with the commercial walk behind I previously used.

When you say the Cub Cadet with chains tears up the grass I suspect that it is caused by wheel spin or sliding. I don't think an articulated tractor will solve that problem, even if it is 4wd.

I would strongly urge that you arrange for a demonstration on your property prior to purchase of whatever machine you finally decide is right.

Bob_Skurka · Mar 14, 2004

Bob999 . . . I fully intend to test drive the unit on my property.

I suppose nothing will COMPLETELY eliminate the slippage problems, but the 4wd articulated units will be a practical solution to dramatically minimize it.

MossRoad · Mar 14, 2004

That is a great thought process. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

I took a long time to settle on the tractor that was right for our needs, too. If I'm gonna spend that kind of money, I want to make the right decision.

So when are you going to test drive some tractors? /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif