Stihl MS 441 C M vs MS 660 video

[94BULLITT]

Here is a video of the MS 441 C M against the MS 660. I think the 441 does so well against the 660 because the of the wood and the 441 turns more RPMs. The 660 has way more power/ torque, you can really dog it in. I added a dual port muffler and tuned the 600 to 13,000 RPM and tested it again. I got better results on the 3rd cut, plus I think my technique improved. The saw felt stronger with dual port muffler and sounds better. You can watch in the video before I added the dual port how much the saw torques when I rev it and then watch after I add the dual port muffler how much it torques. To take full advantage of the 660's power I got a 8 tooth sprocket to try. It hurt the torque of course but the 660 still has more torque with the 8T sprocket than what the 441 does with a 7T.

 

[mountainlake]

Doing timed cuts you should never dog in, if you have to dog in to load the saw your chain is dull or your rakers are to high. The 660 will pull lower rakers and should spank a 441 in that size wood.. Steve

 

[94BULLITT]

Doing timed cuts you should never dog in, if you have to dog in to load the saw your chain is dull or your rakers are to high. The 660 will pull lower rakers and should spank a 441 in that size wood.. Steve

My chains are sharpened Stihls specs. The 441's chains has not been sharpened yet. I just recently started messing with saws as a hobby. I know there is a lot to be gained in how the chain is sharpened. I don't want anything that is to aggressive or dulls quickly to use as a work chain. I have not messed with the different angles and raker height on the chain any yet. If the wood is hard the saw will not pull it self thought the wood like will in something soft. I was cutting 18'' oak.

 

[TomSeller]

I can see the power in the 660, I keep drooling over them. For now my 441 is my big saw and for the majority of the larger wood I cut, it is perfectly sized.

 

[94BULLITT]

I can see the power in the 660, I keep drooling over them. For now my 441 is my big saw and for the majority of the larger wood I cut, it is perfectly sized.

The 660 has a ton of torque, youu can dog on it real hard. You may want to hold out for a 661 whenever they go back into production. The 441 is capable of cutting anything I need to cut.

 

[mountainlake]

Different angles don't mean much, raker height does and they need to be taken down after a couple sharpening's, for sure on a saw with a lot of power. Steve

 

[94BULLITT]

Different angles don't mean much, raker height does and they need to be taken down after a couple sharpening's, for sure on a saw with a lot of power. Steve

I checked the rakers on both saws this morning, they were both right on .025".

 

[mountainlake]

Set the rakers on the 660at 30 thousands, it has the torque to pull it and will cut faster. steve

 

[94BULLITT]

Set the rakers on the 660at 30 thousands, it has the torque to pull it and will cut faster. steve

I'm thinking about taking the rakers down a bit. From what I read I think I am best off to stick with the factory angles, think they are the best for all around use.

 

[FredH]

You are correct in my view on your thinking regarding about raker height , and angle . It is a trade off when it comes to sharpening i feel , 1) more aggressive = faster cut but possible shorter life span between sharpening or 2) Factory angle and height = slower cut but longer life span between sharpening .

In my other thread here on Full skip , ( I use to run those over 30 years ago after high school working in the woods ) , I recently bought another chain for my 441 , all the dealer had though in my gauge was the full skip , so I said WTH , Why Not . Yes , there is a higher kickback risk , but even cutting in Madrone , a hardwood like oak here in the northwest , It rocks :thumbsup: . If I can figure out how to shoot a video with my wife's camera , I still have a log pile of tree's next to driveway , with several over 18" - 20" in diameter , that it cuts through like there is no tomorrow .

My point there though is , that running full skip = half the number of teeth , Faster cut BUT 1 , just 1 slip up by nicking a rock or other hard surface and chain goes from cutting extremely fast to not cutting worth a SH** in a heart beat .

Fred H.

 

[94BULLITT]

You are correct in my view on your thinking regarding about raker height , and angle . It is a trade off when it comes to sharpening i feel , 1) more aggressive = faster cut but possible shorter life span between sharpening or 2) Factory angle and height = slower cut but longer life span between sharpening .

In my other thread here on Full skip , ( I use to run those over 30 years ago after high school working in the woods ) , I recently bought another chain for my 441 , all the dealer had though in my gauge was the full skip , so I said WTH , Why Not . Yes , there is a higher kickback risk , but even cutting in Madrone , a hardwood like oak here in the northwest , It rocks :thumbsup: . If I can figure out how to shoot a video with my wife's camera , I still have a log pile of tree's next to driveway , with several over 18" - 20" in diameter , that it cuts through like there is no tomorrow .

My point there though is , that running full skip = half the number of teeth , Faster cut BUT 1 , just 1 slip up by nicking a rock or other hard surface and chain goes from cutting extremely fast to not cutting worth a SH** in a heart beat .

Fred H.

I have been thinking about taking the rakers down but I have not done anything to them yet. I read on another forum that the guys that race chainsaws run theirs at .027'' so they will have a faster chain speed. I was thinking about trying to learn how to square file but I read some conflicting information on it. I don't think anybody here stocks full skip chain.

 

[jpm1]

Roger,
I have a MS660 dual ported and it just screams power and torque. Right now in running a 3/8 full chisel 50 gauge Stihl chain. When i put the chain on new it didnt cut as i wanted so i reground it and lowered the rakers to.032. At the time i was cutting 42" dry red oak and what a difference. A cut in that 42" oak was about 12 seconds and really horsing on the saw you couldn't pull it down. Ide play with the chain myself. I respect STIHL but i don't always play their #'s when grinding our chains. I'm going to start "square grinding" my chains, its a lot harder to do but they tell me the cut is a lot faster. I really don't know yet . . .. John

 

[94BULLITT]

Roger,
I have a MS660 dual ported and it just screams power and torque. Right now in running a 3/8 full chisel 50 gauge Stihl chain. When i put the chain on new it didnt cut as i wanted so i reground it and lowered the rakers to.032. At the time i was cutting 42" dry red oak and what a difference. A cut in that 42" oak was about 12 seconds and really horsing on the saw you couldn't pull it down. Ide play with the chain myself. I respect STIHL but i don't always play their #'s when grinding our chains. I'm going to start "square grinding" my chains, its a lot harder to do but they tell me the cut is a lot faster. I really don't know yet . . .. John

You are running your rakers at .032 or .023? I think the wood in the video may have been frozen. We had some pretty cold weather a few day before I made the video. I have not had a chance to mess with the chains any but I am going to.

Here is some good info on square filling.Square Ground Chisel Angles I have heard a good chain will gain you 30%. I have heard the guys in the Pacific Northwest square file their chains but I have heard they dull extremely easily, most guys carry extra chains with them.

I just found this on race chains. http://www.madsens1.com/PDF/RacingTechfacts_93099.pdf