Stinkin Electrical problem

[jinman]

Hey, Jim thanks for the reply, I did check and replace the fuse you said (and the other ones as well) no luck. When you turn the key on. the normal lights come on plus the PTO light. Then after about 15 sec there is a relay in the fuse block that clicks and the lights flash a sec then on steady then repeat.
I am willing to try anything you suggest.
Robert

Sometimes the fuse #2 will continue to blow. A 10 amp fuse could be blowing. I've blown several 10 amp fuses. You might try a 15 amp, but don't go more because of possible wire damage. A self-resetting CB that directly replaces the fuse is the best bet. I have a 15 amp self-resetting CB in my tractor and it has performed flawlessly. Whatever you do, don't jumper across the fuse. That's a sure way to burn up a bunch of wires.

If you continue to blow the fuse, walk around to the right side of the engine where you can see the injector pump (raise the hood). On the back side of the injector pump is a round solenoid about 1" in diameter and 3" long. This is your fuel cutoff solenoid and is on the fuse #2 circuit. Pull the connection to the spade connector on the back of the solenoid and see if the fuse stops blowing. I think the clicking and blinking you are hearing is the glowplug relay cycling. If you turn on the key and the PTO light is on, you DO have a blown fuse #2 if the PTO lever is off and you didn't get something shorted at the switch when you were checking it.

BTW: Fuel cutoff solenoid problems are pretty rare, but I had one short out on my tractor and had to be replaced at $125. It does happen.

Good luck!

 

[oneduke]

Yes thank you , I havent blown any fuses. Still prob has to be a short. I wonder if i just find the negative wire in that circuit and go directly to ground to re-establish another ground, if that would bypass and short???
Robert

 

[jinman]

Robert, are you SURE fuse #2 is not still blowing? Have you checked it with an ohmeter for continuity? The PTO safety start relay (K2) must be de-energized for the light to be on. The ONLY way it can be de-energized is if the PTO switch up under the fender is OPEN. When you move the PTO lever to OFF, you close the PTO switch and the relay energizes with power from fuse #2. That opens the 12 volt path to the light and it goes out. If you blow fuse #2, the relay never has any power and cannot energize. That means the light will always be ON. The power for the light comes from fuse #4, so fuse #2 can be blown and the light can still get power. Nothing else is in this light circuit. In addition to the PTO light, the PTO relay (k2) has another set of contacts that are in the line of the Neutral Safety Relay. When K2 energizes, it completes its portion of the Neutral Safety Circuit to allow the engine to crank. I'd bet that function is working fine if you can get the PTO relay to energize. You have to figure out why the PTO light is ON when the lever is OFF and you will have located your problem. It's as simple as that.

 

[oneduke]

I always feel enlightned when reading your posts, "it's as simple as that" (smile)

I will double check what you suggest , I called the dealer he says try replacing a "diode" , which is a cheap fix. You know anything about those?

Thank you for your help, I am about ready to just have them come and do it.
Robert

 

[jinman]

I will double check what you suggest , I called the dealer he says try replacing a "diode" , which is a cheap fix. You know anything about those?

Robert, I apologize if I've "over-simplified" your problem. I sometimes forget that my lifetime of electrical/electronic troubleshooting may mean that I have a different definition of "simple" than some other folks.

There is no diode in the PTO safety circuit. There is a diode in the operator presence system that allows the parking brake switch to override the seat switch, but it is a separate circuit. The only common thing with the operator safety system and the neutral safety/PTO safety systems is that they are fed power from the same fuse #2. One system (neutral/PTO) will stop the starter from turning over the engine and the other system (operator present) will let the engine crank, but keep fuel shut off so the tractor won't start.

Do you have an owner's manual for your tractor? I haven't asked you, but you said it was a TC40, so I am assuming you have the gear/shuttle tranmission. I've tried to be careful and ensure that my advice only applies to your tractor and not an HST model. For the PTO safety circuit, there is very little difference in the circuits, but the types and locations of relays do vary between the models.

 

[oneduke]

Hey Jim I sincerely appreciate your advise. I do have a 2005 40 D it is a hydro model. I do not see any mention of diodes in the manual , just going on what the mechanic said. I think I am just going to have them come and fix it. I dont have time, to mess with it. If I had more time, I could prob do it. A wife , two young kids, a business, lots of banjo pickin eats up my day.

I have , in the past , had mice in the console, maybe they chewed something?
Robert

 

[jinman]

Well Robert, sometimes it's best to have someone else look at it or at least back off for awhile and then come back later. If you have too many "irons in the fire" and need that tractor, calling the dealer might be best. I wish we could have solved the problem, but we gave it a good go anyhow.

I never took the time to :welcome: you to TBN and the forum. I hope you will continue to return and participate. Our blue community is strong here and there is certainly strength in numbers.

 

[oneduke]

Well , had the guy come and he found some burnt wires . He showed the wife but she cant show me where. The part I saw was a wire attached to a round disc about the size of a quarter. It had something to do with the fuel system too. I will quiz him and get back to you.
Robert

 

[oneduke]

Hey Guys I had a real mechanic come and fix my tractor. Here is what was wrong. The fuel cuttoff solenoid , or the wire that goes to it, shorted out. That made a dead short in the start up circuit. The PTO light was staying on, but there was no problem with it. On the fuse panel there is a big silver looking reset relay. It was clicking on and off, because i had short. That shorted out before the PTO light had a chance to go off, so the light just stayed on , which made me think it was the problem.
So , the moral of the story is check all the wiring and dont assume , like i did.
Once the fuel solenoid was replaced I am good to go.
Thank you for all your help. Special thanks to Jim who is a wealth of information. It's as simple as that :thumbsup:

 

[jinman]

Glad you are back in business, Robert. Well, in post #11 in this thread, I did suggest looking at the solenoid, but perhaps you overlooked that in your haste. Hey! I overlooked it too until I touched mine and it was very hot. When I unplugged it, the fuse quit blowing. It sounds like your tractor has already been upgraded to a circuit breaker instead of a fuse. That's a good thing.:thumbsup:

The fuel solenoid should only pull 1 amp of current, so anytime it pulls enough to pop the fuse/CB, it is needing replacement, even if it still appears to be working.

Now get out there and enjoy that tractor.