Storage building door recommendations

[adlertom]

I'm considering construction of a storage building - something in the 40 x 50 foot size range. One unusual thing that I want this building to have is a 40ish foot wide clear opening (like an aircraft hangar) on the 50 foot wide side of the structure. I also need the building to be reasonably tight i.e. mouse and critter resistant.

I'm assuming that a 40 foot wide overhead/garage-type door wouldn't be possible, as it wouldn't be able to support it's own weight, and sag/bend when opened in the horizontal position?

Sliding doors might work, but don't look like they would seal very effectively, plus the 50 foot long side of the building wouldn't be long enough for the doors to slide open along (unless maybe the track extended beyond the sidewalls?).

A bi-fold hangar (continuous horizontal hinge 1/2 way up the door)door looks like the best option, but I'm guessing that one of those would cost a lot more.

Two 20 foot wide solid swinging doors would be a bear to deal with, especially if there were snow on the ground. Maybe there's a fan-fold option of some kind?

I'm wondering if there are other door options to consider?

Has anyone priced a bi-fold door compared to another style? Wondering how much more expensive those really are?

 

[MossRoad]

I used to work at an airport, for about 6 years. Horizontal bi-fold doors are very doable in the size you're looking for. You lose a bit of the opening at the top, as the space is taken up by the door, so look into that before building.

Another hangar that we had, had three 15' overhead doors right next to each other, with the two vertical center tracks being removable. Those center tracks were aluminum, and had tracks on both the left and right side. There was a spring-loaded latch at the top that was operated by a chain pull on the center of the track, and a base on the bottom. You'd set the bottom of the post in the base and tip it forward until it latched. Very nice. That way you could open one, two or three doors to get trucks in and out, or, remove the posts and pull airplanes in or out.

Just be sure that there's interlocks on the latches that WORK. Ours did not, and once in a while, someone would push the close button with the track posts out. Yikes!

 

[MossRoad]

One question, though. Why would you want such a wide door if not a hangar? Large farm equipment?

 

[MossRoad]

I guess they're called swing-up post doors now. They are hinged at the top and latched at the bottoms.

 

[Diggin It]

Maybe there's a fan-fold option of some kind?

Is this what you mean by fan fold? Each panel would be about 10' wide. You might still have a snow issue though.

 

[ponytug]

Personally, I wouldn't do 20' swing doors in your neck of the woods; way too much wind. There would be days you couldn't safely open or shut the doors. I have never found horizontally sliding doors to be critter proof, and on windy days, they, too, can be a bear to work with.

Tilt up forty foot plus doors are common on farm shops that I know of. Makes it easy to drive a pair of combines in, or a cultivator that you don't want to unfold in the shop.

There is a price fo everything though.

Like @MossRoad I am a bit curious on the use case. Most folks here aren't up to the multi-combine/ 800HP cultivators size operation, though there are a handful...

All the best,

Peter

 

[adlertom]

One question, though. Why would you want such a wide door if not a hangar? Large farm equipment?

I'd like it to be potentially usable as a hangar in the future.

The post swing up door that @MossRoad shows is interesting. I wonder how weather/vermin tight the seal around that post is?

With an internet search, I did find a company that makes up to 40 foot wide overhead doors. I was surprised:

News: Latest Garage Door News

Enjoy staying up-to-date with the latest Amarr news and press releases.

www.amarr.com

 

[adlertom]

Is this what you mean by fan fold? Each panel would be about 10' wide. You might still have a snow issue though.

View attachment 714184

Yes, that was the general idea. There's a fire station near here that has doors something like this, mostly for the antique look.

And agree, there would still be a snow issue unless they folded into the building, which would of course lessen the interior space.

 

[oosik]

I don't think a building with such an opening can be totally "critter" proof. Mice, chipmunks & squirrels can go thru incredibly small openings. And the doors will not be the only point of access.

Do your best. Then began an active program of trapping or poisoning.

 

[EddieWalker]

I'm at a loss on how to do this and not spend a fortune. I can't even figure out how you will frame it so it will be able to support a door that big!!!! Is this going on the gable end with a truss above it? Will the truss be engineered to support the weight of a door that big? or will you rely on the walls to support the weight of a door? Something like this is a lot of fun to think about, but in the end, it's just too big of an opening to attempt to put a door on and expect it to last without spending a fortune.

I think you should consider doing it in three doors. Then it becomes simple, affordable, secure and strong.

 

[adlertom]

I'm at a loss on how to do this and not spend a fortune. I can't even figure out how you will frame it so it will be able to support a door that big!!!! Is this going on the gable end with a truss above it? Will the truss be engineered to support the weight of a door that big? or will you rely on the walls to support the weight of a door? Something like this is a lot of fun to think about, but in the end, it's just too big of an opening to attempt to put a door on and expect it to last without spending a fortune.

I think you should consider doing it in three doors. Then it becomes simple, affordable, secure and strong.

Constructing a building with that size opening isn't a big deal. There are all kinds of small aircraft hangars with 40 foot or even larger door openings. And yes, the door would be in the gable end with a properly sized truss above it.

For engineering the building, I think that the building weight, wind load, and snow load would be much larger factors than the door weight. The door(s) themselves are pretty light.

 

[EddieWalker]

I disagree. A regular garage with an 18 foot wide door has a )ot more issues then a 16 foot wide door. That extra 2 foot creates a lot more movement that has to be addressed. Every house that I've seen with a 18ft wide door has cracking at the corners. Its pretty much impossible to fix without rebuilding everything, and even then, I think cracking will still happen because of the amount of movement that big of an opening creates.

I worked in a hanger at the Oakland Airport in CA for quite awhile and the size of the metal for that opening was massive. Those where sliding doors that ran on a metal track. And they leaked like crazy and where constantly breaking from their weight.

There is a line where you make a massive jump in what it takes to create an opening in a building and not have issues. 16 feet is easy. 20 feet becomes challenging. 40 feet is beyond my experience. It's not something that I would attempt.

Just having the building open 40 feet without a door is creating a massive load on the walls. Trusses are easy. But keeping the walls from racking will require a significant ifican amount of engineering. If you make the opening the full width of the building, the building will fall over. I would guess tha for a 40 foot opening, you would need a significant amount of wall on each end to create a corner big enough to withstand movement. Again, this is way beyond my experience and only an engineer will be able to figure out.

 

[MossRoad]

Constructing a building with that size opening isn't a big deal. There are all kinds of small aircraft hangars with 40 foot or even larger door openings. And yes, the door would be in the gable end with a properly sized truss above it.

For engineering the building, I think that the building weight, wind load, and snow load would be much larger factors than the door weight. The door(s) themselves are pretty light.

From past experience, you need to get a building that's been checked by an engineer. Our hangars with single bi-fold horizontal doors were steel buildings with the huge steel I-beam type trusses and large concrete footings. The main concerns with them were wind when the door was moving. When closed, it would latch at the bottom corners, and there was large lever that you pulled to cable-operate several side latches to hook the edges of the door sections to the frame of the building. When open, there wasn't much sail area exposed to the wind. But when it wasn't latched, and moving up or down, the wind could catch it, and, as happened several times, the door would bow, then pop out of the building and flap around in the wind. It would definitely kill you if it hit you.

The hangars with the removable center posts for the 3 overhead doors were old wooden hangers, with huge wood arch trusses to support the roof and wall load.

We had one with probably a 100' X 16'high opening that had probably a dozen sliding doors that rolled on a rail at the bottom and a track at the top. Tracks at the bottom are a pain. They had to be swept of sand in the summer and scraped of snow and ice in the winter.

Then we had three rows of about 20-25 T-hangars. I think those were about 40' wide. They had sliding doors that were only suspended from above on tracks. I think there were 4-5 doors on each hangar as I remember. You had to slide them over your neighbor's doors to get your's open. The end rows had track suspended out past the end of the building.

 

[newbury]

I'd like it to be potentially usable as a hangar in the future.

<snip>

If he can afford an airplane he probably can afford a hangar

 

[adlertom]

While the debate on building construction and engineering is interesting, it's not the topic of my original post.

The airport down the road from me has about 100 hangars, all about the same size as my contemplated building, and all with clear-span door openings this wide or wider.

I will have a builder engineer and properly construct a building for me with a large clear-span opening. I don't foresee that being an issue.

I'm looking for information on DOOR options for this opening.

Thanks again for the earlier posts about what others have done or seen for wide DOORS.

 

[bigtiller]

Call some local garage door companies that also do commercial work. I don't know if anyone makes a 40 ft door. I have a 24ft wide door and I was told by their technician that bigger ones are available. Mine is 3" thick and closed cell foam insulated, the wind doesn't bother it.

My 24' door is mouse tight.

 

[EddieWalker]

Sorry, I misses the part about you having the building designed by an engineer. I would expect the engineer to tell you what your options are for the building based on what you are willing to spend.

From my experience at the airport, sliders will leak like crazy, require a lot of maintenance and ever keep anything out.

Swing type doors will be too cumbersome. I haven't seen any on homes that where not falling apart after a few years and that's for a 6 foot span. Bigger then that and you will have to support them with wheels.

The hydraulic folding doors are probably the best option to get a complete seal. It would be fun seeing what it takes to build it.

 

[Diggin It]

I'm looking for information on DOOR options for this opening.

Another thought. You've no doubt seen those roll up security doors on stores and commercial buildings? Instead of rolling up overhead, what about rolling to each side? The roller mechanism would be standing vertically at either side of the opening, each retracting a 20' section. Tracks at the top and bottom would keep it aligned. No snow issues.

No idea of cost, but that doesn't seem to be part of the question.

 

[MossRoad]

Another thought. You've no doubt seen those roll up security doors on stores and commercial buildings? Instead of rolling up overhead, what about rolling to each side? The roller mechanism would be standing vertically at either side of the opening, each retracting a 20' section. Tracks at the top and bottom would keep it aligned. No snow issues.

No idea of cost, but that doesn't seem to be part of the question.

You ever unroll too much toilet paper, then roll it back up. Fine. Now unroll too much toilet paper and then turn the roll on it's side and try and roll it up.

You'd need tracks at top and bottom, and some sort of tensioner to keep it on the roll since by putting it on its side, we've eliminated gravity to keep tension on it.

 

[civilian]

You ever unroll too much toilet paper, then roll it back up. Fine. Now unroll too much toilet paper and then turn the roll on it's side and try and roll it up.

You'd need tracks at top and bottom, and some sort of tensioner to keep it on the roll since by putting it on its side, we've eliminated gravity to keep tension on it.

I would think a cable tension system could be used in the track grooves. As the right door opens, cables at the top and ground levels keep tension on the lending edge from the left side. Then those cables could actually pull the door closed. Same for the other side. Just an idea. Not sure if any company makes them, though. Jon