Strongest Korean brand

[grm61]

Compare the Kubota and Kioti tractor/engine models that have a 83mm bore and a stroke of 92.4mm.

On the Kioti side I'm talking about the 4A200LWH engine found in the DK40. There may be others, I'm just picking this one.

This engine has the same bore and stroke as the engines found in the Kubota L 3200, 3800, and 4600s

That's the same engine displacement and internal piston movement down to a 10th of a millimeter, there can be no accidental coincidence of same internal combustion engineering.

Honestly I don't know which company or country came up with the bore and stroke first. You could say Kubota copied Kioti and I have no evidence to back it up, but lets be real, there is Japanese engineering and drivetrain components in most of these Korean brand tractors, and Japanese companies like Yanmar, Mitsubishi, and probably others are profiting from it. I'm did not say outsourcing drivetrain components to Japan makes a Korean tractor less of a tractor, but it does it play into the bigger picture when comparing brands and reading claims in threads like these that Korean tractors are built as good as Japanese brands and are cheaper to buy to boot.

What's the matter with you? To much Snowshoe Grog?:laughing:
Your information is inaccurate, and even if it was correct, bore and stroke means nothing, other than, a way to come up with a certain displacement.
Its got nothing to do with quality. valve arrangement and porting, bearing size, oiling method, compression ratio, quality of materials etc...

Yanmar builds a fine tractor, My Dad has a 96 JD 970 that he bought new that was built for JD by Yanmar, 2300 or so hrs on it..great tractor.
Kioti also builds a very nice piece, every bit as good as Yanmar IMO, Any more they are good actually, leaving out the Chinese rigs as a step down.. it really just boils down to what color you like, what fits you best, and your price point.

Not sure what flipped your switch but I'll guarantee my DK45 is every bit the tractor your Yanmar is...Nice rig by the way

 

[Katahdin]

It seems I misread and misstated a table off a Kubota pdf, my bad, I apologize for that but I can still make a case Kioti could be copying Kubota engine designs. And yes, I realize most tractor engines are going to have an undersquare ratio (Yanmar is a notable exception with a nearly square design), but similar ratios do not mean the bore and stroke measurements have to be exactly the same. Let me address Gmanbart's points:

"Kubota L3200 has a 3-cylinder engine of 1.5L with 83x92.4mm bore and stroke."
* I'm going to suggest Kioti borrowed the Kubota 3 cylinder engine design and add a fourth cylinder to gain extra horsepower for the DK40.

"Kubota L3800 has a 3-cylinder engine of 1.8L with 87x102.4mm bore and stroke."
* You'll find a 4 cylinder version in the DK50SE.

Kubota L4600 has a 4-cylinder engine of 2.2L with 87x92.4mm bore and stroke.
* There is a 3 cylinder engine with the same specs in the CK-35

Moving on now to current models:
"The current Kioti NX series have 1.8L with 87x102mm bore and stroke."
* I think you mean a 102.4 mm stroke. Yes, Kubota used a 4 cylinder version in the M4800SU
TractorData.com Kubota M4800SU tractor engine information
http://www.kubotaengine.com/assets/documents/24_v2403mt_27.pdf

Clearly there is a pattern and relationship between Kubota and Kioti engine designs.

 

[Katahdin]

What's the matter with you? To much Snowshoe Grog?:laughing:
Your information is inaccurate, and even if it was correct, bore and stroke means nothing, other than, a way to come up with a certain displacement.
Its got nothing to do with quality. valve arrangement and porting, bearing size, oiling method, compression ratio, quality of materials etc...

Ha!

You make great points. I would love to see a Kubota and Kioti engine with the same bore and stroke dissected so those components could be compared.

 

[paulfun9]

Fact of the matter is If I want to build a normally aspirated engine that has specific torque and HP curves weather it be diesel or gas it will have to have certain rod ratios based on stroke and bore to attain them. This in turn means that in many circumstances an engine size from many manufactures will have similar strokes and bores and even those that don't have that will have many other things in common because the expected performance from the consumer demands the outcome be a usable product for the intended use.
You can understand this better by building two theoretical engines. Lets say one is a 2110 cc with a bore of 90.5mm and a stroke of 82mm compared with an other engine which by most would be considered a 2110 when the numbers are rounded which uses a bore of 94mm and a stroke of 76mm. Both engines will run fine but they will both have different rod ratios and produce a different torque curve even if the camshafts are identical in duration. One engine will be much more user friendly and have a broader torque curve than the other. So what you are saying is that because a given formula which would bring an engine builder/designer to suggest a certain bore/stroke would be Ideal to attain the needed power to make their customers happy is similar to a competitors is reason to insinuate a copied design? If this is true then every single 2 liter engine built over the last century is simply a copy of the former. When in fact its simply coincidence of a basic engine technology and simple mathematics that demands with common building practices that your engine should be an approximate size with an approximate bore and stroke to attain an approximate torque and HP curve to attain a happy customer!
Read between the lines and this simply states that your argument is about as strong as saying Kioti is a copy cat of all who came before them simply because they chose to power their equipment with a diesel engine rather than figure out a new never heard of fuel to power their machines! Not very likely you would have any luck with that would you?

 

[MinnesotaEric]

Let's take the internet time machine back to 2007. Steve Jobs just released the iPhone and nobody cared that Daedong, parent company of Kioti, was expanding its engine plant.

2007/07/23 13026
Daedong announced a new investment plan for engine facilities.
The purpose of this investment is to enlarge the engine capacity to prepare future business increase.
The total investment budget is USD 37,576,439 for the full product capacity of 48,000 Engines from current 20,000 Engines, which is planned to be accomplished by the end of May 2006.
Daedong is very aggressive on investing and propulsion for future business and this activities will make a good and beneficial result in the future.

Meanwhile, a guy can buy a complete Daedong engine. Kioti Engine 22 HP| 49HP » H&M Equipment, New York

And Daedong also makes nine different sized industrial marine engines as well as stationary generator engines.

Which is to say that Daedong has their own thing going on.

Read more about Daedong's Marine division d/b/a Daedong Marine Tech Inc. and their 500hp marine engines. daedong marine tech

 

[Grant1]

Kioti all the way. I have owned 3 in the past 8 years and still have 2 of them. Dollar for dollar they are the best value IMHO. Over 2000 hours on them with no major problems

 

[TSO]

It seems I misread and misstated a table off a Kubota pdf, my bad, I apologize for that but I can still make a case Kioti could be copying Kubota engine designs. And yes, I realize most tractor engines are going to have an undersquare ratio (Yanmar is a notable exception with a nearly square design), but similar ratios do not mean the bore and stroke measurements have to be exactly the same. Let me address Gmanbart's points:

"Kubota L3200 has a 3-cylinder engine of 1.5L with 83x92.4mm bore and stroke."
* I'm going to suggest Kioti borrowed the Kubota 3 cylinder engine design and add a fourth cylinder to gain extra horsepower for the DK40.

"Kubota L3800 has a 3-cylinder engine of 1.8L with 87x102.4mm bore and stroke."
* You'll find a 4 cylinder version in the DK50SE.

Kubota L4600 has a 4-cylinder engine of 2.2L with 87x92.4mm bore and stroke.
* There is a 3 cylinder engine with the same specs in the CK-35

Moving on now to current models:
"The current Kioti NX series have 1.8L with 87x102mm bore and stroke."
* I think you mean a 102.4 mm stroke. Yes, Kubota used a 4 cylinder version in the M4800SU
TractorData.com Kubota M4800SU tractor engine information
http://www.kubotaengine.com/assets/documents/24_v2403mt_27.pdf

Clearly there is a pattern and relationship between Kubota and Kioti engine designs.

The Mitsubishi engine in my LS was a 2.2L 4cyl. The Iseki diesel in my Massey is a 2.2L 4cyl. Were those Kubota copies also?

 

[TomSeller]

I am actually surprised that Kubota doesn't sell their engines into other tractor brands that don't make their own. They sell them into other heavy equipment, so I don't know why not other tractors. I do think they make an excellent engine.

 

[eagle628]

I am actually surprised that Kubota doesn't sell their engines into other tractor brands that don't make their own. They sell them into other heavy equipment, so I don't know why not other tractors. I do think they make an excellent engine.

We have three Bobcats with Kubota engines. The youngest one is 3500 hours, the oldest is just shy of 8000, and they all run great. Solid engines.

 

[Poopdeck Pappy]

The Mitsubishi engine in my LS was a 2.2L 4cyl. The Iseki diesel in my Massey is a 2.2L 4cyl. Were those Kubota copies also?

Exactly. And it's possible that Mitsubishi, Iseki and/or Daedong were making their 2.2L 4cyl. engines before Kubota made theirs.