Student Loan Debt?

[milkman636]

Whoa! That's outrageous. Purdue told us to expect about $88K for 4 years about 13 years ago. Today they say about $91K. We got out much less than that total cost, before scholarships. More like around $72K before scholarships. Both of our kids chose the least expensive dorm options, lower meal plans, and moved into apartments for their junior and senior years. That's in-state.

Out of state was more than double that.

Indiana University is saying around $109K in-state.

Michigan State is saying average of $30K per year before aid, and $10K average with aid.

Michigan is about $3K more before aid and $7K more after aid.

Paying for out of state tuition for us was not an option. We told the kids if they wanted to go out of state, we'd give them the same amount we planned for had they gone in-state, and they'd have to take out loans for the rest.

I've mentioned before, oldest was set on Wisconsin. Wisconsin financial planners asked her why? Told her the same program was available and several Indiana schools for less than half the cost. If she was dead set on a Wisconsin degree, to got to Indiana schools for 3 years and then transfer to Wisconsin for last year. She laid it all out on paper, and the kid finally got it. Wife and I wanted to hug that lady!

The 2024 Michigan in-state tuition figures for schools that are interested in having my son on the roster are all higher than the published out-of-state tuition at the D1 school in Kentucky that is recruiting him. Housing and meal plans there are also less expensive, and they have a beautiful campus setting. If we were simply paying out of pocket it would be cheaper to go there than Central Michigan University, which is the closest comparable school to us.

We’ve also visited a school in both Ohio and Indiana that are offering him a spot and have lower published tuition costs than the interested schools in Michigan.

In a couple weeks we are also heading to a smaller school in Kansas that is offering him a substantial football scholarship. It’s a school we never heard of before their coach reached out. He’s been communicative and the program sounds interesting enough that my younger son wants to tag along too. The further we get from home the better the deals seem to be getting. That distance from home would also add some extra cost back into the equation, but it sounds like something we need to see and evaluate firsthand.

When I added up all the costs for going to these schools, and factored in an expected annual increase of 3.5%, I come up with an average figure that was around $185,000 for a student with zero discounts, grants, scholarships, or subsidies. I threw out the $200,000 figure because it’s a nice round number and experience tells me that my kids will cost more than expected.

 

[hiddentacocatneddih]

My degree cost $30,000 in 2017

Thankfully it was 100% tax payer funded

 

[MossRoad]

The 2024 Michigan in-state tuition figures for schools that are interested in having my son on the roster are all higher than the published out-of-state tuition at the D1 school in Kentucky that is recruiting him. Housing and meal plans there are also less expensive, and they have a beautiful campus setting. If we were simply paying out of pocket it would be cheaper to go there than Central Michigan University, which is the closest comparable school to us.

We’ve also visited a school in both Ohio and Indiana that are offering him a spot and have lower published tuition costs than the interested schools in Michigan.

In a couple weeks we are also heading to a smaller school in Kansas that is offering him a substantial football scholarship. It’s a school we never heard of before their coach reached out. He’s been communicative and the program sounds interesting enough that my younger son wants to tag along too. The further we get from home the better the deals seem to be getting. That distance from home would also add some extra cost back into the equation, but it sounds like something we need to see and evaluate firsthand.

When I added up all the costs for going to these schools, and factored in an expected annual increase of 3.5%, I come up with an average figure that was around $185,000 for a student with zero discounts, grants, scholarships, or subsidies. I threw out the $200,000 figure because it’s a nice round number and experience tells me that my kids will cost more than expected.

As I recall, our youngest was very interested in Michigan State. After financial assistance, their out-of-state offer came down to match the in-state offer from Purdue, which was going to be around $22K per year total before any discounts. So they basically evened the field between Indiana in-state and Michigan out-of-state costs.

However, as I mentioned before, she got a generous scholarship from a Purdue alum and made some quick personal connections at the Purdue Biology Dept., so her choice was pretty clear.

After the scholarship, it was down to a $17K per year cost. Between our $5K per year gift to her, the 529 College Savings Plan we started when she was born, and her working in high school and during college, she got out debt free. She even has some money left in that 529. Purdue was very affordable for in-state, even without the scholarship. Indiana University and Indiana State were also very affordable, but no vet programs.

That was 4 years ago. Since, she's gotten married, hubby graduates vet school this spring, and she starts vet school in the fall. That cost is almost 100% on them, not us. Although she still has a modest amount in her 529.

 

[Hay Dude]

The 2024 Michigan in-state tuition figures for schools that are interested in having my son on the roster are all higher than the published out-of-state tuition at the D1 school in Kentucky that is recruiting him. Housing and meal plans there are also less expensive, and they have a beautiful campus setting. If we were simply paying out of pocket it would be cheaper to go there than Central Michigan University, which is the closest comparable school to us.

We’ve also visited a school in both Ohio and Indiana that are offering him a spot and have lower published tuition costs than the interested schools in Michigan.

In a couple weeks we are also heading to a smaller school in Kansas that is offering him a substantial football scholarship. It’s a school we never heard of before their coach reached out. He’s been communicative and the program sounds interesting enough that my younger son wants to tag along too. The further we get from home the better the deals seem to be getting. That distance from home would also add some extra cost back into the equation, but it sounds like something we need to see and evaluate firsthand.

When I added up all the costs for going to these schools, and factored in an expected annual increase of 3.5%, I come up with an average figure that was around $185,000 for a student with zero discounts, grants, scholarships, or subsidies. I threw out the $200,000 figure because it’s a nice round number and experience tells me that my kids will cost more than expected.

You are not going to like hearing this, and there’s a lot more to explain than I can type here with my fat fingers….

One of my kids was recruited to play D-1 lacrosse from a smallish D-1 school and after 2 years was sick of it. Not much campus life, no big time college football games or parties. Not much going on “in town”, either. Basically all he had was his team mates and a girl he met sophomore year. Highlights of the season were playing AWAY games against Johns Hopkins, UVA, etc.
Once the season was over, there was basically nothing to do. At first I didn’t believe him, but after about my 20th visit, I realized he was right. After his junior year, he came to me and my wife and begged to leave. He was burned out and wanted to go to another school that had a lively large-school-feel campus. We made an agreement that he would pay the 4th & 5th year loss of his scholarship to walk-on at another school. Luckily, it all worked out. The larger school was actually a lot cheaper and gave him money.

My other kid got recruited to a much bigger, more fun school. If things weren’t going well on her team, there was always the campus life. When I visited, there was a remarkable number of things to do, to fall back on.

I don’t know your son, but if he’s “all sports all the time” then he might be fine on a smaller D-1 program campus. Just be sure to have that talk with him. It’ll surprise you how much YOU think your kids love their sports, but you also need to realize they need “down-time” and they want to party and meet new people, have fun, etc.
My kids didn’t tell me that.

Hope you aren’t offended by what I am saying. I have been through the “mill” twice with high level college sports and the BEST day is the day your kid gets recruited. With the exception of being a freshman starter on a BIG TIME program, hate to say it, but theres a lot of downhill days afterwards.

I can give you a lot of ”sage advice” on kids & college sports. Much different than when my wife and I played in college.

 

[paulsharvey]

I'm not sure I'm on the same page about 'enjoying' college; I look at it as a job, that you pay to go to, and the quicker you get out, the quicker you stop paying them, and start getting paid for your time. No way it heck I would subsidize my kids party school. I also acknowledge it's not that way for everyone; but college is Way to expensive to do it for 'fun'.

 

[milkman636]

You are not going to like hearing this, and there’s a lot more to explain than I can type here with my fat fingers….

One of my kids was recruited to play D-1 lacrosse from a smallish D-1 school and after 2 years was sick of it. Not much campus life, no big time college football games or parties. Not much going on “in town”, either. Basically all he had was his team mates and a girl he met sophomore year. Highlights of the season were playing AWAY games against Johns Hopkins, UVA, etc.
Once the season was over, there was basically nothing to do. At first I didn’t believe him, but after about my 20th visit, I realized he was right. After his junior year, he came to me and my wife and begged to leave. He was burned out and wanted to go to another school that had a lively large-school-feel campus. We made an agreement that he would pay the 4th & 5th year loss of his scholarship to walk-on at another school. Luckily, it all worked out. The larger school was actually a lot cheaper and gave him money.

My other kid got recruited to a much bigger, more fun school. If things weren’t going well on her team, there was always the campus life. When I visited, there was a remarkable number of things to do, to fall back on.

I don’t know your son, but if he’s “all sports all the time” then he might be fine on a smaller D-1 program campus. Just be sure to have that talk with him. It’ll surprise you how much YOU think your kids love their sports, but you also need to realize they need “down-time” and they want to party and meet new people, have fun, etc.
My kids didn’t tell me that.

Hope you aren’t offended by what I am saying. I have been through the “mill” twice with high level college sports and the BEST day is the day your kid gets recruited. With the exception of being a freshman starter on a BIG TIME program, hate to say it, but theres a lot of downhill days afterwards.

I can give you a lot of ”sage advice” on kids & college sports. Much different than when my wife and I played in college.

I appreciate your input on this. It’s completely new for me. My wife played basketball for a small NAIA school on partial scholarship. She had an easy decision because other members of her family went there and it was her first choice in schools.

Myself, I was a two-way starter on a mediocre, small, rural high school football team. Nobody I played with even knew that recruiting existed. We really didn’t know how those guys ended up on TV. It was also necessary for me to work and pay my own way after my dad’s employer of 27 years folded when I was a senior in high school. My folks were scrambling to find their own way. I simply picked a college I could drive to and started grinding away and working as much as I could between classes. It was not fun times and not great memories, so I get what you are saying. I want this all to be a memorable and happy experience that he can share with his kids someday without regrets. I want his experience to be better than mine.

The D1 school is actually a little concerning for me. As a numbers guy, I picked up on the fact that they have more than 30% of their scholarships available to hand out this year. That makes me wonder about the attrition rate and causes? What percentage of freshman players with scholarships go on to complete a degree? We were so enamored with the scale of the place and the fact that their games are on ESPN that we didn’t think to ask some of these types of questions. Our visit was like the first date with a pretty girl. The mind starts to focus more on the visible parts while she’s standing right in front of you, and you don’t want to find any downside. On a related note, one of the big selling points for my son is that school has almost a 2:1 female to male student population on campus.

My favorite coach so far is at the D3 school we visited last weekend. That coach says he’s there because he wants to be there coaching and he’s not going anywhere. He wants players that want to play football because they love football, and chose that school because it’s right for their future. He told my son that in 10 years it won’t matter a bit whether or not he played college football. That coach’s big offer was the experience of playing on a competitive team with a winning record. And he said that every player on the roster will actually play at least two quarters of real game time during the season. The school gives free admission to all students for athletic events so they have a great crowd. They also have a steady history of increasing enrollment and have visibly been investing in their campus facilities. They claim their graduates have a 99.5% employment rate within 6 months of completing a degree. Even after reflecting back on the day we spent there I can say it is the best example of how things should be that I’ve seen so far. But, they will not be offering football scholarships. He may qualify for some other programs they have though now that he’s actually applied and been accepted.

He’s now applied to and been accepted at 4 of the schools we’ve visited so far, and opted to pass on two others. We still have 2 more to go see before mid-March. By then the FAFSA stuff will hopefully be determined and we can get a final picture of costs for each option. My understanding is that we’ll get some rating that the school can use to build a custom package for him based on whatever type of voodoo they perform in their financial offices. In the meantime I’m encouraging him to do his best to stay in contact with the coaches he likes and hopefully keep the options open. I gave him the lead on that figuring he’ll reach out most to the one he really wants to play for.

This is definitely not a simple process like they show in movies. In real life the coaches seem to have multiple viable candidates for each roster spot at every level. I’m kinda seeing them as being like professional bass fisherman. They lure more fish into the boat than they need and then keep the best ones for weigh-in.

 

[hiddentacocatneddih]

You guys have said a lot about the sports program but almost nothing about the academics

Like which area of study and how that part of the school actually performs.

College job placement statistics are useless. Just marketing crap.

I would tell your kids start freshman year finding internships and peruse them. Get in with an employer early. If they like them enough they may pick up the college bill even

 

[Hay Dude]

I appreciate your input on this. It’s completely new for me. My wife played basketball for a small NAIA school on partial scholarship. She had an easy decision because other members of her family went there and it was her first choice in schools.

Myself, I was a two-way starter on a mediocre, small, rural high school football team. Nobody I played with even knew that recruiting existed. We really didn’t know how those guys ended up on TV. It was also necessary for me to work and pay my own way after my dad’s employer of 27 years folded when I was a senior in high school. My folks were scrambling to find their own way. I simply picked a college I could drive to and started grinding away and working as much as I could between classes. It was not fun times and not great memories, so I get what you are saying. I want this all to be a memorable and happy experience that he can share with his kids someday without regrets. I want his experience to be better than mine.

The D1 school is actually a little concerning for me. As a numbers guy, I picked up on the fact that they have more than 30% of their scholarships available to hand out this year. That makes me wonder about the attrition rate and causes? What percentage of freshman players with scholarships go on to complete a degree? We were so enamored with the scale of the place and the fact that their games are on ESPN that we didn’t think to ask some of these types of questions. Our visit was like the first date with a pretty girl. The mind starts to focus more on the visible parts while she’s standing right in front of you, and you don’t want to find any downside. On a related note, one of the big selling points for my son is that school has almost a 2:1 female to male student population on campus.

My favorite coach so far is at the D3 school we visited last weekend. That coach says he’s there because he wants to be there coaching and he’s not going anywhere. He wants players that want to play football because they love football, and chose that school because it’s right for their future. He told my son that in 10 years it won’t matter a bit whether or not he played college football. That coach’s big offer was the experience of playing on a competitive team with a winning record. And he said that every player on the roster will actually play at least two quarters of real game time during the season. The school gives free admission to all students for athletic events so they have a great crowd. They also have a steady history of increasing enrollment and have visibly been investing in their campus facilities. They claim their graduates have a 99.5% employment rate within 6 months of completing a degree. Even after reflecting back on the day we spent there I can say it is the best example of how things should be that I’ve seen so far. But, they will not be offering football scholarships. He may qualify for some other programs they have though now that he’s actually applied and been accepted.

He’s now applied to and been accepted at 4 of the schools we’ve visited so far, and opted to pass on two others. We still have 2 more to go see before mid-March. By then the FAFSA stuff will hopefully be determined and we can get a final picture of costs for each option. My understanding is that we’ll get some rating that the school can use to build a custom package for him based on whatever type of voodoo they perform in their financial offices. In the meantime I’m encouraging him to do his best to stay in contact with the coaches he likes and hopefully keep the options open. I gave him the lead on that figuring he’ll reach out most to the one he really wants to play for.

This is definitely not a simple process like they show in movies. In real life the coaches seem to have multiple viable candidates for each roster spot at every level. I’m kinda seeing them as being like professional bass fisherman. They lure more fish into the boat than they need and then keep the best ones for weigh-in.

College coaches are salesmen. Period.
Sure, they know how to coach a sport, but they are going after our kids for a reason.
I was told my son would get significant playing time as a freshman, but he only played sparingly. My daughter was promised nothing but played a lot.
We chose D-1 for the money. D-3 pays nothing, but is usually a better, albeit smaller experience. One of the D-3 schools that made an offer to my son was a great choice for him, but he wanted the D-1 notariety.

Another thing to consider are injuries, especially concussions. Bothe sports and the classroom are affected. Both my kids got them and it seemed like 50% of their teammates. My daughters teammate had one this past semester and flunked a class.

Remember, this is a 30 hour per week “job” that they must succeed at along with their 15 credit course load.

 

[kenmbz]

My son is National Honors and we will try and see if he can get a scholarship there and other academic ones.
Trying to figure out how to go about this, but at least NH has links to start the process.

 

[MossRoad]

I'll mention this... they tell you the deadline for applying is March 31 (or whatever date they tell you). Get your stuff in WAAAAYYYY before that. As soon as admissions open, get those things in. Do not wait.