Submersible well pump went out, thoughts?

repete · Dec 12, 2022

QRTRHRS said:
O' yes. I was part of a crew that pulled 400 feet of galvanized with a backhoe and a clamp to keep the pipe from dropping as we unscrewed each section. Great stuff!

I still have my clamp hanging on the barn wall.

Lift it, clamp it, unscrew it and repeat the process.

rangerfredbob · Dec 12, 2022

Oh, my setup is pretty thorough, not saying there isn't an issue with the pipe out of the pump, it does not hold pressure between the pump and the check valve just after the well. Anyway, after the well casing there's a stainless check valve, a flow restrictor, then a centrifugal sand filter with auto drain cycle (sand wore out the seals, need to address that but those things are dumb expensive...), then goes to the pressure tank (says 84 gal total capacity, it's over 5' tall), then a sock filter, then a pleated filter, then the water softener then a 5 micron filter then to the house...

If there's a problem with the outlet pipe I'd be fine with that but I'm not going through the trouble of pulling the pump without a replacement on hand, the current pump has digested several cubic feet of sand and several cubic feet of silt. I'll look into the details of the well drilling that I have and judge based on the water level and such and might pull the pump a little higher to get out of the silt layer...

Today I went to Home Depot and got a new pump, I liked it better than the option from Lowes, also picked up some name brand electrical tape and a torque arrestor for good measure... oh and a splice kit since I don't have barrel crimps and that much good glue heat shrink on hand...

cqaigy2 · Dec 13, 2022

Sounds like you have a plan. I'm interested to see what you find.

airbiscuit · Dec 13, 2022

There is some pretty good discussion here.

My Industrial Cabin Build

deezler said:
So... can you guys help me understand this? You buy a cycle stop valve so that... your well pump has to run twice as much? Basically any time you have more than a glass of water, your well pump is running continuously if you have a tap open?

Just to avoid the 40 to 60 psi swing of a normal pressure tank setup? But then if your power goes out... you have no reserve pressurized water.

What am I missing, this doesn't make any sense to me. I have zero issues with the 40 to 58 psi swing at my house... can hardly notice. Our 40 gallon pressure tank supplies many gallons of water before the well pump has to run one cycle.

Valveman said:
Pumps like to run. They are made to run 24/7/365. They last longer when running continuously than when cycling on and off. Again, you can use any size tank you want with a CSV. But normally any larger than 10 gallon size is just wasting money and space. Your 40 gallon tank holds 10 gallons of water. Without a Cycle Stop Valve your pump cycles on/off for every 10 gallons used. For a house that uses 300 gallons a day, that would be 30 cycles per day. The 4.5 gallon size tank with a CSV will cycle the same 30 times a day. A pump can survive a long time with just 30 cycles a day. But turn on a sprinkler, fill a pond or pool, run a drip system, or even have multiple people taking multiple long showers and 30 cycles a day can turn into 300 cycles per day, which isn't good. When running water for a long time the CSV makes the pump keep running, which is good. The CSV turns 300 cycles into 1 cycle, even with the small tank. Your well pump running continuously as long as water is being used is a good thing. I have a stock water well that hasn't turned off in almost 20 years so far. It will last much longer than my house well that has the small tank and cycles 30 times a day. But when I am running my garden drip system or a yard sprinkler, the pump is already running and using water in the house doesn't add a single cycle. So, my pump only cycles 30 times a day when I am not irrigating or using water elsewhere, then it doesn't even cycle once a day. It just stays running until I turn all the water off.

You don't have any "reserve water" in a 40 gallon pressure tank anyway. It would only be full and have 10 gallons in it if it had shut off at 60 PSI just before the power went off. Otherwise you have no control of if having 10 gallons or 1 gallon in it when the power goes off. Murphy's law says it will always be at 41 PSI and only have 1 gallon of water in it when the power goes off. If you want reserve water, put a couple of 5 gallon water jugs in a closet for small amounts and get a generator for long power outages.

You can "hardly notice" the pressure bouncing from 40 to 58 when in the shower because you have never had constant pressure. The difference in strong constant pressure and a 40/60 swing is tremendous. By using a CSV to hold the pressure at a constant 50 the entire time the shower is on, you won't even need soap.

The Cycle Stop Valve is designed to solve all the problems caused by pump cycling. Some of the things destroyed by cycling the pump include the pressure switch, start capacitor, start relay, check valve, pump, motor, as well as other things. Cycling the pump also surges the well, which can stir up sediment and even cause contamination issues. Cycling the pump causes sprinklers to shoot out far and then close, instead of hitting the right spot every time around, as well as pressure fluctuation in the house and shower. If you are not having any of these problems, you don't need a Cycle Stop Valve. But then again, why would you not want a Cycle Stop Valve and never have to experience these problems?

It is one of those things that if you have never tried it, you don't know what you are missing. If you don't like it for any reason I will take it back. But in 30 years no one has ever sent one back. The CSV is an easy adder to a 40 gallon size tank. That way you get the best of both worlds. But is a short time you will come to understand the 40 gallon tank is 10 times larger than needed with a CSV.

Hay Dude · Dec 13, 2022

Sorry to hear about your water pump.

Mine usually goes out (or sometimes electric or heat) on Christmas or Thanksgiving.

Fuddyduddy1952 · Dec 13, 2022

Hay Dude said:
Sorry to hear about your water pump.

Mine usually goes out (or sometimes electric or heat) on Christmas or Thanksgiving.

Everything bad happens on Friday right after 5pm to me, doctors office closed until Monday morning as are plumbers, electricians, etc.
Crazy why that is.

Loaderman22 · Dec 15, 2022

My water just stopped one day, it was a combination of things, but it turned out the main reason was the wires were grinding against the inside of the well casing which was wearing them thin and that was causing the low flow and eventually loss of power. Got pump at HD My pump is down 380' and me, my dad, and a buddy pulled it ourselves. Just had to buy some pipe to thread into where the pipe attaches to side of the well casing about 4feet down for frost. Pipe down to well pump was white PVC in 20' sections and it cracked just about every other joint when we took it out. Found broken wires at about 200' down, but it didn't make sense to stop there so we pulled the entire thing. Old pump was 1/4 horse, 5 gal per min. New pump is 3 wire 1/2 horse 5 gal per min. Bought 400' of black ABS plastic pipe, 3 spools of wire, new rubber isolators (they keep pump wire/pipe off walls) electrical tape, new pull rope, and hose clamps. Ran new wires (with ground this time) since I could see where wires were rubbing in other spots as well. ABS goes over pump barb then double hose clamped, then electrical tape over hose clamps so they don't snag, added new rope to replace the 30 year old fiberglass rope since it was disintegrating. Slowly dropped it back down and taped the wire to ABS every 4-5 feet to keep it off the sides. Added more rubber isolaters while we dropped it. ABS was much easier to drop since it flexed and should outlast me. Got it all back in place, then snaked ground wire through underground conduit and into the house. Replaced wire connections with all new wire connectors and tucked under and reinstalled well cap. then went inside and ran ground all the way back to pressure switch. Then drained silt out of pressure tank, found a couple pieces of rubber in the silt so I knew bladder was broken also. Changed tank and pressure switch. Switch is only like $30, & I did all this other work, made sense to do it to along with new black iron pipes between them. Don't use galvanized or bare lead here unless you used to eat paint chips, the damage is already done. Had some clogging in the nipple under switch. Made all my connections and fired it up. Worked great about 5 years then same problem. Pulled pump again and this time replaced it with a better 3/4 horse 8 gal per minute pump. This time I went to a local pro supply house and got a replacement pump because the local HD & Lowe's only carry spec house cheap pumps. It was coming on way to often and would take forever to fill tank. Learned my lesson that you get what you pay for....

jaybo77862 · Dec 15, 2022

Years ago I experienced the low pressure with my well. The pump was running but when we pulled the well we found a crack in one of the pipe joints that basically kept the well from fully pressurizing. It was a simple fix once we found the crack. We did have to pull the pump, all 300 feet of it.

tigermaple · Dec 15, 2022

rangerfredbob said:
The water pressure dropped sometime last week so I finally looked into it today and the pressure tank is fine, pressure switch is fine but it would only get to 30psi and the pump was running constant so I went further up the line and found a piece of teflon in the flow restrictor, thought it was from the check valve, nope... I do have a sand problem (or did for a few years after I moved in) so the pump apparently can't make pressure anymore and lost a part of it... I bought the house in '14 and the well was put in the year before that so it isn't that old, the well is around 100' deep if memory serves. I lowered the pressure switch setpoint so it turns off at 30psi and on at 20 so it's at least not running constantly anymore...

So, I know I gotta get a new pump, current is a 3/4hp 4" 3 wire unit since it has a control box and I checked and it has 3 wires plus ground... Home Depot has a pump for $479, Lowes has one for $469, Amazon has them for $200 on up... Which way would you go?

If it was installed in '13 is it likely iron pipe or plastic? The roof panel on the pump house is easy to get off so I'm not worried about that. I didn't think of pulling the cap off the tube when I had the check valve off...

#1 Your pump is too big for only 100', 1/2 HP is all you need.
#2 You say you had a sand problem, bet the tank and the pressure switch supply tube is full of sand.