Submersible Well Pump

[whistlepig]

Our water pressure is dropping off. I suspect our 13 year old submersible well pump is getting long in the tooth. I'm not sure how many years these pumps are supposed to last. We are going to give the plumber a call to take a look. Any suggestions on a new submersible, good or bad, would be appreciated.

 

[JD5210]

You will need to determine how deep your well is to determine how big a pump you need ie hp. Many pumps are 10 gallons a minute.

On pressure, what is your switch a 40/60 or 30/50? If 30/50 I would upgrade to a 40/60, this info is on the inside of the switchs cover. If you replace the switch check the small tube under the switch, sometimes it fills up with stuff.

How is the pressure when the pressure tank is full? If the pressure is low then, it is not the pump. What is the condition of you pressure tank? Turn off the pump, let the water run out of the tank, then gentle rock the tank back and forth, if you hear water going back and forth, this means the bladder is bad and that could be your problem. If you hear nothing good time to test the pressure in the bladder, since the tank is empty.

Since there is no filter and there should NOT be one, between the tank and pump, your pressure tank could be getting full of stuff. For me about every 5 years, I drain the pressure tank (valve at bottom), then turn on the pump, letting the water rush in to stir up things at the bottom and keep repeating this until the water comes out clean.

 

[whistlepig]

The pressure tank is holding at 45 pounds. I don't think the bladder is water logged. In my experience the pump runs continuously when the bladder is bad. The pump seems to start and stop like it is supposed to. Just no pressure or water volume when the pump is running.

 

[ryer]

Whistlepig,I just replaced mine (teel brand) it had 14 yrs on it,the one before that was a brand called Myers and it lasted about 10 years.A buddy in the waterwell business recommended a brand called Grundfos,it ran me about $850.00 for pump(1.5 hp 16 gal. min) and control box.Ryer

 

[JimRB]

You need to read the pressure on the pressure tank when the pump is off after high cut off and what it reads just as it turns on. My water loggged tank let the pump short cycle.

The last place were rented had a deep well pump that had to be at least 20 years old. We would run that 24 hours a day for weeks on end to water pastures. At that place we had corrosion inside the pipes causing the pressure switch to not work properly. Any chance you have internally corrode pipes reducing flow?

 

[Soundguy]

break the line befor ethe tank and see what the flow is from the pump itself..

 

[whistlepig]

Whistlepig,I just replaced mine (teel brand) it had 14 yrs on it,the one before that was a brand called Myers and it lasted about 10 years.A buddy in the waterwell business recommended a brand called Grundfos,it ran me about $850.00 for pump(1.5 hp 16 gal. min) and control box.Ryer

I have read a little about Grundfos pumps in the past. These are for sure premium pumps. From the replies that I am getting it sounds like 12-14 years is max on a submersible. Local plumber wants $675.00 to install a new submersible plug and play. Brand of his choice. I would pay the extra for a Grundfos if I was sure the extra pump life was there.

 

[whistlepig]

break the line befor ethe tank and see what the flow is from the pump itself..

I think that would be hard to "eyeball".

 

[Soundguy]

i don't think it would.. can do a farmerized semi calibrated test using a 5g bucket and a watch to guestimate flow rate in gpm...

 

[whistlepig]

You need to read the pressure on the pressure tank when the pump is off after high cut off and what it reads just as it turns on. My water loggged tank let the pump short cycle.

The last place were rented had a deep well pump that had to be at least 20 years old. We would run that 24 hours a day for weeks on end to water pastures. At that place we had corrosion inside the pipes causing the pressure switch to not work properly. Any chance you have internally corrode pipes reducing flow?

This place was built in 1999. Pump is the same age. I have done a few minor plumbing repairs and modifications. I have seen no significant build up in the pipes. I do appreciate the advice but from the responses I am getting it seems that 12-14 years is the lifetime of a submersible. I have a friend that lives close to me. He got 12 years out of his submersible. He replaced his about 6 months ago.

 

[RoyJackson]

Look for any possible leaks...commode, outside hose bibs, etc. Any of those could be pulling your well down and, if the pump is exposed, a thermal switch will shut it down. If that happens, it has to cool for a while before the thermal switch resets and your pressure will drop.

Here's my story (short version):
We lost pressure to the point we couldn't do a load of laundry (just my wife and I here, so we're not talking about a lot of clothes) and when we had to flush the commode, the faucets' flow would drop to a trickle (I gathered up all the old containers I could find and filled them with the snow remaining on the property....to use for flushing the commodes and such.
The plumber pulled the pump (a Gould that was less then 5 years old) which was fine but we only had 10' of standing water in a 300' deep well (the pump should be at least 10' above the bottom of the well so it doesn't pull in sediment). He asked about any leaking fixtures and, yep, I had one outside hose bib that would drip every 3-5 minutes. No adjustment left in the gland nut, so we installed a cutoff inside. However, the plumber thought the well was kaput, but to turn the pump off at night to see if the well would recover. Unlikely though, due to the low level in the well.
Spent just under $4K to drill a new well (finished up yesterday, in fact).

Of course, the water flow from the old well has been great yesterday and today (including stressing the well by showering and a load of laundry). Still doing good, BTW. But I'm still shutting the pump off when we go to bed (and will continue that task for the foreseeable future).

At this point, I'm not sure we needed the new well...the next few weeks will tell the tale. We'll still tie the new well in, but it may not be an immediate need to do so.

So, your pump may need replacement...or the well may not be recovering as it should. Make sure your plumber checks the water level while he's got that pump out.

 

[whistlepig]

We do have a good well. That I am sure of. The neighbor across the street (1000 feet) has been watering 100 head of diary cows for thirty years now and has never had a water problem.

 

[WWW61]

We dug a new well in 1980, and they put in a new submersible system, and we haven't had any problems whatsoever except 1 new tank. Just lucky I guess. wayne.

 

[RoyJackson]

We do have a good well. That I am sure of. The neighbor across the street (1000 feet) has been watering 100 head of diary cows for thirty years now and has never had a water problem.

Can't hurt to check the water depth...only takes 5-10 minutes and that neighbor might be pulling enough water off the aquifer to cause you problems. Aquifiers can be depleted.

BTW, as a bit of an addedum to my previous post. 2011 was the wettest year on record in the state of Pennsylvania. We had drought years (2002-2007) with occasional outages. I couldn't understand how we could lose a well after all the rain we had last year (and continuing into 2012).

 

[whistlepig]

We dug a new well in 1980, and they put in a new submersible system, and we haven't had any problems whatsoever except 1 new tank. Just lucky I guess. wayne.

Do you know the brand name of the submersible?

 

[Soundguy]

mines from 99 and showing no signs of stopping. my stepdad's is from 71 and still going...

that said.. I seen em go bad in 3ys too..

all depends on the circumstances..

 

[WWW61]

Whistlepig, I was afraid you would ask that. I don't remember. The control box in the basement says Franklin Electric, Bluffton, In. But I have no idea if the pump is Franklin also. It is a 1/3 horse. I didn't have a trouble when we we're filling a pool. If you want me to I can call the Well Driller, and see what I can find out. Wayne

 

[RoyJackson]

Whistlepig, I was afraid you would ask that. I don't remember. The control box in the basement says Franklin Electric, Bluffton, In. But I have no idea if the pump is Franklin also. It is a 1/3 horse. I didn't have a trouble when we we're filling a pool. If you want me to I can call the Well Driller, and see what I can find out. Wayne

The plumber (the drillers may not have installed the pump) should have left you a manual for the pump. Maybe you still have it somewhere...of course, it's been 30 years!

 

[SPYDERLK]

The pressure tank is holding at 45 pounds. I don't think the bladder is water logged. In my experience the pump runs continuously when the bladder is bad. The pump seems to start and stop like it is supposed to. Just no pressure or water volume when the pump is running.

Just reread your post and I wonder if the water bag in your tank is busted. If the tank has ever been waterlogged this is a likelihood. A broken bag can block water outflow. -- probably should check that.
Also, the possiblity of downwell leaks with the pump still good -- Does the pressure cycle or stay the same? Normal cut on cutoff cycling would usually be in the 30-50 range. If you dont see cycling you could have a down well leak and the pump is running constantly. It could be a cracked fitting at the pump/pressure pipe junction... Some installers used a plastic fitting - good for 10 years or so - then crack. A pump should last much longer unless you are pumping sandy water. My pump is at 25 yrs and counting and it sees lots of use; sometimes even pumping some air when a toilet runs all nite combined with other use, etc
ooo[Or, if you see quick cycling it could be the foot valve of the pump, or even a smaller fitting crack.]
larry

 

[Carl_NH]

I have read a little about Grundfos pumps in the past. These are for sure premium pumps. From the replies that I am getting it sounds like 12-14 years is max on a submersible. Local plumber wants $675.00 to install a new submersible plug and play. Brand of his choice. I would pay the extra for a Grundfos if I was sure the extra pump life was there.

There are a lot of good pumps, Meyers, Goulds, Franklin, Grundfos, Red Jacket - it used to be Franklin made most of the motors but now Goulds makes motors and pumps the same as Grundfos and now Franklin make pumps too.

The grundfos are different motor/pumps as they have softstart and other features sort of unique to them so mixing and matching a motor with them may be more difficult.

For $675 you must have either a 1/2 or 3/4 HP set about 200' or you are getting a heck of a deal if its 1 or 1.5 HP. The pump HP and # of stages set the price - for instance I have a 1.5HP Franklin 2 wire with 17 Stage Goulds pump set at 365' which will pump 13 GPM @ 40-60PSI 250' water depth.. That pump/motor retail is $1100. I got a spare 1.5HP Goulds pump here http://www.aquascience.net/submersible-pumps/index.cfm?manufacturer=Goulds

Also while you have the pump out check the wires and piping for wear - sometimes the wires will rub the casing/walls and short out which can damage/kill the motor too.

As to lifetime - our last pump lasted 11 years, but i have seen them go 15-20 yrs also, but 10-15 seems to be the norm.

Carl