Surge Protection Install Ques

[tstex]

Hello to all,

Ive enclosed a drawing of the electrical panels and flow of power.

the main 200 amp Siemens panel was just installed. Has a 40amp CB that controls water well & shed. This panel has open slots The 100amp Sq D Homeline panel on house has no slots. This panel also feeds 2 other low bandwidth areas

Based on the drawing, what make & model would you install and where? I know some SP’s require a free/open CB, while others do not. Pls let me know if you have any questions. Thank you.

 

[tstex]

Here’s drawing

 

[MAX-24-Dean]

Surge suppressors are best installed closest to the Service Entrance ground rod for maximum effectiveness.
So the new Siemens 200 Amp panel in your diagram should be installed as the Service Entrance panel. The first location between you and the Utility power with a disconnecting means.

https://www.amazon.com/Siemens-FS140-Whole-House-Protection/dp/B013WINMK6/ref=sr_1_3?crid=2YWO0KMGL3JEW&keywords=siemens%2Bsurge%2Bprotector%2Bwhole%2Bhouse&qid=1680200301&s=hi&sprefix=siemens%2Bsurge%2Bsu%2Ctools%2C258&sr=1-3&th=1

 

[tstex]

Thank you max / can these be installed inside the panel? Since the pole is in an open sunny area, need good UV protection....thanks again

 

[kenmbz]

Thank you max / can these be installed inside the panel? Since the pole is in an open sunny area, need good UV protection....thanks again

Usually attach outside to a knockout. Side/bottom where available.

 

[DaBear3428]

short answer is at the main service. longer answer involves understanding what a SPD is and how it works.
A SPD is a crowbar circuit (it shorts the bus to ground when the voltage exceeds a specific voltage). The location of the SPD in the Circuit is influenced by many variables such as point of surge injection and location of sensitive components.

To illustrate this concept lets use your example. in most cases you are trying to protect from surge injections in the utility line and are trying to protect your sensitive in the house (after the main), in this case the best location is the service entrance.

simple right? but if your sensitive equipment are all located in your water well house and the line going from the main to that location is exposed to a source of surge injection (think lightning) then it would be better to install the SPD in the well house.

surges are caused by current injected into the system which react with the resistance of the wiring (Voltage = I(current) X Resistance) to create a high voltage (much higher than the devices can handle) which the SPD shorts to ground but if the surge injection point is on the same side of the SPD connection as the sensitive device it is of little help. so in this case it is best to install the SPD in both locations the house main and the well house.

 

[tstex]

thanks bear for the information.

yes, the point of entry of the power is usually the best place, for surges impacting the power lines. but as noted, we have lots of errant lightening issues, so all bets are of w lightening. if a nearby errant hit makes it to the house, then anything there is not protected bc it did not come either thru the main entry point or the homes 100amp panel.

Since the 100amp house panel is full, I would have to look at both an external solution AND one that did not depend on a dedicated c-breaker...they are all taken. The 200amp main panel has both the breaker space and the inside room.

Thanks again.

 

[dlctcg]

@DaBear3428 Really Good Response & Definition

We install multiple units in many of our residential & commercial automation designs / installs to cover the different situations. Many of our systems also include the low voltage entry points also...

 

[MAX-24-Dean]

Thank you max / can these be installed inside the panel? Since the pole is in an open sunny area, need good UV protection....thanks again

Yes, it can be installed inside the panel if there is room.

Edit; they are rated for outdoor installation also.

 

[grsthegreat]

I second the siemens FS140. Its an awsome unit. I have a 499 amp service and have installed one on house 200 amp panel and one on shop 200 amp panel.

 

[Gordon Gould]

We live at the end of a very long dead ended line and lightning surges were a common problem. I put in an external Square-D surge protector. No trouble since. Mounted it in a knock-out at the top of the 200 Amp panel near the line entry and connected it to the top of the busses with short wires.

gg

 

[tstex]

I second the siemens FS140. Its an awsome unit. I have a 499 amp service and have installed one on house 200 amp panel and one on shop 200 amp panel.

how long do the FS140 usually last under "normal" operating circumstances? mainly spikes/surges via powerlines, but excluding lightening strikes, including errant hits.

 

[tstex]

We live at the end of a very long dead ended line and lightning surges were a common problem. I put in an external Square-D surge protector. No trouble since. Mounted it in a knock-out at the top of the 200 Amp panel near the line entry and connected it to the top of the busses with short wires.



View attachment 792198


gg

I have installed 2 HEPD80's about 5-6 yrs ago and they are both doing well, still w 2 green lights

 

[Diggin It]

I have one of these:

Siemens QSA2020SPD



Occupies two spaces, but no loss of breakers.

 

[grsthegreat]

how long do the FS140 usually last under "normal" operating circumstances? mainly spikes/surges via powerlines, but excluding lightening strikes, including errant hits.

I installed mine 5-6 years ago still going strong. Ive installed alot of these for clients going back many years, and have never been called to repair it.

 

[MAX-24-Dean]

how long do the FS140 usually last under "normal" operating circumstances? mainly spikes/surges via powerlines, but excluding lightening strikes, including errant hits.

Should be decades excluding lightning strikes. All electronic devices degrade over time though.
The higher the fault diversion rating of the device the longer it will last. At 140,000 amps this is one of the highest rated suppressors on the market.

https://blog.se.com/energy-management-energy-efficiency/electrical-safety/2021/12/20/how-long-should-a-surge-protector-last/

 

[tstex]

Great, thank you max! Appreciate it !

 

[Beaver Cove Deere]

I have one of these:

Siemens QSA2020SPD



Occupies two spaces, but no loss of breakers.

I have 2, 200A main panels and a 50A generator panel.

They all have those same protectors installed with a Murray label and a lightning arrestor thru a knock out.

 

[tstex]

Thanks Beav...do you know the cut out rating when it goes to ground, in amps?

 

[grsthegreat]

the siemens surge BREAKER is rated 40,000 amp surge.

THE FS140 standalone has 140,000 amp rating.