Oil & Fuel Syntheic oil at 50hr service? Old topic, but want fresh ideas

[Kamik]

Hi Greg,

The technical manual makes no reference to "new" engines. The Diesel Engine Oil section preceeds the Break-In Engine Oil - Diesel section, and simply lists PREFERRED and alternate oils.

There is no mention of new, rebuilt or remanufactured engines in the Diesel Engine Oil section, but I suppose one could argue that all three could be treated the same during the first 100 hours of operation, with the preferred engine oil used afterward. A caveat might be any special requirements that may be called out by the rebuild or remanufacture instructions.

By the way, the on-line Operatng Manual says:
"Multi-viscosity diesel engine oils are preferred. Do not use break-in oils."

Go figure! In my case the initial oil change occured at 85 hours, replacing the as-delivered oil (do I dare call it break-in oil?) with PLUS-50 SAE 15W-40. The only reason I didn't wait longer is a) the onset of winter and my practice of performing maintenance at that time of year and b) the dealer concurring with the decision.

Subsequently, the engine continues to have plenty of power and doesn't use any oil so I concluded that engine break-in occured successfully. I really hadn't given it any more thought until this thread.

Cheers,

Kamik

 

[OtterBrookStables]

I assume John Deere is just as specific in the technical manual for your model tractor.

Thanks a bunch for the info. I still wonder if there is a difference in break-in procedure between the Yanmar and Deere PowerTech motors?

Anyway - does anyone have a 4X20 tech manual they could check for me? I don't have one yet, but will probably end up with one when the warranty runs out.

 

[OtterBrookStables]

Hello Kamik
What does it state concerning new engines?

Greg

Greg - Check this out: Frontier Power Products - Deere Break-In Oil

I states both new and remanufactured motors...

 

[eepete]

I'm looking at the 4520 tech manual. Mine is a 2009 model year.

In the Specifications & information section, "Fuels and Lubricants" on page 17 there is a section titled "Engine Break-in Oil" with a warning box that says:

"Important: Avoid Damage! ONLY use a quality break- in oil in rebuilt or remanufactured engines for the first 5 hours (maximum) of operation. DO NOT use oils with heavier viscosity weights than SAE 5W-30 or oils meeting specifications API SG or SH, these oils will not allow rebuilt or remanufactured engines to break-in properly."

Then there is a brief blurb on what break in oils to use. this is followed by another warning box that says:

"Important: Avoid Damage! After the break-in period, use the John Deere oil that is recommended for this engine."


In the section "Engine - Diesel Repair" on page 78. This section deals with what do to when you've had a major repair to the engine (and says what those repairs are). In the section titled "Performance Engine Break-in", there is one of those little warning boxes that says:

"Important: Avoid Damage! Do not use break-in oil in this engine."

There is nothing about new tractor break-in periods that I can find in the tech manual. The owners manual just says (under "Service Engine" on page 54) "Do not use break in oils". I can't find anything in the owners manual about the 1st 50 hours regarding oil or hydraulic fluid changes.

So clearly break in procedures are engine dependent, check your documentation. Tech manual is a win, wish is was free but they all charge for them. If you spent $30K+ on the tractor, spend the money for the tech manual. It definitely looks like a bad idea on the 4x20 series to change the oil at 50 hours and put in break in oil.

Pete

 

[Spudland_Dave]

We could debate this for another 6 months at least,

Lets boil this down from a common sense perspective.....

-Its pretty well established fact that JD ships ALL its machines with Break in oil in the crankcase...
-What DOES differ is when to change the oil...even for a certian model...Under the hood says one thing, the owners manual says another thing.

So, lets say ALL your documentation says "Change oil at 100 hours" that means Deere wants you to run Break In oil for the first 100 hours cause thats what they put there for you. They put all the warnings of "do not use break in oil" etc... in the owners manual because they dont want you running Break In Oil for 550 hours....this is one of those cases where "More is not better". I'm sure some people would think "oh, I'm gonna break it in real good" and use it for a LONG time...which is not what that oil is designed to do.

I get along real good with my dealership, so I asked them about it...they told me to run Break in Oil for the first 100 hours at least. They also reccomended changing at 50 hours...(Break In Oil + Filter)....and thats what I did.

Do whatever allows you to sleep good at night...

 

[eepete]

Sounds like the dealer is providing the missing information. The manuals are all dealing with post break in servicing concerns. Guess I'll be changing with break in at 50, then go to non-break in at 100. I will check with my dealer to see if the rules are different for a 4x20 vs. a 3x20.

So if I ask what to put in after the break-in oil, can we debate this for 12 months? (just kidding, I know what I'll use and I'm not saying).

Pete

 

[OtterBrookStables]

Sounds like the dealer is providing the missing information. The manuals are all dealing with post break in servicing concerns. Guess I'll be changing with break in at 50, then go to non-break in at 100. I will check with my dealer to see if the rules are different for a 4x20 vs. a 3x20.

So if I ask what to put in after the break-in oil, can we debate this for 12 months? (just kidding, I know what I'll use and I'm not saying).

Pete

Pete - I'm at the same point as you. I just got off the phone with someone at John Deere. They referred me to another dealer that concurs with the above. But - let us know what your dealer says when you ask. Thanks.

 

[glc24]

Man,this is enough to make your head spin:confused2::confused2:
I called my dealer,tech book states after 50 hours to change out the breakin oil and replace with regular oil. That's probably what I'll do.

Like Otter stated,whatever lets you sleep at night


Greg

 

[jcmseven]

This is not scientific but I have run Rotella 5/40 synthetic in all my JD equipment. Yanmar engines (more than the PowerTech) do harbor a lot of metal particles in manufacturing, so I feel it always a good idea to change out the original oil at about 50-75 hours. Diesels like these do have an extended break in time, more than gas engines, so this is about right. The diesels I have run, mostly Yanmar in JD's but also one PowerTech, love synthetic oil. I have seen a definite reduction in fuel consumption and generally have added about 1-1.5 hours more use on the same fuel in summer after swapping (more on the smaller engines). In addition, my indirect injection Gator 850d, which has always been a booger to start in winter, starts much better with synthetic in the crankcase. To me, the hour time usage between changes is less relevant than the time. I have changed mine no more often than every 250 hours in equipment that I have kept and used a lot, but will change it twice yearly in equipment that I do not use as much and that sits, even though that might be only every 30-50 hours. Probably overkill, but it works and currently at least I can afford to do it that way. I would say that if you operate your equipment in really hot or cold conditions and run your equipment hard for short bursts of time--then leave it sitting--you are likely a good candidate for synthetics. I believe syn's are better for most of us, but not enough better to merit their cost for those in more temperate climates that run their machines more consistently. Also remember in diesel oils a good mineral based oil with solid detergent properties beats a crummy synthetic without so do your research on the front end. Synthetic alone does not make an oil good.

John M

 

[glc24]

Hello John M
Thanks That was a very good post:thumbsup:

My tractor is probably one that will be in the category of run hard,then sit. I already decided when I do change at 50 hours,it will be synthetic. As for brand,if I can locate someone close enough that handles Rotella,I'll use it. If not,I've been using Mobil 1 in my p/u for ten years now,and IMHO,it's a pretty good oil also.

Greg