Temporary whinning during clutch engagement?

RandM · Mar 22, 2006

I read in a previous post (#782203 - 12/03/05 03:21 PM) of of a whinning noise occuring during the last half of clucth engagement and then quitting once fully engaed. The other day, at 38 hours on the tractor, mine starting doing it. I checked the fluids and all seemed ok, but decided to drain and flush the tranny anyway after reading this website. Does anyone know what the final solution to that particular problem was. I hope it was NOT the "had to break the tractor in half to replace an O ring in the main shaft". Could it be anything else; and if it is the O ring, is there a way to confirm it short of tearing it down? Please advise. Thanks

RonMar · Mar 22, 2006

What you describe sounds like the throw-out bearing. If properly adjusted, the throw-out bearing is not in contact with the spinning clutch levers on the pressure plate when the pedal is all the way up. As you depress the pedal, the bearing engages the levers, pressing them forward and releasing the clutch disks. If this bearing was going bad, you would hear it start to wine as you depressed the clutch pedal and the bearing contacted the levers and came under load. There have been cases where the clutch was misadjusted and the bearing was in contact with the levers all the time. It is a simple greased-at-install bearing. It is not designed to turn all the time and will wear out quickly if left engaged. The same problem can also be caused by some one "rideing" the clutch pedal and not letting it fully dis-engage.

You can visually inspect this bearing by removeing the side covers on the sides of the bell housing directly below the fuel tank. If you have small hands, you can probably even get your fingers on it to see if it rolls smoothly. The access plates are approx 5" X 7" rectangular plates with 4 large bolts on left and right sides. Unfortunatly, this is probably where the Front End Loader is attached to the tractor so you will have to remove your Koyoker loader first. Once the plates are off you can look in and toward the rear and see the throw-out bearing at the rear and the 3 levers in front of it on the rear of the pressure plate. With the clutch pedal released, there should be at least 1/8" gap between the fingers and the bearing face. The lever faces that contact the bearing should be smooth and clean with no discoloration and virtually no wear marks at 38 hours. The bearing face that contacts the levers should also be smooth and without to many marks or discoloration.

Here is a link to John's jinma site and a 254 clutch. Yours is probably similar(if not identical). The bearing and it's carrier are #21 and #20 and the lever on the pressure plate it comes in contact with is #15.

http://www.johnstractor.homestead.com/files/DualClutch.jpg

If this is your problem, then it requires you to split the tractor in two to repair, same as for a clutch replacement.

greg_g · Mar 22, 2006

What type and weight of lubricant are you using in the transmission/differentials?

//greg//

bluechip · Mar 23, 2006

What you are hearing is the the PTO shaft spinning inside the stationary main transmission shaft, this occurs about midway in the pedal, the main disk is disengaged on the clutch stopping the tractor but the PTO is still running. We have remedied the noise in the past by overfilling the transmission letting it set a bit then draining back down. this is probably not a correction of the problem, just a remedy of the symptom. It may be that the PTO shaft has a slight tweak in it so it is not exactly centered in teh main shaft or it could be an O ring, but Tommy would know the Jinma more than I. The first one we fixed, we split the tractor and pulled the safts, we installed a new shaft for the PTO (from the clutch back to the rear) and the problem went away, a couple other times we used the "remedy" I described above with success.

RandM · Mar 23, 2006

After flushing today I am putting 80w90 gear oil good for yellow metals/antifoam. I should have done this from the start not realizing how bad the OEM oil was until reading back thru this forum. Thanks for all thee advise. Before I get crazy with it all I going to see what happens after the drain and flush. Maybe some "coking" between the shafts? Wishful thinking but I'll see.

RandM · Mar 24, 2006

I drained, flushed and replaced ALL fluids (except radiator and injectors for some reason the dealer did them but not the others). A lot of crud. I drove the tractor around a little and problem still existed so I decided to open the creeper box (when I drained earlier it didn't seem like much oil came out). The box was dry so I put in oil. On the next run the noise was there again, but after engaging the creeper gear and driving it around a little it stopped even after disengaging the creeper. I drove it around a while exercising all the gears and clutch and the problem never resurfaced.
Question though. Does the creeper gear spin all the time whether engaged or not ? Note: No fluids were overfilled then drained off. Thanks

JINMA224XR · Mar 24, 2006

<font color="blue"> . I drove the tractor around a little and problem still existed so I decided to open the creeper box (when I drained earlier it didn't seem like much oil came out). The box was dry so I put in oil. On the next run the noise was there again, but after engaging the creeper gear and driving it around a little it stopped even after disengaging the creeper. I drove it around a while exercising all the gears and clutch and the problem never resurfaced.
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Hey RandM,

I believe that you may have solved the mystery of where the whinning noise was coming from(The Creeper Gear Box).

Although, you have provided lubrication to the Creeper Gears and Bearings. The oil refill passage, coming from the Main Transmission Reservoir, may still be clogged up.

This is an ongoing problem, with oil passages being stopped up or partially stopped up, preventing oil getting to the creeper gear box, from the Main Transmission Reservoir.

This has happened to others, including myself on my Jinma 224xr.

What I did, was drain the transmission and transfer gear box. Put the drain plugs back in, but leave the creeper drain plug out. Pour in diesel fuel, Through the Main Transmission (it took about 6 gallons on my 224), until it comes out the creeper drain. Put that drain plug back in and then remove the transfer gear box drain. Let the diesel drain out that for a little bit, put that drain back in and then remove the creeper drain again, and let all of the diesel drain out. Then remove all of the drain plugs and let any remaining diesel drain out.

Then put the drain plugs back in, but leave out the Transfer Gear and the Creeper Gear box drain. Begin refilling the transmission reservoir with Gear Oil. When you see oil coming out the Transfer Gear, put that drain plug in. When you see oil coming out the Creeper Gear Box, then put that drain plug back in. That way, you will know that you are getting oil to the Creeper Gear Box, and the Transfer Gear box. Adjust oil to the proper level on the Transmission Dip Stick.

Some have installed a DipStick in the Creeper Gear Box Cover, but doing it this way, I really don't see a need for the dipstick on my 224.

Hope this helps,
Have a nice day,
Joe /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif