Thawing the pipe

[studor]

Ok -- here is the problem. The suction line from the pitless adapter in the well to my pump is blocked (probably by ice). It is black plastic inch and a quarter tubing and only about 15' long. About 7.5 feet of that 15' is underground and cannot be accessed without really major effort. I can get to the pump end but not the well end and so far have not been able to entirely remove the water in it. Because I don't have running water I also do not have HOT running water available. Other than waiting for the frost to leave the ground (or drinking bourbon straight from the bottle and forgetting about it) does anybody have an ingenious way to thaw the pipe without damaging it?
Regards
Steve

 

[greenmule]

Wait till summer?

 

[studor]

Wait till summer?

I think that is usually when the frost leaves the ground

 

[gordyy]

you could unhook inside the house feed a small hose into the water line running hot water into it till you can push at least 20 ft of hose in thru the pipe
of course your probably going to have to haul water to it and thru the water heater
and if you get it open leave the water running inside till summer or it will just freeze again as soon as you shut it down

probably easier to wait till summer

 

[LarryD]

Can you wrap the top with a heat tape?

 

[Egon]

[you could unhook inside the house feed a small hose into the water line running hot water into it till you can push at least 20 ft of hose in thru the pipe /QUOTE]

In the past I have seen that method work.

 

[czechsonofagun]

Picture would be helpful. Basically you need to deliver heat to the frozen end without heating cubic yards of dirt. I remember reading something about gold mining in Alaska and they drove these steel difusers in the ground and fed it overheated steam to thaw the ground.
The primitive approach to the same problem was big heated rock they would roll to the spot and let sit for a day, than replaced it with a new one. Porbably waiting is the easiest and less risky solution. Would it be possible to drill safely hole in the ground, maybe several - with a masonry bit - and use an electrical heating element from water heater?

 

[studor]

Thanks for the ideas guys -- my current plan is to put a heat wire inside the pipe as soon as I can get it open so I never have this problem again. The problem is opening the pipe. -- running ot of bourbon!

 

[Redneck in training]

Ok -- here is the problem. The suction line from the pitless adapter in the well to my pump is blocked (probably by ice). It is black plastic inch and a quarter tubing and only about 15' long. About 7.5 feet of that 15' is underground and cannot be accessed without really major effort. I can get to the pump end but not the well end and so far have not been able to entirely remove the water in it. Because I don't have running water I also do not have HOT running water available. Other than waiting for the frost to leave the ground (or drinking bourbon straight from the bottle and forgetting about it) does anybody have an ingenious way to thaw the pipe without damaging it?
Regards
Steve

Do you have an arc welder? Make a loop (use a cable and twist two wires together on one end) of gauge 6 or 8 cooper wire long enough to reach trough the ice plug. Adjust the amps so the wire gets warm enough but wouldn't melt the insulation and push it in the pipe. Use good rubber boots and rubber gloves to insulate yourself from the ground and don't do it alone. I don't think it is too dangerous but as we used to say: "Devil never sleeps." Drink bourbon only after the water is running.

 

[studor]

Redneck -- I have an old tombstone Lincoln and the thought is ingenious! Do I yell "hey watch this" before I plug it in? I'll have to check my wire supply to see what I have and read a little more before trying it
regards

 

[Tig]

Studor, I deal with this every year. The line will freeze where it is exposed. I use a halogen light to thaw the line. (assuming you can open the well) Lower the light down the well and shine it on the pitless adapter and line from about a 1' distance. Cover the well with an old sleeping bag and tarp. Make sure the light it's self has enough room to cool so that it does not burn up. Then wait. Takes me a few hours for my line. A regular light bulb would also work, although I would place that within an inch of the line.
Where the heck in eastern Ontario are you that your line is frozen today? The ice just went out on our lake.

 

[studor]

Tig -- what used to be Darling township -- as the locals say "a hard piece of Canada"-- rock is a plentifull commodity. The line froze some time ago but I only recently isolated the problem. This has not happened to me before so it took various attempts at fixing the problem before I figured it out. I did put a heat lamp down last week to make sure the pitless adapter was not full of ice prior to pulling the well line to check the foot valve, injector etc. Maybe I should just leave it longer.

 

[Tig]

The snow protects my well most of the time. I use the blower when I can to ensure a good blanket. This year the snow melted and then it went past -20C with a driving north wind for a few days. The water in my well even froze. That may be the spell that go you also.
The lamp may take hours or perhaps days but it's a no sweat solution.
Nice area you are from. I love Lanark, what a baseball town. I coached Ontario in the Canadian Little League championships five years ago in Lanark. 500 fans for a Monday evening game and over 1000 on Saturday, in a town of 900 people. It was amazing since I am used to only having a few fans (parents) in the stands.

 

[Redneck in training]

Redneck -- I have an old tombstone Lincoln and the thought is ingenious! Do I yell "hey watch this" before I plug it in? I'll have to check my wire supply to see what I have and read a little more before trying it
regards

I am not expert on arc welders (eventhough I have one). They use arc welders to dry big electric motors and generators in refineries in example after huricane.
I think 30 to 60 Amps will do it. Start with the lowest amp setting and slowly crank it up while checking the temperature. Bigger gauge will get hotter at lower amps but might not supply enough heat. Heat in Wats=Voltage X Amps. Don't know what is under load voltage of an arc welder but I am guessing it si about 5 to 10V. It will work after few experiments.

 

[Dutch445]

since you can get to the pump end of the pipe,
is there a possibility of using another hose to siphon
out what water is in there, then send down some
salt, either in small crystals or a brine, to try
to melt that ice?

 

[Redneck in training]

It just occured to me that you could use steel wire. Fold it over and insulate one leg by silicone tubing. It could work better than cooper due to higher iron resistance.

 

[studor]

Steve -- maybe a beer concession would attract more fans -- did you notice a lot of coolers at the Lanark games? Seems to be a lot of diehard ball fans in the area all right. I will put my heat lamp in there again next time I am up and leave it. The wellhead is actually under a porch so it is not protected by snow but we had a warm spell followed by a very quick freeze which I think drove the frost into the ground just that little bit too much.
Dutch -- I tried to get as much water out of the pipe as possible (even tried a shop vac) but because of the plug it seems to really want to hold water in there -- hmmm
Redneck -- I have some #6 u/g cable -- now you got me thinking -- I know when my water line froze in the city the arrived with a big arc welder, fastened one to the sidewalk shutoff and the other to the pipe in the house and cranked it up until the water flowed but that was using the metal in the pipe to heat (and only 300 bucks to temporarily fix a problem their inspector should have caught!!)
Regards
Steve

 

[Redneck in training]

Ok -- here is the problem. The suction line from the pitless adapter in the well to my pump is blocked (probably by ice). It is black plastic inch and a quarter tubing and only about 15' long. About 7.5 feet of that 15' is underground and cannot be accessed without really major effort. I can get to the pump end but not the well end and so far have not been able to entirely remove the water in it. Because I don't have running water I also do not have HOT running water available. Other than waiting for the frost to leave the ground (or drinking bourbon straight from the bottle and forgetting about it) does anybody have an ingenious way to thaw the pipe without damaging it?
Regards
Steve

Later on when it thaws drill a hole along the water pipe and insert (grout) in a 1/2" copper pipe. Then insert a heating cable in it. The pipe will protect it and make it replaceable.

 

[Thumper & Buttercup]

Check with your water department, ours has a unit that makes steam and they can stick the hose down the pipes to thaw them out.

 

[studor]

Redneck -- I found a wire that goes inside the pipe and has inch and a quarter fittings with the wire connectors and thermostat and is all up to code
Thumper -- the water department is me but now you have me wondering if any of my neighbours has a steam genny