The Ugly undeniable Truth

[kcflhrc]

Looks to me like more fishing areas

 

[Mace Canute]

Photos of Alaska: Then And Now. This is A Get Ready to Be Shocked When You See What it Looks Like Now.


And yet many people still don't believe in the observable Climate Change Facts. Shame on you ! :thumbdown:

It's even more shocking when you realize what it looked like waaay back then...

 

[SirReal63]

The cure to man made global warming is to stop the government from giving money out to those who support it.
Eddie

100% agree. The real undeniable Truth is that the planet has been going through a cyclical climate change since the beginning of time, and will for the rest of eternity. The Earth's orbit around the sun is not a consistent orbit, the path varies and over time the Earth is closer to the Sun, and other times it is farther away from the Sun. Is Humanity adding to the change, probably, are we the sole cause, not a chance, are we going to be able to stop the climate change that has been going on forever, not going to happen. The current mess of climate change is no different than when we were kids and the Earth was going into an Ice Age, and that will happen again, at some point in time just as the Earth is in a warming trend right now.

It was once taught in school that the Earth's climate has never been stable and that there have been numerous warming and cooling periods. I am not sure if that is still being taught or if the overall goal is the dumbing down of people to the point where any agenda can be pushed and the general population isn't educated enough to know when they are being duped. One look at a current High School textbook with a quick comparison to one from the 50's tends to show that the Dumbing down of America is in full swing.

 

[wawajake]

I would post pictures of what Greenland looked like a few centuries back, but the ice age has not receded enough yet to show the farming and wildlife there back then. I guess when the earth gets Greenland back to that stage we will be back to normal.
I find it so silly to attempt to blame global warming on mankind when before we had cars it was far warmer.
and considering the man made CO2 is just a fraction of total greenhouse gases that have impact........we are wasting money and resources that could be better spent just adapting to the climate whichever way it goes. And Any money we convince our governments to waste on this is money they could of even used for healthcare to save tangible real lives now..........not cute polar bears that just move up the coast and adjust (as the Inuit in Canada are confirming is occurring.

 

[dave1949]

100% agree. The real undeniable Truth is that the planet has been going through a cyclical climate change since the beginning of time, and will for the rest of eternity. The Earth's orbit around the sun is not a consistent orbit, the path varies and over time the Earth is closer to the Sun, and other times it is farther away from the Sun. Is Humanity adding to the change, probably, are we the sole cause, not a chance, are we going to be able to stop the climate change that has been going on forever, not going to happen. The current mess of climate change is no different than when we were kids and the Earth was going into an Ice Age, and that will happen again, at some point in time just as the Earth is in a warming trend right now.

It was once taught in school that the Earth's climate has never been stable and that there have been numerous warming and cooling periods. I am not sure if that is still being taught or if the overall goal is the dumbing down of people to the point where any agenda can be pushed and the general population isn't educated enough to know when they are being duped. One look at a current High School textbook with a quick comparison to one from the 50's tends to show that the Dumbing down of America is in full swing.

Of course the climate is always changing and there is no long term stability. No one has ever said otherwise. The difference comes in how long is long term and what is the difference in the impact on people alive now and in the following couple of generations?

The climate drivers you mention take place over thousands and millions of years. There will be short term aberrations such as the Little Ice Age caused by an very powerful volcano, or the result of space object colliding with Earth, but those are rare and widely survivable for the most part. Those are events we truly can do nothing about with current technology and knowledge. It's pointless to compare those types of events with fossil fuel greenhouse gas production which is totally under our control.

Man-made climate change is happening on a scale of decades and half centuries; the scale of a human lifetime. It is having and will have rather immediate impacts on the current populations compared to something that happens over thousands of years. You are comparing apples and oranges when you ignore the pace of change.

I cannot count how many times this difference has been explained yet deniers keep repeating the same mantra--climate has always changed. I would think they would catch on eventually, if they wanted to that is. Deniers clearly do not want to.

Those changes will last a long time; CO2 persists in the atmosphere for hundreds of, perhaps a thousand, years. It is not going to clear up on its own in 10-20 years like volcano particulate ash.

 

[motownbrowne]

What gets me is that the vast majority of politicians making the laws that could really affect the climate crisis are over 65. That probably goes for a lot of you climate change deniers too. I'm 28. I'm gonna be here a lot longer than you guys and the politicians you've been voting in. You guys made your mark, ramped up consumption, industry, and toxic emissions in the name of progress, even though the dollar bills only went into a few pockets.

Well, as someone who is part of the generation that's gonna have to clean try to clean this mess up, let me say "thanks a lot". You guys spilled oil in our rivers and sounds, washed away our soil, and generally cashed in on our resources. If you want to sit around and talk about how climate change isn't real because you think it's colder right now where you live, that's fine, I could care less. But when younger folks finally get the littlest bit of political clout and try to do something about it, do me a favor. Step aside. You've had your run. It was grand. Hopefully you saved enough to retire and buy a cabin on the lake. Now it's our turn. We'll wait till you die off if we have to, but if you would be kind enough to give us a tiny head start, we'd really appreciate it. Maybe your great great grandkids would too.

Thanks.

 

[dave1949]

What gets me is that the vast majority of politicians making the laws that could really affect the climate crisis are over 65. That probably goes for a lot of you climate change deniers too. I'm 28. I'm gonna be here a lot longer than you guys and the politicians you've been voting in. You guys made your mark, ramped up consumption, industry, and toxic emissions in the name of progress, even though the dollar bills only went into a few pockets.

Well, as someone who is part of the generation that's gonna have to clean try to clean this mess up, let me say "thanks a lot". You guys spilled oil in our rivers and sounds, washed away our soil, and generally cashed in on our resources. If you want to sit around and talk about how climate change isn't real because you think it's colder right now where you live, that's fine, I could care less. But when younger folks finally get the littlest bit of political clout and try to do something about it, do me a favor. Step aside. You've had your run. It was grand. Hopefully you saved enough to retire and buy a cabin on the lake. Now it's our turn. We'll wait till you die off if we have to, but if you would be kind enough to give us a tiny head start, we'd really appreciate it. Maybe your great great grandkids would too.

Thanks.

I was discussing this very thing with my 40 year-old son. I asked where is the passion to work on these issues that are really non-issues to that group? He also said they are waiting for the old folks to die off. :laughing:

Fair enough but I do wish the young folks would understand the value of voting in every election. You may not get rid of some of the more obnoxious politicians but you can isolate them to the point of irrelevance. As it stands now, the 20-40 year-olds are forfeiting the "game" by not showing up.

 

[dodge man]

I question if we even have to data to say temps are changing. How long have we been tracking temps in a accurate way in the U.S. 100 years maybe. Even if its a 150 years, that's a pretty short time period.

 

[motownbrowne]

I was discussing this very thing with my 40 year-old son. I asked where is the passion to work on these issues that are really non-issues to that group? He also said they are waiting for the old folks to die off. :laughing:

Fair enough but I do wish the young folks would understand the value of voting in every election. You may not get rid of some of the more obnoxious politicians but you can isolate them to the point of irrelevance. As it stands now, the 20-40 year-olds are forfeiting the "game" by not showing up.

I agree Dave. Many eligible voters in my generation aren't helping the equation. In part I understand where they're coming from. It's tough to have to choose to vote again and again for the candidate that represents the "lesser of two evils". I, and I think many of my peers, think they are all a bunch of money hungry crooks. Also, Dave, while you may be included in the demographic that I described earlier, I always appreciate reading your posts on here. Sometimes I feel outnumbered on this forum, and it's nice to have some other dissenting voices in the fray.

 

[motownbrowne]

I question if we even have to data to say temps are changing. How long have we been tracking temps in a accurate way in the U.S. 100 years maybe. Even if its a 150 years, that's a pretty short time period.

No, that's not the question. Who cares? If climate change is fake and we end up reducing our emissions and dependance on oil and coal while increasing the fuel economy of the cars we drive, so what? If it's real, and we manage to mitigate the symptoms a little bit and maybe get to enjoy a few more generations of humanity on this planet, GREAT!

Yeah, yeah, maybe it'll cost us a few dollars to solve to problem. Seriously, though, the way money moves around at the top right now, we could go a long way toward solving the problem without having to pass the collection hat to every Tom, Dick, and Harry. If the top 1% of financial holders in the world (the guys who've been making all of the real return on the resources we've been pawning off) all stepped up to the plate for once, we could get somewhere pretty quick.