Tiller Vs Plow and Disk Etc

[Fallon]

Space between passes? Depth?

I was pulling my subsoiler with a L3200 (32hp, 3,000-3,500lbs). I ran it maybe a foot down which was the maximum power & traction limits. I was shooting for a foot or 2 between passes if I recall.

Interesting comparison a month ago. Same pasture, only dryer. A several hundred hp 87,000lbs cable plow didn't have enough traction to rip 42" down on its first pass. They did a first pass at 36" or so, then a 2nd pass at max depth about 42" down laying the conduit. Plow was a fair bit longer than my subsoiler but not that much wider. 1/2-3-4" vs 2" or so. I guess the drag goes up exponentially.

 

[Egon]

Depth of cultivation should be dependent on the type and variation of soil. Deep is not always better. Soil analysis should be first step.

Implements like Disks or cultivators require lots of HP to pull an implement that can give desired results. Pure waste of money for 5 acres. A rototiller with time will do the original work. Thereafter rototiling gets much easier and quicker and will be the only implement required.

It is just a matter of equating results with the required inputs. 20 acres would be a much different situation and require different implements.

Sodies were built from the sod turned over by a plow. At that time the prairie was left natural for the plowing. There was no cutting of the grass before ploughing Unless the grass was used for hay.

 

[Randy Gann]

Where I am located in NC you can find both a used turning plow and used disc for less than you would pay for a good used tiller. Seems there is also less risk in buying used plow and disc than in buying a used tiller. Agree with others about turning the ground in the fall then discing in the spring in preparation for planting— this would be faster than running a tiller. Subsoiler would only be needed if you have a problem with hard pan and the soil won’t drain. For 2 acres if doing as row crops you would need cultivators to make up the rows and also for cultivating/plowing the growing crops.

 

[California]

For 2 acres if doing as row crops you would need cultivators to make up the rows and also for cultivating/plowing the growing crops.

The tillers that come over with VN 'rebuilt' tractors often have a decal showing how to mount left/right tines to make ridges. So for a garden plot, this might be the only implement needed to do the whole project.

 

[DeerPark5]

thx. At this time, I'm thinking tiller with a drag harrow and skipping the disks.

 

[3gunr]

Good info here from everyone, I would add that mowing and spraying and allowing the roots to die in the ground will make whatever method you choose much easier to accomplish, I have 2 tillers and several disks, Tillers are slow but can be a one pass operation , Disks are great on previously worked ground and can be much faster than a tiller, I use both at different times and like them both, My plow has been untouched for 15 yrs.

 

[Creamer]

I would take a totally different approach. Remember there is a difference between soil and dirt. Soil has structure and life while dirt is just that the loose stuff you end up with that comes out of the back of a tiller. In the Spokane area you have a very similar climate as grew up in North Central South Dakota. Many of the farmers there have converted to never till because the ground produces much more - yields I never dreamed of as a kid.

If the ground is rough I would use disc harrow or drag harrow (depending on how rough) for absolutely minimum dirt disruption. Obviously if it is rough and you want it smooth there is going to be some dirt moving but disturb as little as possible. Use a Roundup or other burndown to kill the vegetation that you cannot transition - the wheat will transition nicely if you keep it mowed and plant grass in it - it will slowly go away as it is an annual. Many other types of vegetation will die off in time with mowing as they do not reproduce.

Remember tilling old farm ground brings weed seeds to the surface. If you do not till it those weed seeds will stay buried and dormant and die in time. Somebody mentioned plowing was how the sod was broken up and that was true but it didn't bring up the weeds seeds then because there weren't any down there. Tilling causes weeds - let them lie down there and slowly disappear like nature did when it put the grass there.

So in short, if it is rough I would do very minimal surface tillage to get it smooth. Then use chemicals as needed but let the mowing kill most of the weeds. Then plant what you want as you want and let it grow. If you want to learn more about these techniques look up Dr. Dwayne Beck and Dakota Lakes Research Farm. he explains the details of how this works but he has been credits with adding over $18 B to ag economy in north central SD with his research and training. What used to be $400/acre land is now $4000/acre land due to the productivity in that area. My sister-in-law has always been an excellent gardener but since she went never till about 10 years ago she has been amazed at much difference she has seen in her garden. Much less work, minimal weeding, much more produce. I know it is very tempting to till it once nice and deep but that will set the ground back ten years. When I walk in the corn and soybean fields where I grew up and it is hot and dry like it gets in July and August, I am amazed that the soil feels soft under my feet. This year my nephews received less than two inches of precipitation from March 1 to the 3rd week in August and had 176 bushel per acre corn as there was a lot of subsoil moisture from the previous year. There neighbor has not bought in yet and his corn just across the road didn't even tassel.

You sound like you have an excellent place to start this - enjoy watching what biology and chemistry can do when you foster it.

 

[Texasmark]

I live just north of Spokane WA with 5 acres of former wheat field. There is a sod covering of few years worth volunteer wheat, weeds etc. There is about 3 feet of sandy loam before you get to any real rocks. I would like to have an oversized garden 2 acres, plant fruit trees, berry etc. (the typical dream too far). I’d also like to migrate the left over grass area back to a drought resistant grasses etc. I keep going back and forth between tiller vs ploughing disking ideas. Ive seen discussions where small disks won’t penetrate very deep and it’s recommended to run an actually plow first then disk it smooth.

I was pretty convinced on disk route, but then I was at a nearby you-pick operation (that was amazing BTW) and some of their row crops (corn etc) were on fluffy ground that must have been tilled.

And then if tiller - reverse vs forward rotation?

I live in clay. My fastest, least expensive renovation is 1 trip with a Hay King Pasture Renovator and a second trip with a roto tiller pulling a chain harrow. Speed and gate setting determined by degree of pulverization of soil desired. If you are going to plant the field and want best germination, one more trip with a cultipactor or just rolling drum filled with water to pack the soil after planting.

Other option is the renovator and then several passes with tandem disc. dragging the chain harrow.

Brush hogging any standing vegetation is recommended prior to any soil work. If a great deal of growth on the field then I'd opt for the disc route.