Tips for more Effecient Logging

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Just keep in mind that there is a lot more money in land clearing then in logging because the end-use of the land, justifies the land being cleared in the first place. In that situation, the machines used, are dictated by how fast the landowner wants the land cleared, and at the end of the job, a bill is submitted for getting it done.

You do not get that with logging, because the value of the wood being cut, has to support the costs of the equipment. What a logger gets paid for the wood, and how much it cost him to cut that wood, could be two different things.

From what I saw there, I'd have to agree for the most part. Considering the amount of stems for the size of this site (minimal), I'd say the "wood" had more value in "chipping" than processing it for sawn product. I could see the bid for this kind of job having more to do with machine usage (here anyway) than product production but I could be wrong. I don't know what is gotten money wise for a large trailer of "chips".

Anyway, it's stuff that goes beyond my understanding within my antiquated framework. I will conjecture that seemingly, the only people making money are the people constructing the field and I'm not sure that the mechanical equipment wasn't owned by the company putting up the solar field.

 

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From what I saw there, I'd have to agree for the most part. Considering the amount of stems for the size of this site (minimal), I'd say the "wood" had more value in "chipping" than processing it for sawn product. I could see the bid for this kind of job having more to do with machine usage (here anyway) than product production but I could be wrong. I don't know what is gotten money wise for a large trailer of "chips".

Anyway, it's stuff that goes beyond my understanding within my antiquated framework. I will conjecture that seemingly, the only people making money are the people constructing the field and I'm not sure that the mechanical equipment wasn't owned by the company putting up the solar field.

Chips do not pay much. Where as a landowner might get $18 a ton for pulpwood, a landowner would get $1 a ton for biomass wood chips. That means an entire truckload of chips would net the landowner about $35. No zeros were inadvertently left off that last figure by the way...$35 for entire truckload of chips.

I did not really say it well, but what I was getting at was: a contractor doing land clearing can just pass his costs off to whomever is having the land clearing done. The sooner and better the landowner wants the job, the more it is going to cost them. In that sense it is up to the landowner whether the cost is worth doing the entire project or not. But for the contractor doing the land clearing, he will be getting his money.

But with logging, the money has to come from the wood being cut, and then sold. Obviously that is done all the time, it is just that there is no guarantee the contractor will make money with every wood lot they get.

 

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It is interesting because I clear a lot of land, mostly just on my own land, but occasionally for other people. I like it, but to keep costs down on my own land, I clear the stumps about 5 years after I cut the wood off. I do that because I want as much stumps and brush to rot down as much as they can. That puts more nutrients in the soil, and as a farmer, that is what I want.

By waiting, I can also use smaller equipment because those big stumps have rotted down.

In some ways it sucks, because I am paying taxes for 5 years when the acreage is not really making me money in the form of being a woodlot, or making me money in being the form of an agricultural field. But it is a whole lot easier to clear the land of stumps.

Here, we have about 250-300 stumps per acre, of various sizes of course, and typically I can clear 2 acres per 10 hour day.

I have cleared 120 acres of forest on me so far, but at this time I have no plans to clear any more. It all comes down to the value of wood, and the cost of taxes. It is nearing the point now where wood has so little value that what I am growing in a per acre, per year basis, that it is almost what I am spending in property taxes. In other words, it is not really profitable to have a woodlot here any more. That is why a lot of landowners here are selling their land. They just cannot afford to pay the taxes on larger lots any more.

The pay-off for having that land in field is much, much greater, but it just takes a lot of money to make the conversion.

Doing it myself, I figure my cost per acre is around $201 per acre, but having it done by a land clearing contractor ranges from $900-$3000 per acre, depending on what they do. $900 is just grinding down the stumps. $3000 is going from stumps to grass growing on graded land.

It does not seem like much per acre, but do the math and it is shocking: 120 acres times $3000 per acre equates to $360,000.

 

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It is interesting because I clear a lot of land, mostly just on my own land, but occasionally for other people. I like it, but to keep costs down on my own land, I clear the stumps about 5 years after I cut the wood off. I do that because I want as much stumps and brush to rot down as much as they can. That puts more nutrients in the soil, and as a farmer, that is what I want.

By waiting, I can also use smaller equipment because those big stumps have rotted down.

In some ways it sucks, because I am paying taxes for 5 years when the acreage is not really making me money in the form of being a woodlot, or making me money in being the form of an agricultural field. But it is a whole lot easier to clear the land of stumps.

Here, we have about 250-300 stumps per acre, of various sizes of course, and typically I can clear 2 acres per 10 hour day.

I have cleared 120 acres of forest on me so far, but at this time I have no plans to clear any more. It all comes down to the value of wood, and the cost of taxes. It is nearing the point now where wood has so little value that what I am growing in a per acre, per year basis, that it is almost what I am spending in property taxes. In other words, it is not really profitable to have a woodlot here any more. That is why a lot of landowners here are selling their land. They just cannot afford to pay the taxes on larger lots any more.

The pay-off for having that land in field is much, much greater, but it just takes a lot of money to make the conversion.

Doing it myself, I figure my cost per acre is around $201 per acre, but having it done by a land clearing contractor ranges from $900-$3000 per acre, depending on what they do. $900 is just grinding down the stumps. $3000 is going from stumps to grass growing on graded land.

It does not seem like much per acre, but do the math and it is shocking: 120 acres times $3000 per acre equates to $360,000.

Here, stump price for cordwood is $25-$35 per cord. The trucks used to haul chips are enclosed trailers 60' long. Your pricing for chips seems to correlate for stump price. (around here anyway) ..

There is a couple down the road from me who sold 10 acres to a solar developer company. They are both in their 70's. The 10 acres (which would go for approx $300,000 around here) nets them $50K per year for life from the solar company. The company does not come forth with a "buy" price for the land but instead, strings it out in yearly returns for the seller.

I am quite sure that this is all part of the deal that includes the land, trees, wood and development costs.

 

[Rustyiron]

I imagine that Arrow's example in RI, any wood value was "incidental" to the project and actually a negative budget item being in what has to be very expensive real estate market. I've seen similar development clearing projects where all the wood was pushed over with the stump attached. All the logs went through the 1000 hp chipper and the stumps cut off and ground up in the tub grinder. Large excavating contractors only and not a logger or skidder in sight. (except me scrounging firewood on the weekend's :laughing

 

[Jstpssng]

I imagine that Arrow's example in RI, any wood value was "incidental" to the project and actually a negative budget item being in what has to be very expensive real estate market. I've seen similar development clearing projects where all the wood was pushed over with the stump attached. All the logs went through the 1000 hp chipper and the stumps cut off and ground up in the tub grinder. Large excavating contractors only and not a logger or skidder in sight. (except me scrounging firewood on the weekend's :laughing

I saw that years ago while working in southern Maine... the CU I belonged to had a circular drive with a nice grove of tall, straight white pine trees about 1/2th acre in size. They needed more parking so those trees are now landfill under the asphalt. It wasn't much in the overall scheme of things but still rather sickening. Then I helped build a golf course down in South Portland on 200 acres of former timberland. As you said, I watched as they chipped everything; hardwood logs, softwood logs, pulpwood... they didn't want to tie up space for a yard.

 

[3Ts]

I have an idea as to what a mulcher would cost me to hire, but sometimes it would be worth bigger equipment, so how does one find a contractor with a tub grinder? What kind of price would I be looking at.

 

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I have an idea as to what a mulcher would cost me to hire, but sometimes it would be worth bigger equipment, so how does one find a contractor with a tub grinder? What kind of price would I be looking at.

Here they charge about $3000 per acre, but at that price, they require quite a few acres to justify bringing in all their heavy equipment. Land clearing is not cheap...

 

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I saw that years ago while working in southern Maine... the CU I belonged to had a circular drive with a nice grove of tall, straight white pine trees about 1/2th acre in size. They needed more parking so those trees are now landfill under the asphalt. It wasn't much in the overall scheme of things but still rather sickening. Then I helped build a golf course down in South Portland on 200 acres of former timberland. As you said, I watched as they chipped everything; hardwood logs, softwood logs, pulpwood... they didn't want to tie up space for a yard.

It was like that on Scott Paper Land back in the 1980's. They wanted softwood. They would not want to cut hardwood, but if it was in the way, the rule was, just fell the tree and leave it. As I said, they wanted softwood.

I never thought I would see the day where they no longer want softwood, but rather only want hardwood.

I have not heard yet what the wood market is like now that Jay blew its boiler sky high. Are they taking wood?

 

[Jstpssng]

I have not heard yet what the wood market is like now that Jay blew its boiler sky high. Are they taking wood?

No. We literally got the "stop" call while the place was still burning; less than an hour after the explosion. They currently are getting prices for pulpwood so that they can continue with paper making while rebuilding the boilers.