Tractors to avoid...

CMunger · Oct 27, 2005

I have been told that John Deere used this Ford SOS transmission design for the basis of their Power Shift which appeared in the "60's". Ford was later critisized for droping this transmission, for if they had stayed with it, they would have been the leader in "Power Shift" transmissions
Chuck M.

Jim57 · Oct 27, 2005

Well, Tractors seem to have their problems just like automobiles. I guess anything mechanical is going to go down.

Thanks for the information. I will be sure not to purchase a used one with this type of trannie. I really appreciate all the knowledge and friendship here at TBN. Information like this could help prevent people from making mistakes like I have in the past.

In my book TBN and the members here are Great!!.

Jim

Farmwithjunk · Oct 28, 2005

( I have been told that John Deere used this Ford SOS transmission design for the basis of their Power Shift which appeared in the "60's". Ford was later critisized for droping this transmission, for if they had stayed with it, they would have been the leader in "Power Shift" transmissions
Chuck M. )

Who ever told you that needs 50 lashes. Simply not true. They are two COMPLETELY different designs. The "urban legend" about the SOS and the PowerShift started with the Chief Engineer from Ford leaving Ford to join John Deere about the time they started to design the 1010/2010/3010/4010/5010 series. His name escapes me now, but he was chief design engineer on the 9N/2N/8N Ford, then on the 3010/4010 Deere. Those units were the most successful models ever from Ford and Deere.
With the correct dates, you would see that Deere started design of the PowerShift BEFORE Ford started on their SOS.

1savoy · Oct 28, 2005

The only two, other than the Ford SOS models, that come to mind are the John Deere 1010 and 2010. Don't confuse these with the 1020 and 2020, which are great tractors.

Good Luck,
Russ

Jrrcorp · Oct 29, 2005

I can recommend Kubota and John Deere being an owner of both. Dealer service is of paramount importance. Track record of any tractor you look at is very important. If your looking for a machine to plow snow and mow lawn, you can go below 30 HP. I had a 27.5 HP Kubota that did everything I asked of it. 4WD is a must in my opinion at any HP range. My JD 4410 is 35 HP and the difference in HP is notable but then it's hydrostatic drive compared to the Kubota which was straight gear drive. Weight plays a factor here also. So, you need to determine what you are going to use the tractor for and under what conditions in order to determine the HP range you need. Most of the brand names have reliable repair records and long term parts availability, however that is where dealer service enters into the equation. Take someone along with you who has some experience with tractors if possible, when you look at and drive a used tractor. JMOP

RonR · Nov 2, 2005

I purchased a Ford 861 (probably about '62 model year IIRC) from Grandpa's estate. It was the only way we could keep the tractor on the site until the farm sales were over, as everything was supposed to be liquidated. This tractor was rode hard, never maintained, and abused.

It had the SOS tranny. Prior to buying the unit, I spoke with a local Ford dealer. His words, like many stated here, were that if you needed to work on the tranny, scrap the tractor. So going in, I knew it would be grim.

This tractor, though probably having relatively few hours, had stuff leaking everywhere. Often, when Grandpa was alive, I'd check the oil only to find NOTHING on the stick! The oil pressure gage barely moved when running. The Power Steering only intermittenly worked. It had a regular FEL on it.

I replaced PS hoses, oil pump (which only helped a little), and a lot of seals. Ran it for 2 years and the tranny held up fine. Sold it then and both the new owner and I were happy. He had a twin tractor and he was going to make one good one out of the two.

Ron

Farmwithjunk · Nov 2, 2005

( The only two, other than the Ford SOS models, that come to mind are the John Deere 1010 and 2010. Don't confuse these with the 1020 and 2020, which are great tractors.

Good Luck,
Russ )

The 1010 and 2010 Deere's are a bit misunderstood.

When Deere was researching the "New Generation" tractors through the late 1950's, 90% of the engineering went to the 4010 and then the 3010. Even the "future" 5010 was stealing a lot of attention. The 1010 and 2010 were merely a re-hash of the 430 and 530, only with a 4 cylinder engine. The 1010 shared a LOT of parts with the 430.

The 1010 wasn't that bad of a tractor. Slightly under-powered, and slightly behind the times compared to the "space-aged" designs of the 3010/4010. But all in all, still not a bad LITTLE tractor.

The 2010 was a decent tractor EXCEPT for the engine. (That's a BIG "except".) The design of the 4 cylinder engine used on the 2010 was a revolutionary idea. It employed what was known as a "Siamese cylider bore" All 4 cylinders, and the deck surface were cast in one piece. It then was set in the block. It had inherent cooling problems, tended to shift with use (heat) causing the rings and pistons to loose their fit, and a host of other problems. The gas version wasn't so bad. The diesels were where the real problem was at. (They tended to loose their "seal" between block and head too) Later versions of the 2010 had the bugs worked out (1963/64 models) But by that time, the damage was done. The 3020/4020 models came out in late 1963, as 1964 models. The 1010 and 2010 were replaced in 1965 with the 820, 1020, 1520, and 2020. (as the new "current line" of Dubuque tractors) They were all that AND a bag of chips! The 2010 fell into obscurity.

If you find (even a diesel) 2010 still around today, you can almost bet it had the updated version of the troubled engine, or it PROBABLY wouldn't still be in service.

Soundguy · Nov 2, 2005

( purchased a Ford 861 (probably about '62 model year IIRC) ......It had the SOS tranny. )

er... That would make it an 821, 831, 871, 881 etc.. if it had the SOS tranny.

861 is an 801 series ( 172ci engine ), made from 58-62

the 6 denotes a 5 spd stacked tranny with live pto via a 2 stage clutch. 851 would be same with nonlive pto / single plate clutch.

Soundguy

1savoy · Nov 2, 2005

Farmwithjunk,

I thought the 2010 was also known for having tranny problems. I may be mistaken, but I thought I had heard that over the years.

Thanks,
Russ

Farmwithjunk · Nov 2, 2005

As far as I know the 2010 didn't have any issues with the tranny, other than this little gem..... At the time when they were introduced, common logic of the day was to stack TONS of ballast on a tractor, and pull as big of an implement as it would pull. The "New Generation" tractors were designed to pull small implements at a faster speed than was previously "common". Some 2010's got 3 or 4 THOUSAND lbs of ballast stacked on them and they ended up toting around 4 bottom plows at 2-1/2 to 3 mph. They were intended to pull a 2 or 3 bottom plow at speed approaching 4 or 5 mph. The added loads were more than some tranny parts were ment to handle, causing some problems.

It all falls back on using something the way it was intended.