tree clearing advice needed

[horses2]

I am reclaiming several acres of our property that have "gone back to nature". i have already cleaned up the old dump piles. (the previous owners drank a LOT of beer, I got about $200 recycling all the old beer cans).

At this point there are a bunch of trees to come down, and instead of cutting down then grinding or digging stumps, I can rent a CAT 953C crawler loader, and was thinking of just pushing the trees down, and using the ripper to pull any roots left. The trees are mostly about a foot in diameter, and there are several big ones about 2 ft in diameter.

do you think the CAT is big enough to do this, and how big of a tree can this machine uproot?

Thanks,

 

[DT86]

It can be done.

This is my preferred method whether using the backhoe or tractor. Start out by digging around the tree to bust through as many roots as possible, you can then put the loose dirt right back in the hole. Next reach up almost as high as you can in the tree and push it over. Once it's over I try to knock as much of the dirt off the root ball as possible to minimize the hole to be filled up.

 

[Arc weld]

Have you run a track loader much? A 953C is good size machine(30,000lb+) but might have a problem with a 2' dia. tree. The biggest problem with doing brush work is it can be unpredictable. The tree's and branches don't always do what you want them to so you have to be really focused on everything around you. If you haven't run a crawler much, it might be better to hire the work out to someone with experience. A track hoe is really good for tree's because you can shake most of the dirt off and make piles really easy.

 

[diesel lover]

I got to tell you from personal experience a small backhoe works great to dig out all of the roots! But stumps are hard to remove no doubt about that

 

[EddieWalker]

I've never tried it with a track loader, but have my doubts it's the best tool for the job. Trees are all about the roots, once you get them free, the tree falls over pretty easily where you push it. If you snap a tree off and leave the root ball in the ground, it's ten times as much work getting it out because you don't have the leverage of the tree helping you.

I use a full sized, 80 hp, backhoe to take out trees. I've taken out thousands of them this way, and my 80 year old dad has take out a lot more them I have this was also. For small trees, you just push them over and then drag over the root ball with the teeth and pull them out. Fast, easy and clean. You don't disturb the ground very much and you don't have a lot of dirt left on the roots to deal with in your burn pile.

For bigger trees, you first dig the side you want it to fall, then the opposite side. Then change positions to where you want to push it over from and then dig out the other two sides of the root ball. Then reach up with the hoe stick and push it over. If it doesn't go, take out more dirt and try again. With a little practice, you'll learn how deep to dig depending on the size and type of tree.

I have a grapple that I can put on my loader instead of my bucket. I use that to pick up the trees and take them to the burn pile. For bigger trees, I wrap a chain around them and drag them to the pile. Having a grapple makes it easier to clean up the mess. That is where all the work is. Taking down the trees is easy, getting the area cleaned up is where you will be working the hardest and stressing the most.

I've done some clearing with my Case 1550 dozer, which is equal to a Cat D6 in size and power. 180 hp and 40,000 pounds. I cut the roots with the blade and dig down some, then get the blade up as high as I can and push them over. If the ground is still a little wet, they go over easy enough. If the ground is dry, it's a battle. Sometimes I snap them off and have to use the backhoe to dig out the stump. If they are smaller trees, I can clear a lot of land quite a bit faster then using the backhoe, but the mess created by all the down trees tangled up in each other, and the damaged done to the ground digging them up is massive. The clean up takes forever!!!!! Having the two options, I don't even consider the dozer for clearing trees anymore.

If I had more money, I would buy an excavator with a thumb to take out trees, and a 4x4 tractor with a grapple to haul them to the burn pile. The backhoe does it all, but I think the excavator would be more maneuverable and powerful. Same thing with a tractor with more traction.

Good luck,
Eddie

 

[s219]

We used a track hoe (excavator) with a thumb on the bucket to clear our building site, and it was amazing. The amount of progress made each day was impressive. Having tried and considered other options that left me disappointed, I think the track hoe is the ultimate clearing tool.

We have mostly loblolly pines on this property, but also some beeches, oaks, poplars, and maples. I had gone in and sawed/skidded the valuable lumber/firewood trees with my Kubota, then the track hoe came through and hit everything else. I left some stumps high so the hoe could pop them out easily, and cut others low if I felt they were out of the way and could be left undisturbed.

In retrospect, I could have sawed a bit lower and not left the stumps so high. I had cut them at 4' high, which believe me, is a high cut when holding a 77cc saw (in a few cases I built a simple platform to stand comfortably if it was a tricky spot). The track hoe operator popped out one stump his guy cut at only 18" high with hardly any extra effort.

 

[horses2]

Thanks for the input. looks like my best bet is to cut the trees down then go after the stumps with an excavator. what would be the best height to leave the stumps?

 

[MikeInEburg]

Like others, my method has been to put a rope very high in the tree and tie it off. Then, with backhoe, dig out three sides opposite the rope direction. Then pull the tree down with amazing ease and directional stability. The tree levers the root ball right out if the ground.

 

[EddieWalker]

Thanks for the input. looks like my best bet is to cut the trees down then go after the stumps with an excavator. what would be the best height to leave the stumps?

Why would you cut the tree first? Losing the leverage of the tree means you have to work a lot harder and longer to get the root out, no matter how tall you leave the stump. The leverage is in the full height of the tree, not just a few feet. If you are going to use an excavator anyway to take out the root ball, why eliminate a step and use it to take out the entire tree?

If you are renting the excavator, you can use a smaller machine to take out the tree whole then you will need to take out the root ball in the same amount of time. I would say that you need to double the size of the excavator to be efficient with your time, and more then likely, that wont be big enough since the root balls can be so time consuming to dig out.

An 8 ton excavator would be the minimum I'd consider to take out an entire tree of any size. 12 to 16 would be even better. For stumps, I would want something in the 20 ton range to clear land in the same amount of time. Or if you went with a 12 ton rental, which is pretty standard around here, you could take out twice as many trees as you could stumps in the same amount of time, but once you get the hang of taking out trees, you should be able to take out the trees even faster, while stump removal is always going to be slow and tedious in comparison.

Eddie

 

[corl]

Lot of good advice. I am sure you will be able to accomplish your goal, no matter which method you chose.

When I was a little kid my father built a house on top of a mountain in the 1940s. First he had to clear the land of trees. Mostly tulip popular. As I remember they were about 1 foot + in diameter . He cut the trees down with an axe about 5 feet off the ground. He then took a 3/8 inch log chain and wrapped it around the top of the stump and pulled out the stumps with an old army jeep. He would attach the log chain to the jeep and back up close to the tree stump and then accelerate away from the tree to the end of the chain. He pushed in the clutch and let the weight of the little jeep pull on the stump. The first charge to the end of the chain didn't do much but after 20 or 30 charges the stump was moving and eventually came out. Pretty amazing when you think about it. He cleared at least 1/2 acre this way. He then dug the foundation of the house with that same jeep and a home made plow.Years later the rest was cleared with a dozer. When you think that this country was mostly forrest when it was settled and the early settlers cleared the land to farm with their hands and some help from oxen, we have come a long way in this discussion.

 

[s219]

Thanks for the input. looks like my best bet is to cut the trees down then go after the stumps with an excavator. what would be the best height to leave the stumps?

I'd only recommend that if you want the timber to remain in pristine condition or there is some other reason to pull out the timber before the ground work (ie, productivity, time constraints, etc). Otherwise, push the tree over first then either dispose of it, or cut off the stump and deal with the butt log at that point. The longer the tree, the easier the task, except in cases where you may not have room to push it over without doing damage.

In my case, the crew running the track hoe moved fast and was focused on harvesting pines for the paper mill. For any valuable hardwood or firewood/lumber trees, I had to go in weeks in advance and cut and skid logs myself. That's why I left high stumps.

 

[arrow]

Depends on what you are doing with the trees afterward. If there is any money to be made at the local mill, cut them down and stack the stems. Clean out the stumps with an excavator. I've been to many a sight where trees were in the way and had to be cleared. If you can rent a decent size excavator for the same money as the crawler, its the most cost effective way. Now, if you do not care or are unable to take advantage of the money in the wood and plan to bury or burn everything, rent the crawler . It is a good machine for this work. As i have cut many a root ball from its trunk, I think it a pain in the butt to free up a stem in that fashion for larger trees. I'd much rather just drop the tree. A stump that is left 3 ft high is a cake walk for a 20 ton excavator.

 

[horses2]

I agree with corl, it is amazing to think that the settlers had an axe and maybe an oxen or cow. talk about manual labor.

My intention is to buck the red oaks into 16 ft lengths to have them sawm into fence boards. As for a large excavator, I am not good enough to operate one of those. I can easily see myself wiping out a bunch of stuff other than the trees. Also, the price on the crawler is quite reasonable, so I will most likely spend the extra time in digging out the stumps.

Thanks again to all for the advice.

 

[arrow]

I agree with corl, it is amazing to think that the settlers had an axe and maybe an oxen or cow. talk about manual labor.

My intention is to buck the red oaks into 16 ft lengths to have them sawm into fence boards. As for a large excavator, I am not good enough to operate one of those. I can easily see myself wiping out a bunch of stuff other than the trees. Also, the price on the crawler is quite reasonable, so I will most likely spend the extra time in digging out the stumps.

Thanks again to all for the advice.

Well if there is a price difference in the two i can see a decision based on that but an excavator is one of the most funnest things you'll learn to operate. It will probably be 3 to 4 times faster stump yanking than the crawler as you'll probably take out 5 to 8 stumps (or more depending on density) before you have to move it. You'd get the hang of it in a half hour. This is a job where both machines have their place. This sounds like a fun project and if I lived closer to you, i'd pitch in and be in my old glory days. When a clear cutting job came up, we'd play the game of who could take the most trees down with one felling cut. It was like playing chess or pool and if you did it right, dominoes. You'd see where a tree was going to fall then make a notch and a slight back cut on the trees in succession of initial fall direction. Taking two out was common place. 3 was quite the trick. Anything more than that was luck.

 

[crowbar032]

I actually have a 953 that I bought it to clean up honey locust trees and drive fence posts on 80 acres. As others have said, trees the size you listed will pose no issue pushing them over root and all. I've pushed over much larger trees. You have to be careful on larger trees though as the root ball will pop out under the belly in between the tracks leaving you high pointed and stuck. Also, a problem you will probably have is that you'll break or cut the trunk, then you'll have to dig out the stumps. My bucket actually has sharpened plates between the teeth that will shear/cut roots and trunks. Any trees that you would attempt to cut with a bushhog (3-4 in.) will not be easily grubbed out as they just bend over. I wasn't concerned about lumber or firewood, so I just pushed everything into a pile and burned it later. I also have better luck with the ground slightly damp as it gives more letting the roots pop out. Dry hard ground usually breaks the trunk right at the top of the ground.

 

[MotorSeven]

Also, use the excavator to buck them up by slightly lifting the tree off the ground reliving the pinch pressure between root ball and tree top. Root ball first, then top the tree down to the trunk & buck it up while it is also off the ground. This is ten times easier than trying to buck it while the whole tree just lays on the ground.

If you plan on having a fireplace of wood stove, buck into proper lengths then split/stack someplace off the ground(I used cross ties to stack on...keeps the buggs away)