Loader True Third Function- factory or do it myself

[paulwestski]

The Kubota L4240 that i have on order should be ready for delivery in a few weeks.

I'm on the fence whether to source the parts myself for the third function or just order the Kubota kit. I'm very comfortable installing either myself. I added four remotes to my L3800. Designed and fabricated the valve and quick connect mounting bracket locations and all plumbing routing.

We all say wow $900 for third function....I could probably do that for much less myself.

The kubota kit is only about $400 more than sourcing all of the parts myself.

I've looked at all of the Kubota parts diagrams and they use a ton of hard lines, between the pump and valve, valve to valve, along the loader arm, and have all of the brackets fabbed and painted, quick connects dust covers, complete new loader control lever with joystick, switches, relays, wiring, connectors, nuts, bolts, screws etc. If you look at the quantity of parts it's not really overpriced and makes for a very clean install.

The Kubota kit is a "true third function" not just a diverter valve. Which of course means curl, lift and grapple can all work at the same time......and yes I currently, at times use all three at the same time. If the grapple was controlled by a rocker switch on the loader control I can see opportunities to use it even more often.

The only two downsides of the factory kit is the additional cost and not being able to spend quality fab time in the shop building it.
Now if I can get my sales guy to give me a good price on the kit!

Would anyone with the factory third function please reply with their likes and dislikes of the factory setup????
Pictures of the mounting location of the valve would be nice also.
Anyone have the LA854 loader installation instructions ?
I think that they cover the third function install.....would be nice to get a scanned copy PLEASE...

 

[David_Kb7uns]

W.R. Long kit

Have the W.R .Long kit on the L3130 and like it the kit is also a third function. Have heard of problems of the Kubota kit on the Lxx40 with valve sticking in some uses.

David Kb7uns

 

[hawkeye08]

W.R. Long kit

Have the W.R .Long kit on the L3130 and like it the kit is also a third function. Have heard of problems of the Kubota kit on the Lxx40 with valve sticking in some uses.

David Kb7uns

Where did you buy this kit and what was the part number? (I too have a L3130 and have looked adding 3rd function)

To the OP, I like factory parts when I can afford them. If beyond my budget and I can't wait, I usually cobble (not pretty) something together...

 

[EverythingAttachments]

We offer the WR Long 3rd Function Hydraulic kits. They are made specifically for your tractor and we order them complete with hoses and 1/2" ag couplers.
The kit will ship free to your home within 1,000 miles of Newton, NC.
Here is a video:

 

[ovrszd]

You might lean on your dealer a little and get him to install the Kubota kit if you purchase it thru him. Seems that's the normal offering of the dealers.

In my case I bought my tractor and then installed the Kubota third function and added two more rear remotes. Yep, they are more expensive than aftermarket options. But what I like is the ease of use. Everything is where it should be and very comfortable to use. The plumbing for the third function is built to fit the loader frame and came with all the necessary hardware for a perfect, easy install.

On my old Kubota L4400 I added third function by replacing the factory valve with a valve that had a third function operated by a second lever. Then I mounted the original loader valve on the fender and added two remotes to the rear. It worked fine. But was bulky and out of place. That's why I bought factory kits this time. I use my hydraulics every time I use my tractor. I figure ease of use and quality product pays for itself over time. I've put 350 hours on my tractor in 8 months.

 

[jenkinsph]

While I am sure you can handle the install I would just have the dealer install it on a new machine. Eliminate problems if there is a warranty issue, I try to keep my own wrenching to a minimum while equipment is in warranty. I check to make sure bolts are tight and do the fluid changes myself during that time frame.

 

[paulwestski]

We offer the WR Long 3rd Function Hydraulic kits. They are made specifically for your tractor and we order them complete with hoses and 1/2" ag couplers.
The kit will ship free to your home within 1,000 miles of Newton, NC.
Here is a video:

Yeah I know you guys carry the WR long kit but......MSRP on the Kubota kit is only $80.00 more and is a super nice kit.
Steel lines that run down the loader arms.
I hope that the dealer can discount the kit for me.

I'm curious where does the WR Long kit tie into the hydraulic system on a Kubota Grand L series?
On a standard l series I know exactly where it would tie in.
I'm pretty certain the backhoe hydraulics use the available Power beyond from the loader valve on a grand.
The Kubota factory third function kit ties in before the loader valve with all new steel lines and banjo fittings.

Thanks for the replies.
If anyone could take some photos of their valve location would be great.

 

[94BULLITT]

The dealer should install the 3rd function for free while they are setting it up.

 

[crazyal]

Are you sure that the 3rd function is a true remote? For some reason I thought it wasn't so I was never really interested in adding one. If you buy the valve at the same time as the tractor your dealer may also give you the same discount that they gave you on the tractor. When I bought my 4240 I didn't get rear remotes because I didn't know enough about them to make an educated decision. I wish I had because they are a lot more complex than I realized and I really like the factory look of them.

 

[EverythingAttachments]

I'm curious where does the WR Long kit tie into the hydraulic system on a Kubota Grand L series?
On a standard l series I know exactly where it would tie in.

I don't know where it ties in but Nelson @ WR Long can surely tell you. You'll probably also get more feedback here from people with the kits.
I wouldn't blame you for getting a discounted OEM kit and I respect the DIYers.
People like the WR Long kits because they're quick and easy. They are very well known because of their reputation for quality and reliability.
Travis

 

[J_J]

paulwestski ,

Logically, the 3ed function should be after the FEL, so the FEL relief will protect the 3ed function operation.

On your 3ed function kit installation, where is the relief valve for the 3ed function, before or after?

Did they come off the hyd block and then to the 3ed function, and then to the FEL?

Does your FEL valve have a relief valve, or is the tractor relief valve in the hyd block?

If you 3ed function is before your FEL valve, if you activate the 3ed function, does it not shut off the flow to the rest of the implement hydraulics. Solenoid operation is usually full on or off, except for proportional solenoid circuitry.

If the 3ed function valve is after the FEL valve, then if you are only using half lever on the FEL valve, there is fluid for the 3ed function.

 

[ovrszd]

Are you sure that the 3rd function is a true remote? For some reason I thought it wasn't so I was never really interested in adding one.

My OEM 3rd function is simply a solenoid operated hydraulic valve that is plumbed using the PB from the loader valve assembly. In my opinion it's a true remote but maybe someone with more hydraulic savvy than I can answer that for sure.

It's definitely not a diverter valve setup which I wasn't interested in having. When shopping for my tractor I looked at a NH T4050. One thing I didn't like was that they use a diverter valve to operate their 3rd function thru the bucket tip circuit.

 

[J_J]

If there is a 3ed function, where is the first and second function?

Is it just an extra circuit, and is it self protecting.

Is there a forth function, and so on down the line?

 

[EverythingAttachments]

If anyone can solve it, you can J_J. Your posts quite often amaze me!
Travis

 

[ovrszd]

If there is a 3ed function, where is the first and second function?

Is it just an extra circuit, and is it self protecting.

Is there a forth function, and so on down the line?

Knowing my hyrdaulic knowledge is lacking, I'll tackle these questions.

In my case, first function is loader boom lift, second function is bucket curl. Then the PB of the loader valve is plumbed to the IN of the 3rd function valve. So as JJ described earlier, if I am not using 100% of the capacity of my tractor's system in the first two functions, there is flow leftover to cause action in the 3rd function. When I reach 100% flow capacity of the tractor, all flow beyond stops.

Hmmmm,,, is it an extra circuit and self protected?? I'm gonna guess no on extra circuit, it's simply a continuation of the circuit supplying flow to my loader valve because it comes off the PB. Same with my rear remotes and 3pt, they too are continuations of the original circuit. With that I'd say my tractor only has one circuit. As for self protected,,, I'm gonna guess that it is not.

As for fourth function and so on down the line. Yes. My tractor starts at the loader valve supplying boom lift and curl, then 3rd function, then rear remotes, then 3pt lift.

How'd I do JJ??

 

[RaydaKub]

Knowing my hyrdaulic knowledge is lacking, I'll tackle these questions.

In my case, first function is loader boom lift, second function is bucket curl. Then the PB of the loader valve is plumbed to the IN of the 3rd function valve. So as JJ described earlier, if I am not using 100% of the capacity of my tractor's system in the first two functions, there is flow leftover to cause action in the 3rd function. When I reach 100% flow capacity of the tractor, all flow beyond stops.

Hmmmm,,, is it an extra circuit and self protected?? I'm gonna guess no on extra circuit, it's simply a continuation of the circuit supplying flow to my loader valve because it comes off the PB. Same with my rear remotes and 3pt, they too are continuations of the original circuit. With that I'd say my tractor only has one circuit. As for self protected,,, I'm gonna guess that it is not.

As for fourth function and so on down the line. Yes. My tractor starts at the loader valve supplying boom lift and curl, then 3rd function, then rear remotes, then 3pt lift.

How'd I do JJ??

I'm hydraulically challenged. Are you saying that if I have 2 remotes (fel, curl) that my 3ph basically is 3rd in line? And if I added a 3rd valve for either a grapple or something in the rear, that the 3ph then becomes 4th in line and so on? I would have guessed that the 3ph would be first in line because it is "right there" in the rear end. But it sounds like it is really last.

Sent from my iPad using TractorByNet

 

[J_J]

RaydaKub

Your 3pt is usually last valve in series and dumps into the hyd tank.

 

[J_J]

Knowing my hyrdaulic knowledge is lacking, I'll tackle these questions.

In my case, first function is loader boom lift, second function is bucket curl. Then the PB of the loader valve is plumbed to the IN of the 3rd function valve. So as JJ described earlier, if I am not using 100% of the capacity of my tractor's system in the first two functions, there is flow leftover to cause action in the 3rd function. When I reach 100% flow capacity of the tractor, all flow beyond stops.

Hmmmm,,, is it an extra circuit and self protected?? I'm gonna guess no on extra circuit, it's simply a continuation of the circuit supplying flow to my loader valve because it comes off the PB. Same with my rear remotes and 3pt, they too are continuations of the original circuit. With that I'd say my tractor only has one circuit. As for self protected,,, I'm gonna guess that it is not.

As for fourth function and so on down the line. Yes. My tractor starts at the loader valve supplying boom lift and curl, then 3rd function, then rear remotes, then 3pt lift.

How'd I do JJ??

Don't know where the 3ed function came from or a definition for for the term.

Although open center hyd circuits have all valves in series, they should always have a relief valve before any other hyd component after the pump.

In a closed center hyd system, there is usually a single relief valve close by the pump, and the other hyd valve do not need a relief valve.

If the 3ed function is first in line from the pump, I would say that it is not protected.

If it comes off the hyd blk, there is usually a relief valve on the hyd block.

I think of a a 3ed function as an extra circuit that can be used for just about anything, grapple, 4-1 bucket. etc.

3ed function valves are also PB capable if the flow is available. .

Sometimes the 3ed function may not have full pump flow, due to other valves/cyl using the hyd fluid.

A 3ed function can be used independently of any other hyd circuit as long as there is an external relief valve before the 3ed function.

I did find this excerpt for a CAT brochure.

Auxiliary Hydraulics
Auxiliary hydraulics provide
unparalleled versatility allowing you to
select the configuration that best suits
your application. Third function only
or packaged with fourth enables the use
of almost all work tools. Fifth and sixth
function hydraulics are also available
for responsive independent positioning
of work tools with multiple hydraulic
cylinders such as snow plows with
hydraulically movable snow wings

 

[paulwestski]

paulwestski ,

Logically, the 3ed function should be after the FEL, so the FEL relief will protect the 3ed function operation.

On your 3ed function kit installation, where is the relief valve for the 3ed function, before or after?

Did they come off the hyd block and then to the 3ed function, and then to the FEL?

Does your FEL valve have a relief valve, or is the tractor relief valve in the hyd block?

If you 3ed function is before your FEL valve, if you activate the 3ed function, does it not shut off the flow to the rest of the implement hydraulics. Solenoid operation is usually full on or off, except for proportional solenoid circuitry.

If the 3rd function valve is after the FEL valve, then if you are only using half lever on the FEL valve, there is fluid for the 3ed function.

JJ
I've been studying the parts diagrams for the kubota 3rd function and loader. The best I can determine is the 3rd function comes directly off of the Hydro pump and then feeds the loader valve, loader valve feeds the top cover of the transmission, which feeds both the rear remotes and the three point.

What I really need is the installation manual for the Kubota 3rd function option.

 

[paulwestski]

JJ is the winner:thumbsup:
The hydraulic block included with the Kubota 3rd function kit does contain a relief.
Part 170 on the parts diagram.
Lesson learned here...Pay attention all you workshop hydraulic engineers!!!!!
What JJ said...the first valve off of the pump or Hydro block must have the pressure relief in it.
When planning my home brew setup I did not consider this.
I don't believe the valves offered at Surplus center have the pressure relief in the subplate.