Turf (R3) tires better in snow - but why?

[CobyRupert]

I always read here than turf tires are better in snow, but why?

Is this only true when clearing snow and tires are really on a hard or frozen surface where the surface area of the tire in contact with the ground (combined with weight) creates the friction that propels? (Similar to how a bald tire has better traction on pavement?). Obviously a lugged tire doesn't have as much contact area with a hard surface.

Are R3 still better if snow is wet or packed if one is traveling on top of it? I'd think that a lugged tire that can dig into the snow would get better traction, as long a snow doesn't slip or get pushed back, then you're down to the hard surface again; or if the treads don't fill and become smooth (then wouldn't they'd be like a turf?).

 

[jeff9366]

Here are some germane threads:

tractor turf tires in snow - Google Search

 

[CobyRupert]

Yeah, I look through some of them prior (but obviously not all).

The majority of those are just testimonies, with no explanation.

One did mentioned that R3's have more edges because of their treads. This suggests that a lateral force (of the mini "lugs" digging in) rather than a frictional force is at play. This doesn't seem right.

 

[ruffdog]

Not all "turfs" act the same. The Titan's on my TC33D were very good with no added weight.

If you are driving through deep snow in a woods, big/deep lugs are good. Big flat tread lugs get real slippery on packed snow because there is limited tread corners and sipes. What kind of boots work on packed snow, ones that have no grooves or the ones with lots of tread edges? Winter tires for cars have lots of narrow grooves and sipes vs big blocks of rubber.

 

[SPYDERLK]

Yeah, I look through some of them prior (but obviously not all).

The majority of those are just testimonies, with no explanation.

One did mentioned that R3's have more edges because of their treads. This suggests that a lateral force (of the mini "lugs" digging in) rather than a frictional force is at play. This doesn't seem right.

There is virtually no friction on frozen water. It is a mechanical grip. Hence all the edges do well in shallow snow. As soon as you get to the point of packing - and then a slip the turfs start losing it and it goes bad fast. Thats where the Ags [R1] take care of you. They will chuff through deep snow consolidating it to treaded track. A slip tears out a piece and the lugs intense pressure bite the next all the way down to the ground or near it. There added traction is available and it continues to claw forward, either compacting and climbing back up and going, or moving the snow behind itself and going. It isnt pretty but sure more attractive than getting stuck. The next step beyond would be conventional chains on Turfs -- Then special chains that will ride lugs on R4 or R1. These last make a "killer" snow machine.

 

[mikester]

Sorry I disagree with the statement "turf tires are better in snow". My experience has been that my R4's are way better in snow, especially deep snow. I originally had turfs on my CUT and was constantly getting stuck driving off road. Hills were more than useless. Replacing the turfs with R4s on the same tractor was a day and night difference in traction. With over the front axel deep snow the R3's would go about 20 feet before I got buried and stuck. The R4's just plod along.

Turfs are meant for floatation. R4's are half way between R1's for traction and R3's for floatation.

Consider this - If floatation is better for winter traction people would install chain link fencing (similar to turf tread) to cover their tires not ladder style chains (similar to R4 or R1 style tread).

 

[unimog_jason]

In my non scientific experience, turfs work better on smooth hard packed surfaces but are useless in deeper snow.

In deeper snow, ag treads will work always work better but you really need chains and weight if you're going to try and get traction on a hard packed surface.

Jason

 

[ovrszd]

In regards to snow on a road surface. The rubber tire isn't what provides traction. Traction is provided by the friction of snow against snow. So the tire's ability to collect and hold snow in it's contact patch is equivalent to it's ability to provide traction. Consequently the tire with the most sipes, cavities and edges will always be better.

In regards to deep snow on a surface such as pasture, hay field, timber, etc. Traction in this situation is obtained by the tire's ability to displace the snow in large quantities and dig itself down to the good traction below. In this scenario the tire with the largest lug openings configured to self clean is best.

 

[CobyRupert]

In regards to snow on a road surface. The rubber tire isn't what provides traction. Traction is provided by the friction of snow against snow. So the tire's ability to collect and hold snow in it's contact patch is equivalent to it's ability to provide traction. Consequently the tire with the most sipes, cavities and edges will always be better.

In regards to deep snow on a surface such as pasture, hay field, timber, etc. Traction in this situation is obtained by the tire's ability to displace the snow in large quantities and dig itself down to the good traction below. In this scenario the tire with the largest lug openings configured to self clean is best.

I don't understand this. Are you saying if your treads fill up with snow, this snow's friction with the snow below it provides the traction?

 

[Jchonline]

For car tires, snow tires mainly help by having a softer rubber compound that doesnt get as hard in the winter, and therefore bites ice and snow more effectively.

I am curious if Turf tires are softer rubber than R1 or R4s?