I am going to look at a Vietnamese recondition tractor on friday. This will be my first serious look at one and needless to say I am a wee bit nervous. so in order to make myself fell better what are the most crucial things I should look at. I've read up but i am still nervous.
Vietnamese 1610D
- Thread starter Fat_Man
- Start date
- Views: 2225
mark777
Veteran Member
- Joined
- May 16, 2004
- Messages
- 1,300
- Location
- S.E Texas
- Tractor
- Ym1300d-1401D-1601D , 1610D & Massey Ferguson 1020
Fat Man,
I would be nervous too. I was just talking (email) to a gentleman who has the same predicament having found a 1300D Yanmar with 3 hours, FEL and, in my estamation, priced way too low. In fact a good FEL cost a little less than the whole package he is looking at.
What I know and what I dont know: I know the prices are unbeatable. Period.
Buyers, importers get 8 to 16 units for approx 35-40% less than containers from Japan.
There are uninformed or unsuspecting honest buyers and dealers.
There are many well informed buyers who sell via auction, walk ins and more recently Ebay. And I know they import containers there (Viet Nam), just like we do here. They do run them hard (compared to rice fields in Japan), abuse and neglect them until they break. 2 -3 years later they are made operational from several salvaged tractors and any part that will make it run will suffice. Only then are they containerized and sold here
They are very talented and successful considering their working conditions (a veteran mechanic makes $100 a month). Finally, parts suppliers consider them to be an owners worst nightmare.
What I dont know is how can an unsuspecting dealer answer honestly, the condition of a tractor imported from there?
How can a 25 year old tractor have 1 to 3 hours? And how can the same tractor be described as New, Reconditioned, excellent condition etc. etc. and state AS IS all in the same sentence?
Dealers that sell with limited warranty exclude labor, transportation, shipping costs and if it breaks may send you a used part that may (or may not) fix your problem and generally that is the limit to their limited warranty.
There are honest dealers with very good tractors right here (many on TBN) and BTW the 1610D is one of my favorites.
Personally, I would buy a YM in any condition, running or not, that has a known history of "from Japan to importer supplier to me".
I hope to hear from other responses/replies concerning this matter as it is becoming wide spread and most often dishonest - misleading - false representation.
Good Luck & Regards Mark
I would be nervous too. I was just talking (email) to a gentleman who has the same predicament having found a 1300D Yanmar with 3 hours, FEL and, in my estamation, priced way too low. In fact a good FEL cost a little less than the whole package he is looking at.
What I know and what I dont know: I know the prices are unbeatable. Period.
Buyers, importers get 8 to 16 units for approx 35-40% less than containers from Japan.
There are uninformed or unsuspecting honest buyers and dealers.
There are many well informed buyers who sell via auction, walk ins and more recently Ebay. And I know they import containers there (Viet Nam), just like we do here. They do run them hard (compared to rice fields in Japan), abuse and neglect them until they break. 2 -3 years later they are made operational from several salvaged tractors and any part that will make it run will suffice. Only then are they containerized and sold here
They are very talented and successful considering their working conditions (a veteran mechanic makes $100 a month). Finally, parts suppliers consider them to be an owners worst nightmare.
What I dont know is how can an unsuspecting dealer answer honestly, the condition of a tractor imported from there?
How can a 25 year old tractor have 1 to 3 hours? And how can the same tractor be described as New, Reconditioned, excellent condition etc. etc. and state AS IS all in the same sentence?
Dealers that sell with limited warranty exclude labor, transportation, shipping costs and if it breaks may send you a used part that may (or may not) fix your problem and generally that is the limit to their limited warranty.
There are honest dealers with very good tractors right here (many on TBN) and BTW the 1610D is one of my favorites.
Personally, I would buy a YM in any condition, running or not, that has a known history of "from Japan to importer supplier to me".
I hope to hear from other responses/replies concerning this matter as it is becoming wide spread and most often dishonest - misleading - false representation.
Good Luck & Regards Mark
YanmarFever
Elite Member
- Joined
- Mar 10, 2002
- Messages
- 3,357
- Location
- Eating a melon..
- Tractor
- Mahindra 5010C- Branson 4520r- 5520C- Yanmar FX235-D - Bad Boy rogue mower
Mark
There is nothing else to say,I think you said it better than I.
Who needs the head ache.
Vietnamese tractors are smoke & mirrors. I would buy one direct from japan or a US. model.
My opinion of course
There is nothing else to say,I think you said it better than I.
Who needs the head ache.
Vietnamese tractors are smoke & mirrors. I would buy one direct from japan or a US. model.
My opinion of course
Yeah that's pretty much what I figured a coat of paint can hide a multitude of sins. I'll look at it any way and see how it feels (if my copius posterior can comfortably fit in the seat). There aren't a lot locally to check out. If it looks like a good model for me I'll check some dealers north and south of me.
DavesTractor
Elite Member
Fat_Man,
I sent you a PM with some thoughts.
I sent you a PM with some thoughts.
California
Super Star Member
- Joined
- Jan 22, 2004
- Messages
- 14,932
- Location
- An hour north of San Francisco
- Tractor
- Yanmar YM240 Yanmar YM186D
</font><font color="blue" class="small">( I hope to hear from other responses/replies concerning this matter )</font>
Mark, the dealers who post here can't really say much without sounding self-serving so I hope my report as an independent retail customer sheds a little more light on this:
Here's the Sacramento importer/dealer for what seems to be VN reconditioned tractors:
http://tractormasters.com/
Location is off I-80 behind Fry's Electronics.
They have about 100-200 tractors in stock. The previous General Manager told me his brother owns a reconditioning plant in VN and said they bring over 200 per month. I wonder if this is the Western branch for Texas's Vina Tractor. Next time I returned I was told he had gone back to VN, and that many of their tractors are shipped direct from Japan without needing the VN reconditioning.
Tell Van (gorgeous young lady, probably the VN family's US representative) that you might start resales on Ebay or something, since they don't pay much attention to individual customers.
As others noted these tractors may be a big gamble, possibly assembled from several junkers then a paint job that is so excellent that the tractor seems new. I would prefer to buy from a trusted local dealer who adds a real warranty.
I have been buying minor parts there to get my Yanmar back to authentic OEM and I've had to take half of them back - they were not authentic for the year/model of the tractor I saw them stripped off of.
On the other hand I have talked to some small retailers who were buying multiple units when I was there, and none mentioned excessive waranty claims.
They offer only 30 day warranty which means stripping used parts off of anything that will fit - they have no parts inventory at all.
I think it's a 50/50 gamble, a lower price and no assurance of quality. For limited hobby use it may be worth the gamble but out of the question if a month or two downtime would hurt you.
I talked to an Iseki customer there who finally brought his own tools and started 'warranty' repairs himself with the help of their mechanics. There wasn't a similar Iseki in stock so he said the tractor had just sat there, I think he said well over 30 days, in hope that one would arrive. Without manuals, no one knew if the non-operative hydraulic controls were authentic for that model tractor or properly installed.
Caveat Emptor!
Mark, the dealers who post here can't really say much without sounding self-serving so I hope my report as an independent retail customer sheds a little more light on this:
Here's the Sacramento importer/dealer for what seems to be VN reconditioned tractors:
http://tractormasters.com/
Location is off I-80 behind Fry's Electronics.
They have about 100-200 tractors in stock. The previous General Manager told me his brother owns a reconditioning plant in VN and said they bring over 200 per month. I wonder if this is the Western branch for Texas's Vina Tractor. Next time I returned I was told he had gone back to VN, and that many of their tractors are shipped direct from Japan without needing the VN reconditioning.
Tell Van (gorgeous young lady, probably the VN family's US representative) that you might start resales on Ebay or something, since they don't pay much attention to individual customers.
As others noted these tractors may be a big gamble, possibly assembled from several junkers then a paint job that is so excellent that the tractor seems new. I would prefer to buy from a trusted local dealer who adds a real warranty.
I have been buying minor parts there to get my Yanmar back to authentic OEM and I've had to take half of them back - they were not authentic for the year/model of the tractor I saw them stripped off of.
On the other hand I have talked to some small retailers who were buying multiple units when I was there, and none mentioned excessive waranty claims.
They offer only 30 day warranty which means stripping used parts off of anything that will fit - they have no parts inventory at all.
I think it's a 50/50 gamble, a lower price and no assurance of quality. For limited hobby use it may be worth the gamble but out of the question if a month or two downtime would hurt you.
I talked to an Iseki customer there who finally brought his own tools and started 'warranty' repairs himself with the help of their mechanics. There wasn't a similar Iseki in stock so he said the tractor had just sat there, I think he said well over 30 days, in hope that one would arrive. Without manuals, no one knew if the non-operative hydraulic controls were authentic for that model tractor or properly installed.
Caveat Emptor!
Soundguy
Old Timer
- Joined
- Mar 11, 2002
- Messages
- 51,575
- Location
- Central florida
- Tractor
- RK 55HC,ym1700, NH7610S, Ford 8N, 2N, NAA, 660, 850 x2, 541, 950, 941D, 951, 2000, 3000, 4000, 4600, 5000, 740, IH 'C' 'H', CUB, John Deere 'B', allis 'G', case VAC
Aside from the great advice you have alreadt got here.. let me give you this advice.
Look , and compair the machine to the description.
Painted hoses, belts and wires tells me that care was not taken when the machine was painted... Was care taken elsewhere?
A good repair is ok.. a bad repair isn't. I would rather see a good repair, and know the problem is taken care of.
Look for signs of 'work'.. Is it new work or old work.
For instance.. If a dealer says the tranny was never worked on.. yet there is freshly extruded RTV coming out of seams between castings.. you know the tractor was split.. etc.
Also.. look at the gaskets on the engine block... a new gasket.. or evidence of a new gasket is obvious.. even if the engine was just painted.
Look for oil.. or oil spots on paint.. or even in the grass under the tractor.
Make sure all the gauges work.
Go into it with your eyes open.
Good luck.
Soundguy
Look , and compair the machine to the description.
Painted hoses, belts and wires tells me that care was not taken when the machine was painted... Was care taken elsewhere?
A good repair is ok.. a bad repair isn't. I would rather see a good repair, and know the problem is taken care of.
Look for signs of 'work'.. Is it new work or old work.
For instance.. If a dealer says the tranny was never worked on.. yet there is freshly extruded RTV coming out of seams between castings.. you know the tractor was split.. etc.
Also.. look at the gaskets on the engine block... a new gasket.. or evidence of a new gasket is obvious.. even if the engine was just painted.
Look for oil.. or oil spots on paint.. or even in the grass under the tractor.
Make sure all the gauges work.
Go into it with your eyes open.
Good luck.
Soundguy
mark777
Veteran Member
- Joined
- May 16, 2004
- Messages
- 1,300
- Location
- S.E Texas
- Tractor
- Ym1300d-1401D-1601D , 1610D & Massey Ferguson 1020
California,
Excellent, honest observation of how it works after the sale.
Prices are dramatically less and usually the honest are the most effected.
I think tractor Ernie may have said it better than I, with the three words "smoke and mirrors: This guy can cut to the chase.
Excellent, honest observation of how it works after the sale.
Prices are dramatically less and usually the honest are the most effected.
I think tractor Ernie may have said it better than I, with the three words "smoke and mirrors: This guy can cut to the chase.
Whiskey
Platinum Member
Fat_Man:
With comments like
<font color="blue">needless to say I am a wee bit nervous </font>
and
<font color="blue">I've read up but i am still nervous </font>
You know the answer.....funny thing is we never want to hear what are gut is telling us......it never lies /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
With comments like
<font color="blue">needless to say I am a wee bit nervous </font>
and
<font color="blue">I've read up but i am still nervous </font>
You know the answer.....funny thing is we never want to hear what are gut is telling us......it never lies /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
mark777
Veteran Member
- Joined
- May 16, 2004
- Messages
- 1,300
- Location
- S.E Texas
- Tractor
- Ym1300d-1401D-1601D , 1610D & Massey Ferguson 1020
Soundguy,
Your experience with tractors is more diversifed with models and years than mine and thankfully, you state the obvious.
Your reply should be printed in bold, inside the match cover of a customer walking the lots and kicking the tires.
Sad to say FatMans' post is about selllers profit not product.
Mark
Your experience with tractors is more diversifed with models and years than mine and thankfully, you state the obvious.
Your reply should be printed in bold, inside the match cover of a customer walking the lots and kicking the tires.
Sad to say FatMans' post is about selllers profit not product.
Mark