Wal Mart shocker

[slowrev]

And south of the border is really hurting the AG industry.

Ben

 

[cowboydoc]

South of the border is going to bankrupt the ag economy. There is virtually no way to compete with their low land values and complete lack of any kind of environmental controls. They can and do use whatever they want and there is no concern for runoff, etc. The south is going to rival us as the ag superpower in very little time. Deere is investing 80 million dollars in Brazil for a new combine and planter facility. So much for the combines and planters being all US made.

Wages may be one factor but the biggest factors, at least in the ag world, are government regulations, NONE in most other countries, and all the taxes on land, ss, medicare, etc. etc.

 

[RichZ]

I agree with you on that, Richard. There has to be a better way to ensure quality agricultural products than we do now. For example, I'm in the process of establishing a goat dairy to sell goat milk products (cheese, butter, yogurt, etc), but in order to do that, I have to have a state certified milking parlor and state certified commercial kitchen. Right now, my wife and I don't have the money to build them, so we're keeping our day jobs, and expanding our farm too slowly for our tastes. But foreign dairies aren't held to anywhere near those standards, and they can produce their products much more cheaply (is cheaply a word??). But what is the quality of their products? Are they as wholesome and bacteria free as from our own dairies? I strongly doubt that!!

It seems to me that regulations should be more result oriented, than making the industry adhere to certain procedures. If I can produce goat milk products without building a kitchen that is 100% stainless steel, but my bacterial counts are below set standards, shouldn't I be allowed to do that?

I strongly feel that we do need environmental and health regulations (Heck! I work for the New York State Dept. of Health!), but the regulations need to be more result oriented. In other words, if I can show that I can produce my goat dairy products, and maintain set standards, then I should be allowed to. I have no problem if they want to constantly monitor my products, because I intend to do that anyway!!

 

[slowrev]

Richard,
Not sure how it will all turn out but it looks like the golden days of the US of A are over, and we will have to settle for less. Hope I am wrong though.

Ben

 

[Phred]

Well I will just add that I too like to buy American but can not always do so, or the American made options are a rotten deal.

As far as job losses go:
The job losses are often transitional. For example very few horse shoes are made in comparison to 150 years ago. Those jobs went away, but there are a lot more jobs making tires than 150 years ago. Now if all you know how to do is make horse shoes then this stinks.

A modern analogy would be electronics. Most of it is made in Asia. But a lot of it is designed in America. So would you rather your son/daughter drive a soldering iron for minimum wage or design electronics, or maybe be a programmer?
The problem of course is that the new better job, requires a lot more education.

So I think the bottom line is we will never be able to be cheap labor. Currently china is beating us, next maybe India, and after that maybe Africa if they can pull themselves out of their current mess.
So we must be innovative to survive with our current position as the leaders in standard of living.

The US is not the only one with this problem. Why the EU? Much of Europe feels this is the only way they can compete with the rest of the world. Togheter they have way more pull than the seperate countries would.
US GDP is 10082000 millions, france's GDP is 1510000 millions. Yep's there is an extra zero there in the US figure.
We have 5 times the population and almost 7 times the GDP.
That's in part due to inovation and the motivation our system builds in.

Fred

 

[slydog]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( Wages may be one factor but the biggest factors, at least in the ag world, are government regulations, NONE in most other countries, and all the taxes on land, ss, medicare, etc. etc. )</font>

AHAAAA... my point exactly. It isn't just the wages, although they are a part of the issue! /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[slydog]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( Richard,
Not sure how it will all turn out but it looks like the golden days of the US of A are over, and we will have to settle for less. Hope I am wrong though.

Ben
)</font>

Why Ben? Why do we have to settle for less? What has happened to the principals of our country? What can we do to turn this around?

Ken

 

[mundamanu]

Political thread!!! But, I guess that's ok since it's just a bunch of Amer-I-cans complaining about them **** foreigners stealin all their jobs and sellin them all cheap crap! /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

 

[KennyV]

My 3cents worth… I don’t think it is principals as much as economic reality. The rest of the world is also increasing their productivity, and there are a LOT of other people and countries.

Most things in this country are no worse than they ever have been… We have not lost or degraded our principals. Some things are actually better.

Things change sometimes faster than people change… To stop it or turn it around, all you need is a time machine, but things will ultimately change…

Any reflection to “the good ol’ days”, usually leaves out a lot of “bad ol’ days’. The best anyone can do is their best…
hopefully there will be few poor choices made along the way that will need correcting. KennyV.

 

[daedong]

<font color="blue"> US GDP is 10082000 millions, france's GDP is 1510000 millions. </font>

I don't understand this comparison, it is misleading to say the least to pluck GDP figures. there are many other things one must take into account. doesn't the USA have enormous public debt. Your GDP is about $37,000us per capita but your public debt is about 63% of GDP, and there is many other factors that must be looked at to make fair and reasonable statements /forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif