Warranty Claims & Reliability

   / Warranty Claims & Reliability #1  

Cahaba Valley Farm

Veteran Member
Joined
Jan 13, 2020
Messages
1,726
Location
Somewhere Alabama
Tractor
1980 Ford 3600
As both a member of this site and a consumer of compact tractors and equipment, I have both raised the question and seen the same question being raised by many other consumers/members of this site when they were in the market to purchase a compact tractor or implement: How reliable is Model X of Brand X and does the manufacturer stand behind their warranty? So I have decided to start this thread for the purpose of providing every consumer now and in the future the opportunity to obtain the data, feedback and information that they are seeking so they can make a more informed purchase decision. I am therefore asking everyone here to share your experience of owning your compact tractor as it relates to reliability, to report any failures you have had with it, to detail what your experience was of filing a warranty claim and to provide feedback on how the manufacturer/dealer treated you in the process of obtaining warranty repair and service work. I welcome all to weigh in on this including dealers, service technicians, salesman, suppliers, and even manufacturers themselves.
 
   / Warranty Claims & Reliability #2  
I have had 1 issue with my kubota. The seat switch got messed up when towing and the seat came down too hard and broke the lever. I called my dealer at 4 pm Saturday and at 815 Monday the service truck was in my driveway free of charge even though it really wasn’t kubotas fault
 
   / Warranty Claims & Reliability #3  
This is likely to become a very long thread. In the two years I've owned it my Kubota L2501 has done everything asked of it with zero downtime. The only complaint is checking the hydraulic fluid level with the little sight glass. My dealer's mechanic (at my request) queried Kubota and learned that adding John Deere dye to the hydraulic system was perfectly acceptable and would not void the warranty. Problem solved.
 
   / Warranty Claims & Reliability #4  
Bought our Kubota new in Summer of 2008 with standard 0 percent financing for 5 years, I think. Nothing down.... although I think we did pay some sales taxes upfront.
Warranty at the time was 1 year - which didn't seem like much - so we bought another year as an extended warranty. The price for that for $1100. I think the max extended Kubota offered then was two years, but we only bought the one additional year. It seemed expensive at the time, but turned out well.

A few months after all the warranties expired the backhoe main boom hydraulic cylinder wouldn't retract all the way. It didn't have any previous problems until that day. I called the dealer who sent out a service truck with an experienced mechanic who took cylinder off. He came back a week later with a brand new one which he installed & topped up the hydraulic fluid.

Even though the warranty was expired by a few months they covered it all - close to $2500 worth of repairs. The "no charge" on the repair ticket says, "goodwill warranty".

Other than that in 13 years we have replaced a couple of hoses, a battery and a throttle cable. Just picky stuff, and nothing that has required a dealer.
We watched it turn over 1000 hours on the hourmeter last week. This tractor is worked hard in difficult soil - mostly around a hilly area and in heavy granite.

So I'd have to say that at 1000 hrs both the tractor and the dealer have beaten all my expectations. Wonderful machine. It still runs and works like new. A little sun faded, but good heavy paint is aging well. So it looks good, too. At least it does to my eyes. BTW, it lives outside with a tarp over the seat and controls.

rScotty
 
   / Warranty Claims & Reliability #5  
Bought our Kubota new in Summer of 2008 with standard 0 percent financing for 5 years, I think. Nothing down.... although I think we did pay some sales taxes upfront.
Warranty at the time was 1 year - which didn't seem like much - so we bought another year as an extended warranty. The price for that for $1100. I think the max extended Kubota offered then was two years, but we only bought the one additional year. It seemed expensive at the time, but turned out well.

A few months after all the warranties expired the backhoe main boom hydraulic cylinder wouldn't retract all the way. It didn't have any previous problems until that day. I called the dealer who sent out a service truck with an experienced mechanic who took cylinder off. He came back a week later with a brand new one which he installed & topped up the hydraulic fluid.

Even though the warranty was expired by a few months they covered it all - close to $2500 worth of repairs. The "no charge" on the repair ticket says, "goodwill warranty".

Other than that in 13 years we have replaced a couple of hoses, a battery and a throttle cable. Just picky stuff, and nothing that has required a dealer.
We watched it turn over 1000 hours on the hourmeter last week. This tractor is worked hard in difficult soil - mostly around a hilly area and in heavy granite.

So I'd have to say that at 1000 hrs both the tractor and the dealer have beaten all my expectations. Wonderful machine. It still runs and works like new. A little sun faded, but good heavy paint is aging well. So it looks good, too. At least it does to my eyes. BTW, it lives outside with a tarp over the seat and controls.

rScotty
"Goodwill" warranties are what keeps customers coming back for years and brings in new customers through word of mouth.
The inverse is also true to an even greater extent!
 
   / Warranty Claims & Reliability
  • Thread Starter
#6  
I want to share these two articles as they are both relevant to this discussion. One is a study that was conducted by Progressive Farmer last year measuring the overall experience and satisfaction tractor owners had with their equipment. The other is a dealer survey conducted by EDA which enables equipment dealers throughout North America to rate the manufacturer lines they carry in key operational categories.

 

Attachments

  • ReaderSummary_Tractor_782020_V4_DMCH.pdf
    184.2 KB · Views: 202
   / Warranty Claims & Reliability #7  
As both a member of this site and a consumer of compact tractors and equipment, I have both raised the question and seen the same question being raised by many other consumers/members of this site when they were in the market to purchase a compact tractor or implement: How reliable is Model X of Brand X and does the manufacturer stand behind their warranty? So I have decided to start this thread for the purpose of providing every consumer now and in the future the opportunity to obtain the data, feedback and information that they are seeking so they can make a more informed purchase decision. I am therefore asking everyone here to share your experience of owning your compact tractor as it relates to reliability, to report any failures you have had with it, to detail what your experience was of filing a warranty claim and to provide feedback on how the manufacturer/dealer treated you in the process of obtaining warranty repair and service work. I welcome all to weigh in on this including dealers, service technicians, salesman, suppliers, and even manufacturers themselves.
POPCORN in hand this could get interesting..
 
   / Warranty Claims & Reliability #8  
I have had 1 issue with my kubota. The seat switch got messed up when towing and the seat came down too hard and broke the lever. I called my dealer at 4 pm Saturday and at 815 Monday the service truck was in my driveway free of charge even though it really wasn’t kubotas fault

POST THE NAME OF THE DEALER. LET'S GIVE QUALITY DEALERS ADDITIONAL BUSINESS.
 
   / Warranty Claims & Reliability #9  
I want to share these two articles as they are both relevant to this discussion. One is a study that was conducted by Progressive Farmer last year measuring the overall experience and satisfaction tractor owners had with their equipment. The other is a dealer survey conducted by EDA which enables equipment dealers throughout North America to rate the manufacturer lines they carry in key operational categories.

Progressive farmer was interesting - although their definition of a small tractor is under 100 hp., and a medium size tractor is between 100 and 235 hp. So that puts them in a different category than most TBN owners and posters.

However, I can't disagree with their conclusions. i.e. JD and Kubota lead in the "Small Tractor" (under 100 hp) category.

And also I agree with their comments. The third comment about the older tractors is very interesting. I hear that a lot; and my guess is that will become the popular view.

• New tractors are viewed as very expensive.

• New, tech-heavy tractors are viewed as sometimes overly complicated.

• Older tractors are often decades old but also are viewed as trusty and dependable workhorses that provide better bang for the buck.

• Dealer networks, with high standards for service are critical for new sales.

The other article - the Dealer Survey - read sort of biased to me. It has a tone that reminds me more lik an advertisement. Like someone trying to sell something.
rScotty
 
   / Warranty Claims & Reliability
  • Thread Starter
#10  
Progressive farmer was interesting - although their definition of a small tractor is under 100 hp., and a medium size tractor is between 100 and 235 hp. So that puts them in a different category than most TBN owners and posters.

However, I can't disagree with their conclusions. i.e. JD and Kubota lead in the "Small Tractor" (under 100 hp) category.

And also I agree with their comments. The third comment about the older tractors is very interesting. I hear that a lot; and my guess is that will become the popular view.

• New tractors are viewed as very expensive.

• New, tech-heavy tractors are viewed as sometimes overly complicated.

• Older tractors are often decades old but also are viewed as trusty and dependable workhorses that provide better bang for the buck.

• Dealer networks, with high standards for service are critical for new sales.

The other article - the Dealer Survey - read sort of biased to me. It has a tone that reminds me more lik an advertisement. Like someone trying to sell something.
rScotty
Agreed. The problem facing the consumers of this compact market segment is the high technology electronics that the federal government has pushed the tractor manufacturers into using to meet their final tier IV emissions standards. If you look at the industry as a whole, all the manufacturers have separated out all the engine electronics from the drive train and even bumper to bumper warranty, capping the warranty coverage to 5 years and will not let you purchase any additional warranty coverage. That says it all right there. They obviously know the electronic engine management system is the weak link and is the most prone to failure.
 
   / Warranty Claims & Reliability #11  
Agreed. The problem facing the consumers of this compact market segment is the high technology electronics that the federal government has pushed the tractor manufacturers into using to meet their final tier IV emissions standards. If you look at the industry as a whole, all the manufacturers have separated out all the engine electronics from the drive train and even bumper to bumper warranty, capping the warranty coverage to 5 years and will not let you purchase any additional warranty coverage. That says it all right there. They obviously know the electronic engine management system is the weak link and is the most prone to failure.
And also most prone to obsolescence.
 
   / Warranty Claims & Reliability #12  
Agreed. The problem facing the consumers of this compact market segment is the high technology electronics that the federal government has pushed the tractor manufacturers into using to meet their final tier IV emissions standards. If you look at the industry as a whole, all the manufacturers have separated out all the engine electronics from the drive train and even bumper to bumper warranty, capping the warranty coverage to 5 years and will not let you purchase any additional warranty coverage. That says it all right there. They obviously know the electronic engine management system is the weak link and is the most prone to failure.

Right, the manufacturers have no choice but to build to government standards - but they do have choice in the way they choose to meet them.
They chose electronics over mechanical systems, and so "Progressive Farmer's" hit the nail on the head with their observation when they said,

"• Older tractors are often decades old but also are viewed as trusty and dependable workhorses that provide better bang for the buck."

I wonder when a brave manufacturer will offer a simple, owner repairable, low polluting, minimal electronic tractor designed to last a lifetime. Modern methods and technology today could make it sophisticated and comfortable as well as owner friendly.

It just might be an instant classic.

rScotty
 
   / Warranty Claims & Reliability #15  
So far I have been lucky and only had more minor or shall we say straight forward problems during the warrantee. All dealers and brands were about even in dealing with when compared. When the part gets here we will fix it and they all did likkity split.
I haven’t had to deal with Kioti during the warrantee as it simply put is the first tractor that didn’t take anything during the warrantee timeframe. I did however break a pin on an attachment after its warrantee was up and the local dealer gave me the part at a real savings compared to list.
Funny thing is I had installed a bolt till the pin got here, picked up the pin put it on the shelf in the garage and never installed it. So I guess I failed myself this time around?
 
   / Warranty Claims & Reliability #16  
Please explain...
Just my opinion, but mechanical parts are better suited for owner maintenance and repair. We are locked out of the software on these machines. I also think that electronic components evolve much quicker than changes to mechanical parts and availability may become an issue due to frequent changes in modules and firmware revisions in the production cycle.

My recent experiences with my 27 year old Massey 1250 leads me to this opinion. A steering arm that failed 15 years ago cost about $30 at the time and was easily available. Last year the arm on other side broke. It took me a long time to locate a used one for nearly $300. New parts have become very difficult to source for this tractor (engine pistons and rings for example) and mostly come from tractors that have been parted out. Pulling mechanical parts off of a nearly 30 year old tractor is one thing. I have little confidence in serviceability of computer control modules and chip based sensors that might be pulled off of a hulk for my Kioti 20 years from now.

I believe that in twenty years there will be quite a few tractors that would run and operate quite well mechanically but will be incapacitated due to a dead controller that is no longer available. I hope I am wrong but I just spent $2,800 getting my 27 year old fuel injection pump rebuilt because the parts had to be made for it. I just don't anticipate that ECU/MCU's will be easily found for 20+ year old tractors. That doesn't even consider whether there will be anyone who can still get into the programming.
 
   / Warranty Claims & Reliability
  • Thread Starter
#17  
Just my opinion, but mechanical parts are better suited for owner maintenance and repair. We are locked out of the software on these machines. I also think that electronic components evolve much quicker than changes to mechanical parts and availability may become an issue due to frequent changes in modules and firmware revisions in the production cycle.

My recent experiences with my 27 year old Massey 1250 leads me to this opinion. A steering arm that failed 15 years ago cost about $30 at the time and was easily available. Last year the arm on other side broke. It took me a long time to locate a used one for nearly $300. New parts have become very difficult to source for this tractor (engine pistons and rings for example) and mostly come from tractors that have been parted out. Pulling mechanical parts off of a nearly 30 year old tractor is one thing. I have little confidence in serviceability of computer control modules and chip based sensors that might be pulled off of a hulk for my Kioti 20 years from now.

I believe that in twenty years there will be quite a few tractors that would run and operate quite well mechanically but will be incapacitated due to a dead controller that is no longer available. I hope I am wrong but I just spent $2,800 getting my 27 year old fuel injection pump rebuilt because the parts had to be made for it. I just don't anticipate that ECU/MCU's will be easily found for 20+ year old tractors. That doesn't even consider whether there will be anyone who can still get into the programming.
I understand you and the concern is very logical and valid. On the other hand, I can't think of a better business opportunity for manufacturers and dealers to milk our wallets with these type of repairs.
 
   / Warranty Claims & Reliability #18  
There are people that do this for a living.

JD Powers is one that comes to mind. They have large staffs, professional statisticians and well thought out data gathering procedures.

A random question on an Internet forum is likely to get you garbage results, of no statistical significance or accuracy.
 
   / Warranty Claims & Reliability #19  
Just my opinion, but mechanical parts are better suited for owner maintenance and repair. We are locked out of the software on these machines. I also think that electronic components evolve much quicker than changes to mechanical parts and availability may become an issue due to frequent changes in modules and firmware revisions in the production cycle.

My recent experiences with my 27 year old Massey 1250 leads me to this opinion. A steering arm that failed 15 years ago cost about $30 at the time and was easily available. Last year the arm on other side broke. It took me a long time to locate a used one for nearly $300. New parts have become very difficult to source for this tractor (engine pistons and rings for example) and mostly come from tractors that have been parted out. Pulling mechanical parts off of a nearly 30 year old tractor is one thing. I have little confidence in serviceability of computer control modules and chip based sensors that might be pulled off of a hulk for my Kioti 20 years from now.

I believe that in twenty years there will be quite a few tractors that would run and operate quite well mechanically but will be incapacitated due to a dead controller that is no longer available. I hope I am wrong but I just spent $2,800 getting my 27 year old fuel injection pump rebuilt because the parts had to be made for it. I just don't anticipate that ECU/MCU's will be easily found for 20+ year old tractors. That doesn't even consider whether there will be anyone who can still get into the programming.

There probably will be places which do this for a decent amount of time.

I'm sitting on the fence deciding if I want someone to redo the logic board in my kitchen's wall oven; it's 20 years old and that board has long since stopped being sold (and the manufacturer probably changes their models almost yearly unlike tractors which often have few changes over most of a decade until the next generation), but there are quite a few companies that will redo & fix them and it's not like every oven's got the same board either.
 
   / Warranty Claims & Reliability
  • Thread Starter
#20  
I was doing some comparative research tonight and I happened to come across Bad Boy's Tractor Warranty. I think it is a perfect example of what we have been discussing. It's clear after reading this warranty how little confidence Bad Boy has in the electronics on their tractors.

2021 LIMITED WARRANTY FOR BAD BOY TRACTORS

A: GENERAL SCOPE OF COVERAGE.​

Bad Boy Tractors (BBT) will repair or replace, at its option, any genuine BBT part covered under this warranty which is found to be defective in design, material or workmanship during the applicable warranty term as set forth in the Coverage Chart reported in paragraph B, and with the exclusions listed in paragraph C. Each applicable warranty term begins on the date of sale. This warranty is provided to the Dealership of new Bad Boy tractors, implements, and genuine parts (“Equipment”) purchased from BBT. Warranty service must be performed by Dealership. The customer shall be responsible for any diagnostic work, service and/or maintenance not directly related to any defect covered under this warranty.

B: WHAT IS WARRANTED.​

Except for the exclusions listed in paragraph C, all parts of new Equipment are warranted as set forth in the Coverage Chart below.

ProductCoverageWarranty Term
Coverage Chart
1022H/1025H Engine1 and Powertrain2Spare Parts and Labor84 months from date of sales or 2,000 working hours, whichever comes first
OTHER MODELS Engine1 and Powertrain2Spare Parts and Labor72 months from date of sales or 2,000 working hours, whichever comes first
Implements (Loader & Backhoe)Spare Parts and Labor24 months from date of shipment, 12 months from date of sales, or 500 working hours (based on tractor) whichever comes first
Other Tractor PartsSpare Parts and Labor24 months from date of sales or 1,000 working hours, whichever comes first
Replacement PartsParts Only90 days or remainder of Equipment warranty (whichever is longer)
1Engine Includes: the crankcase, cylinder head, front gear case, valve cover pans, and all parts contained therein. The Engine does NOT include the fuel injection system pump, nozzles, high pressure lines, exhaust components, the diesel particulate filter system, or the following external engine components: electrical, cooling, and intake. All such items are considered Other Tractor Parts.
2Powertrain Includes: the clutch housing (except clutch disc), transmission case, differential and final drive housing and all parts contained therein, drive axles, external drive shafts associated with driveline operation. The Powertrain does NOT include the hydraulic parts, electronic parts, clutch cover & disk, outside parts for power train, etc.

C: WHAT IS NOT WARRANTED (EXCLUSIONS).​

Pursuant to the terms of this warranty, BAD BOY TRACTORS IS NOTRESPONSIBLE FOR ANY OF THE FOLLOWING:
  1. Used Equipment.
  2. Any Equipment that has been altered or modified in a manner not approved by BBT.
  3. Defects caused by normal wear and tear or lack of sonable and proper maintenance.
  4. Normal maintenance parts and service, including but not limited to: belts, brake and clutch linings, oil, filters (air, fuel, oil), coolants, ditioners, lubricants, pre-heater plugs, light bulbs, and clutch discs.
  5. Engine fuel injection system pump, injector nozzles.
  6. Damages caused by user negligence or failure to comply with the owner’s manual.
  7. Damages caused by misuse or abuse, including but not limited to use of Equipment: (i) beyond stated or reasonable specifications or erance (ii) contrary to the terms of the owner’s manual, or (iii) contrary to the Equipment’s intended purposes.
  8. Damages caused by the use of oversized attachments or implements.
  9. Costs of repairs or replacements made by unauthorized personnel.
  10. Costs of parts cleaning, adjustments, service calls, diagnostics, and clean up.
  11. Tires, tubes, batteries, and radios.
  12. Window, door glass and mirrors or other type of glasses such as lights except when damaged during shipment.
  13. Freight charges on replacement parts.
  14. Addition or replacement of chemical weight materials.
  15. Damages or defects caused by accident, theft, fire, flood, vandalism, or an act of God.
  16. Costs of rental of replacement equipment during the repair period.
  17. Equipment which has been declared unusable and subsequently rebuilt.
  18. Overtime labor charges with reference to the agreed repair timetables.
  19. Transportation of Equipment and travel time (including mileage).
  20. Any failure not caused by a defect in design workmanship or materials.
  21. High pressure lines tampered with by end user.

D: TERMINATION OF WARRANTY.​

This warranty terminates and is voided immediately upon the occurrence of any of the following:
  1. Use of starting fluid or ether to start or run the engine.
  2. Use of any replacement part that is not a genuine BBT brand or BBT authorized part.
  3. Any adjustment of the injection pump fuel delivery system.
  4. Failure to timely and completely perform regular maintenance and service as prescribed by the operator’s manual during the warranty term.
  5. Failure to perform Purchaser’s obligations as set forth in paragraph G of this warranty.
  6. Misuse or abuse of Equipment, including but not limited to use of Equipment: (i) beyond stated or reasonable specifications or tolerances, (ii) contrary to the terms of the owner’s manual, or (iii) contrary to the Equipment’s intended purposes.

E: EXCLUSION OF IMPLIED WARRANTIES AND LIMITATION OF LIABILITY.​

THIS WARRANTY IS IN LIEU OF ALL WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY, FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE OR OTHER REPRESENTATIONS, WARRANTIES OR CONDITIONS, EXPRESSED OR IMPLIED, ALL OF WHICH ARE HEREBY EXCLUDED. THE REMEDIES OF THIS WARRANTY SET FORTH HEREIN ARE EXCLUSIVE. BBT NEITHER ASSUMES, NOR AUTHORIZES ANY PERSON TO ASSUME FOR IT, ANY OTHER OBLIGATION OR LIABILITY IN CONNECTION WITH THE SALE OF COVERED EQUIPMENT. CORRECTION OF DEFECTS, IN THE MANNER AND FOR THE APPLICABLE PERIOD OF TIME PROVIDED ABOVE, SHALL CONSTITUTE ALL OBLIGATIONS OF KMC TO THE DISTRIBUTOR, AND KMC SHALL NOT BE LIABLE FOR NEGLIGENCE OR BREACH OF CONTRACT OF DISTRIBUTOR WITH RESPECT TO COVERED EQUIPMENT. IN NO EVENT SHALL THE DISTRIBUTOR BE ENTITLED TO RECOVER FOR INCIDENTAL, SPECIAL, OR CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO, LOSS OF CROPS OR SEED, LOST PROFITS OR INCOME, COST OF RENTAL OR REPLACEMENT EQUIPMENT, INCONVENIENCE.

F: NO DEALER WARRANTY.​

THIS WARRANTY IS THE ONLY WARRANTY AUTHORIZED BY BBT. DEALERS, DISTRIBUTORS, AND OTHER THIRD PARTIES HAVE NO AUTHORITY TO MAKE ANY WARRANTY, REPRESENTATION, CONDITION OR PROMISE ON BEHALF OF BBT, OR TO MODIFY THE TERMS OR LIMITATIONS OF THIS WARRANTY IN ANY WAY.

G: OWNER’S OBLIGATIONS.​

To secure warranty service, the Owner must: (1) promptly report the defect to the dealership and request warranty service within the applicable warranty term; (2) present evidence of the warranty start date with valid proof of purchase; The Owner must maintain the Equipment in accordance with the instructions provided in the owner’s manual and keep records for such maintenance. If a covered defect occurs, it is the owners responsibility to cease operating the Equipment until repairs are made. Further damage which occurs from continued operation may not be covered by this warranty.

H: TRANSFERABILITY.​

Upon a transfer of Equipment by the original purchaser, any remaining coverage of this warranty may be transferred to the subsequent purchaser.
 
Last edited:

Tractor & Equipment Auctions

Volvo ECR235CL (A53317)
Volvo ECR235CL...
TANK MANIFOLD (A55745)
TANK MANIFOLD (A55745)
204158 (A57193)
204158 (A57193)
500 BBL FRAC TANK (A58214)
500 BBL FRAC TANK...
2018 CATERPILLAR 12M3 MOTORGRADER (A52709)
2018 CATERPILLAR...
(INOP) VOLVO A30D OFF ROAD DUMP TRUCK (A60429)
(INOP) VOLVO A30D...
 
Top