Watcha eating?

[2LaneCruzer]

I had oven roasted prime rib, parsley potatoes, stir fired veggies, and red wine (a chanti I believe) for dinner last night.
:licking:
David

Lucky you...special occasion? Last prime rib I priced was $95. I do love prime rib, though, especially the way my wife fixes it. I'm itching to cook a rib roast on the Big Green Egg.

 

[mjarrels]

I was a Quality Assurance Supervisor for Perdue Farms further prosessing poultry plant for six years. You would not believe what goes into chicken nuggets. Won't touch one with a ten foot pole!

mark

 

[MossflowerWoods]

Lucky you...special occasion? Last prime rib I priced was $95. I do love prime rib, though, especially the way my wife fixes it. I'm itching to cook a rib roast on the Big Green Egg.

At Christmas we bought 2 on sale at Wegmans and froze one. Yes, they are very expenisve... Even on sale...

I was going to fix it for my wifes birthday in Jan, but we ended up fixing it yesterday for her Mom's birthday.

Be well,
David

 

[txdon]

Speaking of Special Occasions, On Valentines Day the young woman in front of me (with a small child) at the grocery checkout had two lobsters ($40 - $20each) and her total grocery bill was $60.00. She started putting back the other food she bought because she did not have enough money. Eventually she had to return all of the other groceries she had bought except for the Lobsters which she paid for with food stamps. I hope she will be able to land a productive husband with the state provided lobsters.

 

[IslandTractor]

Very interesting and important study on diet and risk of heart disease and stroke was published today in the New England Journal of Medicine. A large prospective well controlled study showed that the "Mediterranean" diet, but NOT the low fat diet, could prevent a significant number of heart attacks and strokes. I think it was about 30% reduction which is good. From my perspective this is great news as 1) it is solid prospectively done clinical trial with good controls and 2) the Mediterranean diet is VERY much easier to live with than the low fat diets (which did not compare favorably mostly due to predictable poor compliance).

So, red wine, olive oil, walnuts, fish, chicken, fruit and veggies are on the menu. I can live with that very happily.

 

[2LaneCruzer]

Speaking of Special Occasions, On Valentines Day the young woman in front of me (with a small child) at the grocery checkout had two lobsters ($40 - $20each) and her total grocery bill was $60.00. She started putting back the other food she bought because she did not have enough money. Eventually she had to return all of the other groceries she had bought except for the Lobsters which she paid for with food stamps. I hope she will be able to land a productive husband with the state provided lobsters.

Reminds me of when I was fresh out of high school, and took a job checking groceries at the local Humpty Dumpty super market. A couple with a small baby came to my checkstand with a small order of groceries. They had a six pack of beer and four cans of baby formula. I checked them out, and they didn't have enough money to pay for the whole order....so what did they put back? You guessed it...they kept the beer and put the baby forumla back. This has always been one of the "wake up" moments in my life, because I never would have envisioned anyone doing such a thing.

 

[txdon]

Very interesting and important study on diet and risk of heart disease and stroke was published today in the New England Journal of Medicine. A large prospective well controlled study showed that the "Mediterranean" diet, but NOT the low fat diet, could prevent a significant number of heart attacks and strokes. I think it was about 30% reduction which is good. From my perspective this is great news as 1) it is solid prospectively done clinical trial with good controls and 2) the Mediterranean diet is VERY much easier to live with than the low fat diets (which did not compare favorably mostly due to predictable poor compliance).

So, red wine, olive oil, walnuts, fish, chicken, fruit and veggies are on the menu. I can live with that very happily.

When it sounds too good to be true it probably is.

"An article just published in the New England Journal of Medicine claims that a Mediterranean diet is much more effective than a "low-fat diet" in preventing cardiovascular disease. A careful reading of the study reveals that this is simply not true.

In the "low-fat" group, total fat consumption decreased insignificantly, from 39 percent to 37 percent (Table S7, appendix). This doesn't even come close to the American Heart Association guidelines of a low-fat diet (<30 percent fat) or ours for reversing heart disease (<10 percent fat)."

- Dr. Dean Ornish: Does a Mediterranean Diet Really Beat Low-Fat for Heart Health?

And since I had my heart attack when eating the foods on the Mediterranean diet I will tend to believe the deficiencies that Ornish found in the study.

 

[IslandTractor]

When it sounds too good to be true it probably is.

"An article just published in the New England Journal of Medicine claims that a Mediterranean diet is much more effective than a "low-fat diet" in preventing cardiovascular disease. A careful reading of the study reveals that this is simply not true.

In the "low-fat" group, total fat consumption decreased insignificantly, from 39 percent to 37 percent (Table S7, appendix). This doesn't even come close to the American Heart Association guidelines of a low-fat diet (<30 percent fat) or ours for reversing heart disease (<10 percent fat)."

- Dr. Dean Ornish: Does a Mediterranean Diet Really Beat Low-Fat for Heart Health?

And since I had my heart attack when eating the foods on the Mediterranean diet I will tend to believe the deficiencies that Ornish found in the study.

The point of the study is that in the real world, real people can adhere to the Mediterranean diet but cannot adhere to the low fat diet. I made that point earlier. The Ornish diet works but isn't well accepted. The low fat diet advocated by Ornish is very difficult to stick with and is an incredibly boring diet. On top of that, the benefits of the Mediterranean diet have been demonstrated in a very large well controlled study (7000plus persons in the study). If I recall correctly the Ornish diet has been studied in a few hundred (?more). I don't believe the claimed benefits of the Ornish diet are any greater than the Mediterranean diet benefits shown in this study.

The key point is that the Mediterranean diet is probably a better choice for most people. If you like the Ornish diet and have the discipline to maintain it, more power to you.

 

[txdon]

It's not about power, it's about miss-information and the way it is presented and readily accepted by people who are looking for the path of least resistance. Look at how doctors on TV used to advertise cigarettes as healthy. Why in world would any study claim that a diet 39 to 37% was low fat - that is just plain wrong and misleading and is giving a false sense of security to people with heart disease.

 

[JDgreen227]

I was a Quality Assurance Supervisor for Perdue Farms further prosessing poultry plant for six years. You would not believe what goes into chicken nuggets. Won't touch one with a ten foot pole!

mark

I have never been a fan of chicken nuggets nor any kind of ready-prepared chicken such as patties, strips, etc. either from a restaurant, fast-food place, or frozen pack at the supermarket. The ONLY chicken I will buy and prepare are fresh boneless breasts...with those I have a reasonably good idea of what is in them.

 

[IslandTractor]

It's not about power, it's about miss-information and the way it is presented and readily accepted by people who are looking for the path of least resistance. Look at how doctors on TV used to advertise cigarettes as healthy. Why in world would any study claim that a diet 39 to 37% was low fat - that is just plain wrong and misleading and is giving a false sense of security to people with heart disease.

1) Not sure what your point is about misinformation.
2) Any physician who ever advertised tobacco products was a shill or ***** and in the era of controlled clinical trials we now have data not just "expert opinion" to go on. The NEJM paper describes a very well run and well controlled trial. It did not test the ultra low fat diet you are on but did have a third of the patients assigned to a traditional low fat diet arm. Those patients had a very hard time staying on that diet and indeed essentially failed to do so which is why they were the same as the control group.
3) I appreciate that the near vegan diet you follow has some very strong proponents as well as a modicum of clinical trial data to support it. However, it is extremely difficult for many (?most) people to adhere to such a diet so it may not be a practical solution for many. I could not follow it. The Mediterranean diet is very easy to follow in contrast so it might be a simple solution for healthier eating for many people.

 

[mjarrels]

Balut... Pinoy... Waiting for the hot bread bike in the morning. Philippines. The roasters will wake me in the morning.

mark

 

[txdon]

.... such a diet (near vegan) .... may not be a practical solution for many. I could not follow it. The Mediterranean diet is very easy to follow in contrast so it might be a simple solution for healthier eating for many people.

I agree with you... it is healthier.... Than the standard American diet and easy to follow - which is most important.

I guess I'm still mad because the Mediterranean diet failed me. When I was recovering in the hospital I kept thinking "what else could I have done?" Later I learned the Cardiologist in Houston and Cleveland have know for the past 20 years that a diet less than 10% fat is the only way to stop the progression of heart disease. I was mad at the doctors of the AHA for not recommending this. Houston is now doing a study on how to keep people with heart disease on this strict (less than 10% fat) diet which they, like you, know is the biggest challenge in America. It will be a while before Houston's "Century Study" is complete. In a month they will be calling me to participate.
There is a risk from the scans and I don't need the incentive given to the control group so I'm still thinking about it.

 

[dmccarty]

...

- Dr. Dean Ornish: Does a Mediterranean Diet Really Beat Low-Fat for Heart Health?

And since I had my heart attack when eating the foods on the Mediterranean diet I will tend to believe the deficiencies that Ornish found in the study.

What is the Mediterranean Diet? From the link you posted,

An optimal diet that I recommend for preventing and reversing heart disease is:

Rich in fruits, vegetables, whole grains, legumes, and soy products in their natural, unrefined forms.
Low in total fat (<10 percent fat), saturated fats, and trans fats.
High in omega‑3 fatty acids (fish oil, flax oil, salmon).
Low in refined carbohydrates such as sugar, white flour (bread, pasta), white rice, and sugar-sweetened beverages.
Low in processed and refined foods.

The only difference in that list of foods, and the book I have on the Mediterranean Diet, is low total fat. Me thinks Ornish is pushing the case on prevention. My family does not have heart disease and their diet is nowhere near what is on that list. My granny used to eat that diet and she sure was not from the Med nor had she had ever heard of the Mediterranean Diet. :laughing: I don't think she ever heard of Omega 3's either but she ate a lot of fish because it was food they could catch and it was free. My granny was a health nut before the 60's health food craze and I wish I knew WHY and WHERE she picked up her eating habits because I can only guess it was based, sorta, on Graham's Diet. Granny could cook some awesome fried chicken! :licking::licking::licking:

I do think the last two items are bad for us. Having said that, I treated myself with a really good sweat bun with breakfast. :licking::laughing::laughing::laughing:

Later,
Dan

 

[txdon]

Me thinks Ornish is pushing the case on prevention. My family does not have heart disease and their diet is nowhere near what is on that list.

Dan

Dan, the Low fat diet is for prevention/stopping/reversing heart disease. (I do the Dr. Esselstyn diet for preventing and reversing heart disease.) Not everyone has heart disease and some will never get it no matter what they eat. My brother (who was tested) and 80+ year old parents do not have heart disease and eat the standard American diet. however I would not say that about my younger brother because he refuses to be tested. He has no symptoms but then neither did I. Has everyone in your family been tested or is the statement you are making is that they are low risk and have no symptoms of heart disease?

 

[dmccarty]

Dan, the Low fat diet is for prevention/stopping/reversing heart disease. (I do the Dr. Esselstyn diet for preventing and reversing heart disease.) Not everyone has heart disease and some will never get it no matter what they eat. My brother (who was tested) and 80+ year old parents do not have heart disease and eat the standard American diet. however I would not say that about my younger brother because he refuses to be tested. He has no symptoms but then neither did I. Has everyone in your family been tested or is the statement you are making is that they are low risk and have no symptoms of heart disease?

Any number of diets would prevent heart disease not just the one in the link.

My parents have been tested and my grandparents on both sides of the family lived well into their 80s and 90s. I think the youngest died in his 70s and he had a real rough, hard life that included heavy drinking, smoking and no way in heck was he eating a low fat or Med Diet. My parents need to loose weight and have been in that shape for years unfortunately but no heart problems. There was a study I read about last year that said that doctors need to look at the family history for heart attacks. The study showed a linkage between a family history of heart attacks. The study worked out some odds/risk level of a person having a heart attack based on the age of a parents heart attack. The study said if your parents had not had a heart attack by age 60 or 70, don't worry about having one. Going back several generations on both sides of the family, people have not died from heart problems. My grandfather that was the last to die just go sick. My grandmother felt it was time to check out and did so. She swore she would never go into a nursing home, and when she was told she needed to be go into a home, she died within a week. She always said she would not go in a home and by gawd she did not. I am in far better shape than my parents were at my age. I don't have the weight problems they do, I eat far better, and compared to most of my family, get more exercise, though my dad does get quite a bit of physical exercise which is one reason his heart is in such good shape.

My family has problems with dementia. Almost all of my family has had some sort of mental diminishment in their old age. Frankly, checking out via a heart attack around 80 would be a good thing given my family history. I don't want to be sitting there staring at the walls wondering what I had for breakfast. Or did I eat breakfast?

Later,
Dan

 

[txdon]

"The study said if your parents had not had a heart attack by age 60 or 70, don't worry about having one." - Dan

You have got to be kidding! A study really said that? Can you reference it for me? Both my parents are in their mid 80's with no heart attacks. I would like to personally contact the person who wrote that.

"My family has problems with dementia. Almost all of my family has had some sort of mental diminishment in their old age." - Dan
They were just talking about diet and the brain here:
Alzheimer's: Lower your risk by eating right - CBS News Video

 

[IslandTractor]

. Frankly, checking out via a heart attack around 80 would be a good thing given my family history. I don't want to be sitting there staring at the walls wondering what I had for breakfast. Or did I eat breakfast?

Later,
Dan

That is my plan. Eat, drink and be merry then check out before I start to drool.

There are some advantages to life with senile dementia however. You meet new friends every day. And, you can hide your own Easter eggs.

 

[DABSGT]

"The study said if your parents had not had a heart attack by age 60 or 70, don't worry about having one." - Dan

You have got to be kidding! A study really said that? Can you reference it for me? Both my parents are in their mid 80's with no heart attacks. I would like to personally contact the person who wrote that.

"My family has problems with dementia. Almost all of my family has had some sort of mental diminishment in their old age." - Dan
They were just talking about diet and the brain here:
Alzheimer's: Lower your risk by eating right - CBS News Video

Dan and Don,
There are many risk factors for having a heart attack family history is just one of them. Also need to take into account Diet and Smoking as examples.
David

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