Water lines for filling horse buckets

[RobA]

We're getting tired of dragging the hose around in the horse barn were going to add water lines from a cold water hydrant to each of 6 buckets. PEX would probably be good (and burst resistant in the winter) but it seems like there is more stuff to buy and more expensive. I figured running plastic piping would be cheap and easy. Should I use PVC or CPVC? Thoughts?

 

[whistlepig]

I would think you would have to heat tape them regardless of the type of plastic.

 

[/pine]

I'd use black poly pipe...it will not burst when frozen and the fittings are cheap and adaptable...

IMO there is nothing worse than PVC/CPVC in freezing conditions...they will bust every time...

 

[jaotguy]

water in lines in cold climates freezes sooner or later ... even if you get it routed , the water will freeze in the buckets anyway ....

so you are looking at heating wraps and bucket heaters .. extra cost and eventually a fire hazard as the equipment wears and frays ....

perhaps you can run a hose up to the rafters and back down again for filling the buckets ( inverted U ) .... put a dual hose bib at the hydrant end ....

close the free hose bib and turn the hose on , fill the buckets . ... the close the hydrant , open the spare bib and the nozzle on the far end of the hose .... the hose should drain from both ends and not freeze up ...

 

[QRTRHRS]

There are automatic water dispensing options that are available for stalls albeit pricey and you have to dig up the floor to bury the lines. I have used individual electric buckets (upward of 20-25 at times) and the insulated bucket holders too. I always had individual GFI's for each bucket so if one went bad, I would not loose a whole series of buckets. I have had buckets go bad and not heat but never an electrocution issue though I have heard plenty of stories from people that know someone that knew someone who....

The insulated bucket holders will freeze a little on top overnight as the temps get to around 20 but sure beat a plain bucket.

I forget the name now but I used to get this plastic pipe that was blue on the outside and an opaque white inside. I used brass fittings with double stainless screw clamps because I feel that the plastic fittings are prone to leakage. I also ran the lines inside four inch corrogated pipe for a little extra protection from the surrounding bakfill and to allow for some expansion and contraction. Glad where I live now that I don't need to bury water lines four feet deep.

 

[boggen]

black poly pipe, with plastic barb fittings and pipe clamps.

best bet is to dig up the floor, and install "frost free" hydrants at each location.

frost free hydrants, the valve itself is located a few feet deep under the ground, and when you turn off the hydrant any water in the pipe above the valve drains out down below ground. and in that keeping any water that would be above ground from freezing and cracking/busting pipes.

frost free hydrants only work if they can drain water out of them, if you attach a garden hose or like to them. and do not disconnect the hose... well something going to freeze crack / burst. and it could be hose or hydrant. (granted a 2 to 3 feet of hose, that stretchs over the fence and into a stall or lot or what not, is not going to harm anything, or less end of garden hose is submerged under water. everything just needs to drain of water, when ya shut off the hydrant.

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cheap and easy, no such thing with plastic or any type of hard pipe or hoses.. the pipe may seem cheap, but once you hit those fittings and more so valves. BOOM! there went your budget a few times over.

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to note it, PEX is just not a single type of material, there are wide variety of PEX piping out there. cheaper stuff and used a lot is the black poly pipe with barb fittings and pipe clamps.

 

[RobA]

....so you are looking at heating wraps and bucket heaters ...

We already use heated buckets in the winter and they work very well. Even last winter when we had several nights with temps near 0.

..perhaps you can run a hose up to the rafters and back down again for filling the buckets ( inverted U ) .... put a dual hose bib at the hydrant end ....
close the free hose bib and turn the hose on , fill the buckets . ... the close the hydrant , open the spare bib and the nozzle on the far end of the hose .... the hose should drain from both ends and not freeze up ...

That is exactly what I was thinking of doing except using PVC or Poly instead of a hose - although using a good garden hose might be easier. In the winter we drag the hose out, fills the buckets and then drain the hose. Using the "inverted U" setup would eliminate a lot of the work.

 

[EddieWalker]

Avoid black poly pipe. It's cheap for a reason. CPVC is just for hot water. If you go with PVC, switch to copper where it comes above the ground and you wont' have any issues if it freezes. Be sure the PVC is below the frost line and it wont freeze. I like to put pipe insulation around the pipe where it comes above the ground, then slide a 1 1/2 inch plastic grey conduit over it and cap it. I put a 90 at the top of the pipe and run my faucet out the side of the grey conduit. It's a nice clean look that never gives me any problems. Temps here get into the teens and can remain freezing for up to a week.

PEX is really simple to use. The only tool you need is a crimper. I never use any of the slide on fittings, I don't trust them. While they work most of the time, they do fail and it's just too easy to use a crimper and never having to worry about a failure. PEX is rated for freezing temps and it's cost effective. There are some plastic fittings that you can use to make your connections, but I don't trust them either and use either the brass connections that they sell at the store, or make my own out of copper.

Plumbing is one of those things that after I'm done with it, I never want to see it again. For me, I will spend more time and more money to make it the best I possibly can. Cheaper and faster always results in having to do it again. And there is no such thing as a good time to fix a leak!!!!

Eddie

 

[jaotguy]

We already use heated buckets in the winter and they work very well. Even last winter when we had several nights with temps near 0..

up here , -40 F is common ... 0 is where you consider putting on the heavier winter coat instead of the lighter plaid lumber jacket.

 

[/pine]

FWIW...for over 40 years I have maintained two different surface water/spring systems that supply 4 residences...the springs are located several hundred yards up steep mountainous terrain (where no trencher will go) so many of the black poly pipe lines lay on the surface...
The only issues I have ever had were with a few of the cheaper plastic couplings (I only use the steel ones now) cracked during a very hard freeze...just a slight trickle running through the lines prevent them from freezing...occasionally a squirrel will chew through a surface line... (no big deal IMO)...

Also several of the lines are overflow and auxiliary lines that are normally closed so they freeze up solid...after they thaw there are no issues (other than the cheaper plastic couplings I mentioned)

On the four residences that are served by the system...the poly pipe connects to the house plumbing that is either PVC or hard copper...I can't tell you how many times I have had to replace cracked/split copper and PVC at these locations...the black poly pipe has never split or cracked...