MossRoad
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What are you trying to say here Bob? Hahaha!
Well, Frig. Still have an electrical issue.
- Thread starter woodlandfarms
- Start date
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OP
woodlandfarms
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So an update to the update of the update.
So far circuit breaker is holding. Mowed 1.2 hours tonight.
Earlier today my Mechanic buddy stopped by and helped (well, he just did it) replace my Oil Temp sensor. In mowing, my temp climbed up to what I call redline (The temp on the guage reads 240 max) and when it gets to the 235 I come back in.
But left the engine running. Hand on oil cooler atop engine results in Hot on one side, cooler on the other. Grab my Harbor Freight laser thermometer. Temp is 180 on the hot side, 140 on the cold. Temp on the engine head is 220 (pull the side cover off and check). Temp on the Oil Filter is 280. Temp in the oil pan is 230 -200 depending on where I point.
I am calling Deutz tomorrow AM to discuss. I have a couple of concerns. One is that I have an oil blockage. I worry that there is blockage in my cooler. Also I am wondering about my oil filter. Could it have failed over winter? Or am I having a secondary electrical issue. The guage appears to be working fine but you never know anymore.
Then again, I am a bit nervous about the PT as it has been letting me down lately and I may be just over reacting to hot days.
I do have a brand new Oil Temp sensor coming from Germany. 4 weeks to get it but will slap it in when it arrives. Also going to check grounds and finish running ground strap from back to front.
There is another temp gauge on the Deutz that PT does not use. I may spring for a guage after talking with the Deutz people in the AM.
So far circuit breaker is holding. Mowed 1.2 hours tonight.
Earlier today my Mechanic buddy stopped by and helped (well, he just did it) replace my Oil Temp sensor. In mowing, my temp climbed up to what I call redline (The temp on the guage reads 240 max) and when it gets to the 235 I come back in.
But left the engine running. Hand on oil cooler atop engine results in Hot on one side, cooler on the other. Grab my Harbor Freight laser thermometer. Temp is 180 on the hot side, 140 on the cold. Temp on the engine head is 220 (pull the side cover off and check). Temp on the Oil Filter is 280. Temp in the oil pan is 230 -200 depending on where I point.
I am calling Deutz tomorrow AM to discuss. I have a couple of concerns. One is that I have an oil blockage. I worry that there is blockage in my cooler. Also I am wondering about my oil filter. Could it have failed over winter? Or am I having a secondary electrical issue. The guage appears to be working fine but you never know anymore.
Then again, I am a bit nervous about the PT as it has been letting me down lately and I may be just over reacting to hot days.
I do have a brand new Oil Temp sensor coming from Germany. 4 weeks to get it but will slap it in when it arrives. Also going to check grounds and finish running ground strap from back to front.
There is another temp gauge on the Deutz that PT does not use. I may spring for a guage after talking with the Deutz people in the AM.
Coyote machine
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The oil cooler should cool the oil as it passes through the COOLER, yes? I'd be more concerned if your radiator were not cooling the engine and was blowing out coolant as a result of overheating.
Change just your oil filter to see if it is in bypass. Unlikely, but possible, if it's been in use for too long.
Change just your oil filter to see if it is in bypass. Unlikely, but possible, if it's been in use for too long.
ponytug
Super Member
Dear Carl,
Have a look at your Deutz manual, or one on-line. On my engine, the oil comes out of the pan, goes to the oil pump, through the oil filter, up to the oil cooler and into the oil lubrication passageways. So, temperature ought to be; oil pan> oil filter > oil cooler inlet >> oil cooler outlet.
I can't speak to the absolute values, but it looks to me like everything is working OK. Changing an oil filter never hurts, but I wouldn't expect it to change much. You can get wrap around coolers for oil filters, but if it were me, I'd spend it on a secondary fan to move more cool air under the canopy to benefit the engine, the hydraulic cooler and to move more heat off of the exhaust and out from under the canopy. YMMV.
Make it a great 4th!
All the best,
Peter
P.S. I like the bad breaker idea. The PT breaker isn't super high quality or robust, so I can easily see it failing. I have that "Duh" feeling, as it is a common element to the circuits. FWIW: marine breakers tend to be higher quality and more weather resistant...
Have a look at your Deutz manual, or one on-line. On my engine, the oil comes out of the pan, goes to the oil pump, through the oil filter, up to the oil cooler and into the oil lubrication passageways. So, temperature ought to be; oil pan> oil filter > oil cooler inlet >> oil cooler outlet.
I can't speak to the absolute values, but it looks to me like everything is working OK. Changing an oil filter never hurts, but I wouldn't expect it to change much. You can get wrap around coolers for oil filters, but if it were me, I'd spend it on a secondary fan to move more cool air under the canopy to benefit the engine, the hydraulic cooler and to move more heat off of the exhaust and out from under the canopy. YMMV.
Make it a great 4th!
All the best,
Peter
P.S. I like the bad breaker idea. The PT breaker isn't super high quality or robust, so I can easily see it failing. I have that "Duh" feeling, as it is a common element to the circuits. FWIW: marine breakers tend to be higher quality and more weather resistant...
OP
woodlandfarms
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The overheat is a weird thing. (I am not even sure if I am overheating, I am just getting a weird reading). I have never had an issue with my PT about getting warm. I mean I have worked it hard and got it up there, but this was quicker than normal (only an hour) and, well, it isn't like it used to be. I am just going to pull the filter. Oil is fresh enough. I doubt it is the filter.
As for the temp flow. If my fliter is giving me a very hot reading, I would think one side of my radiator would be nearly equal in temp, not nearly 90 degrees less. I guess it is possible the radiator is plugged internally but I would think I would be getting a high pressure reading if that was the case.
Coyote, thanks for your input. This machine does not have a water based engine cooling. It uses the engine oil to cool. But keep the ideas coming.
As for the temp flow. If my fliter is giving me a very hot reading, I would think one side of my radiator would be nearly equal in temp, not nearly 90 degrees less. I guess it is possible the radiator is plugged internally but I would think I would be getting a high pressure reading if that was the case.
Coyote, thanks for your input. This machine does not have a water based engine cooling. It uses the engine oil to cool. But keep the ideas coming.
J_J
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Carl, when you receive the new temp indicator, boil some water and see if if reads correctly.
Do all your temp sensors this way to verify.
Do all your temp sensors this way to verify.
BobRip
Elite Member
What are you trying to say here Bob? Hahaha!
Sorry to all concerned for being too intense. Just trying to get the machine fixed. I wish he lived closer. I would have at least tried to fix it weeks ago. Intermittent problems can really be a pain.
SpringHollow
Elite Member
Infrared thermometers are extremely picky about the material/surface they are reading, angles, distance etc. I would not read much into their absolute values.
And you might want to think about why there was a used temp sensor floating around.
Ken
And you might want to think about why there was a used temp sensor floating around.
Ken
MossRoad
Super Moderator
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- Power Trac PT425 2001 Model Year
Its like watching a movie that you are sure you know the ending to, then the plot takes an unexpected twist!
Sure nice to know we have this forum to turn to for excellent support!
ponytug
Super Member
Dear Carl,
I assume that you have looked down your engine oil cooler with a flashlight and a white card to double check it is clean. I really doubt that there is anything much on the inside of the oil passages to cause a gradient. Ken is right, consumer IR thermometers are very picky about the surface radiation characteristics.
I would point out that if you have been having intermittent electrical issues, it is possible that your fan isn't running as well as it has been, which would mean less air is being pulled over the engine. In the "normal" Deutz installations, the air from the oil cooler is routed over the top of the engine and muffler, exiting engine right. This does provide additional cooling across the top of the engine, and helps further drive exhaust heat away from the engine. My understanding is that the PT design team felt that doing that left insufficient air space between the top of the engine and the hydraulic cooler for good cooling. Of the course of the air shroud from Deutz may have had something to do with it...
If I were betting, I would bet that the oil filter reading is spurious. Your pan is about temperature of the engine head, and a little warmer than the input to the oil cooler (when the oil has had a chance to equilibrate with the lower, cooler, portion of the engine block), and the oil gets cooled in the oil cooler and you start all over, after picking up the engine heat.
If you buy the clamp on auto ranging DC ammeter that I mentioned, it comes with a thermocouple that you could use to settle this...
All the best,
Peter
I assume that you have looked down your engine oil cooler with a flashlight and a white card to double check it is clean. I really doubt that there is anything much on the inside of the oil passages to cause a gradient. Ken is right, consumer IR thermometers are very picky about the surface radiation characteristics.
I would point out that if you have been having intermittent electrical issues, it is possible that your fan isn't running as well as it has been, which would mean less air is being pulled over the engine. In the "normal" Deutz installations, the air from the oil cooler is routed over the top of the engine and muffler, exiting engine right. This does provide additional cooling across the top of the engine, and helps further drive exhaust heat away from the engine. My understanding is that the PT design team felt that doing that left insufficient air space between the top of the engine and the hydraulic cooler for good cooling. Of the course of the air shroud from Deutz may have had something to do with it...
If I were betting, I would bet that the oil filter reading is spurious. Your pan is about temperature of the engine head, and a little warmer than the input to the oil cooler (when the oil has had a chance to equilibrate with the lower, cooler, portion of the engine block), and the oil gets cooled in the oil cooler and you start all over, after picking up the engine heat.
If you buy the clamp on auto ranging DC ammeter that I mentioned, it comes with a thermocouple that you could use to settle this...
All the best,
Peter
