What tractor to buy?

[stumpfield]

I know this question have been asked many times by others. Sorry for asking again. I have 120 acres. My primary use will be to maintain about 1 mile of driveway and may be another mile of neglected public road. Rough mowing of grass and brushes once a year at the begining of summer for fire prevention. The terrain is mostly hilly. I have no problem runing the ATV around the entire property but not sure about a tractor. Which tractor is best for these tasks? I'm looking to spend $15-20k. I drive a stick shift car. It is the same for tractors? How hard it is to operate a FEL and manual shifting? Will I be sorry later for not getting a HST transmission? Thanks in advance for you sugguestions.

 

[inveresk]

Welcome to tbn, Stumpfield.

I'm a novice small farmer myself and don't know enough to answer your question on the type of tractor to buy. However, I'm opinionated enough to throw in my tuppence worth on the fel use and the debate on stick shift vs. hst.

I bought my tractor in July and have put about 125 hours on it since, mainly with tree skidding and road building and have used the fel a lot. Learning to use it was almost a seamless process of learning to use the tractor itself and in becoming familiar with its capabilities, including all its accessories - fel, backhoe and box blade. I've a long way to go to match the competence of the digger drivers I've worked with in the construction industry, some of whom could have given me a close shave with the front blade of the fel while talking on their cellphone and drinking coffee at the same time. But I now know enough to be able to make a reasonable show of using the tool as it's meant to be used and I've had a lot of fun learning how.

I also cut my teeth on stick shift cars and changed to an automatic only recently. On the hst vs. stick shift, I felt that there was enough demand for the use of both my hands on other parts of a new tractor - e.g. steering wheel and fel joystick - that I'd prefer not to have to try to find a third hand from somewhere to change gear. Having lived with the hst for five months now, I still find it terrific and wouldn't change it.

I'm aware that this reply is full of generalities instead of specific advice but there are lots of wise heads on tbn and lots of sound advice will no doubt follow. Good tractor hunting.

 

[Spiffy]

For long roads and fairly open mowing (as apposed to much of the time getting into tight places and backing out): your options are wide open! Not sure how hilly is hilly, so I'll start with the cheapest option, assuming no real tractor challanges of hill.

If the availability is decent in your area, and you're not entirely wrench sweamish, and older 40-50HP AG (i.e. farm) tractor may treat you well even coming in way under budget. Actually most shops around here will work on these, but they're so simple, not much excuse not to do your own maintainance

I can't give too much advice on CUTs, but for the tasks, you list; anything that feels comfortable to you and comes with a dealer you trust (even more important if you're not the wreching type), should treat you well. 4WD would be a bonus for tranfering a bit more power to the ground when conditions aren't optimal, but if the hills are your only challange, stability could [should?; I'm not always the best example of safty, so I try not to the police either /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif] be the limiting factor.

Now if nasty hills are the concern, check out the PowerTrac 1845; there are a few other brands out there with some nice specs as well, but PT's version is the only one I've seen in person, and I don't doubt their claims of stability. If "only" semi-nasty hills, how about a PT 14XX (25,30,45 HP). But, you have to be OK with a little wrenching of your own, as they sell direct. I'm still getting used to my 2445 (not the hill advange you'd get with the 14 or 18 series), but while nobody will try to tell you it's the best for every task; they're sure a neat compromise between a conventional tractor and a skid-steer (the latter of which I wouldn't put on hills).

Good Luck! /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif

 

[IslandTractor]

Given your hilly terrain, I would agree with Chad that a PowerTrac might fit the bill nicely. You'd have to think about size and I think the larger units would be out of your price range but a 1430 with brush mower might do. You have a lot of acreage to cover but if you only need to mow selected areas a couple of times a year that still might be workable. If you are really mowing 120 acres twice a year however, that's going to be a lot of time in the saddle. I suspect a 1430 would mow about 2-3 acres per hour (some PT owners might have a better estimate for you, check out the PT forum) so that might be 80-120 hours per year of mowing. /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif

 

[daTeacha]

I'm a gear guy myself. It would help everyone here to suggest dealers etc. if you would fill in some details about your location, either in your profile or in a post.

Don't be afraid of a gear machine, despite the fact that hydros are the favorite among those here. With a gear machine, you will pretty much pick a gear and go, using the foot throttle some to control engine speed and ground speed to a certain extent. Mostly, though, the engine speed is set with the hand throttle and your feet are not doing much. Many newer machines are synchromesh, so you can shift gears on the go within the main tranny. You can't shift between high and low range without stopping.

If you will be using the PTO a lot, you'll need to keep the RPM somewhere north of 2400 or so, depending on the tractor, to have the PTO running at its designed 540 RPM.

With a hydro, you set the engine speed with the hand throttle and then use the pedal to adjust the hydraulic flow. Pushing the pedal down is like shifting to higher gears. The thing that's a little backwards is that you lighten up on the pedal to go up a hill. You slow the machine down, but the engine keeps it's speed. It's a little counterintuitive, but folks get used to it pretty quickly. Most hydos also have a cruise control. JD gives you all kinds of potentially confusing electronics to make your life easier, so read carefully or find a knowledgable sales guy.

I have to agree about used Ag equipment being your best buy. Get a brand with a dealer respected by local farmers, either at a dealer or privately, maybe at auction. The dealers the farmers trust will treat you fairly to keep your business and hope to sell you some attachments and such later.

The CUTs are a hot market segment right now, kind of like SUVs in the car business. They are a big profit, high ticket item. You'll get a lot more tractor for your dollar with used Ag stuff if you don't mind not having shiny new machinery. Most of my professional farmer friends don't hesitate to buy used since most of it has been traded in for something bigger.

Keep us posted.

 

[flusher]

Don't know how many of your 120 acres you intend to mow, but if I had your problem and your budget limitation, I'd be looking for a pre-owned ag tractor in the 50HP range with some type of easy-to-use gear tranmission. My neighbor got a real good deal earlier this year on a 50HP 1996 New Holland tractor for about $12K. It had less than 300 hours on the meter.

You could handle a big 72" rotary mower (aka brush hog) with a 50HP machine (cost less than $1.5K).

Adding an FEL would probably run $4-5K for a 50HP tractor. FEL's are easy to operate after a short learning period (a few hours playing around with a pile of earth or gravel). IMHO, an FEL is an absolute must for a tractor because it increases the usefulness so much. Without an FEL, a tractor is limited essentially to pushing and pulling.

HSTs are nice if you're planning to do FEL work that involves a lot of reversing direction. If most of your work is mowing, then a gear-type transmission is probably what you want (they're less expensive than the HST).

 

[stumpfield]

I'm in the boonies of central california near yosemite. The terrain is roughly 10-15% grade throughout the ranch. I need something reliable. I will do all the maintenance/service work myself just to avoid the hassle of bringing it to any dealer unless I really have to (at least 60 miles away to the nearest city). Since I don't know anything about tractors, buy used would not be a good ideafor me. (just bought a used trencher and learned the lesson. Just looking good and the engine running well was not good enough. End-up cost me more to replace other parts than the purchase price before I can use it effectively)

About the transmission:
Does the tractor rollback a little when you shift while on a slope (like a car in neutral)?

After reading a few other old posts here, I'm thinking about the Kubota L3400DT (35hp 4WD gear drive with LA463 FEL). I saw an online monthly special ad for $14570 brand new. Will this unit work? or way under power? Thanks again for all your help.

 

[HEC]

I agree with all that has been said thus far,I have 117 acres half fields half woods and mow the fields once each year,my land is flat though.I would never go the 2wd drive option again, been there and done that.I have always had gear drive trans.. I was thinking of going hst this time but dealer recommended the gear drive for what I do.Do a lot of research and know exactly what you will be doing with your tractor and make sure the tractor matches,such as ground speed in lowest gear both forward and reverse with the gear drive trans.,the HP. weight of tractor,loaded tires for FEL. work etc..My tractor is 57HP and I wouldn't go much smaller than that for my needs.As mentioned earlier don't be afraid of a good used tractor so you can get the size that you really need.
Good Luck and have fun, as the research side of this is half the fun ,getting on your own tractor and just getting that seat time,well, words can't explain that. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[johan3400]

I have the L3400. I think it would work just fine for you. I have 63 acres of my own and I take care of 40 for my sister. This tractor is just a good work horse. A bigger tractor may get you done faster, but this one would do the job. I am in hills. You just need to be sensible on the slopes, but that is true of any tractor. Good luck on your choice.

 

[HEC]

How much of the land needs mowing and how heavy is the material being mowed?I mow hvy. grass which is waist high with a 6ft brush hog and it takes all of my abt. 50pto hp to do it in 4th gear low range.It is a slow process but I don't care as I am retired and love the seat time.

 

[Boondox]

I'm going to disagree somewhat with the used ag tractor theme based on your need to brushhog once a year. We're not talking finish mowing on a weekly basis, so I think you could get away with a smaller tractor. I have an L3010 hydrostat for my 155 hilly acres that has served me well for five years. I'm trading up now but only because I need a larger backhoe and more mass to safely harvest the large hardwood trees that represent my winter wood supply. Personally, I like the HST because of my hills; I have much better control maneuvering between boulders and trees on steep slopes. Not sure if that's a concern of yours. The GST is a good option if preserving PTO HP is an issue for you.

Just my $0.02. Pete

 

[HEC]

I think back when I had the L235,what a work horse that little tractor was and it was only abt, 20hp If I remember correctly.I have kicked myself a thousand times for ever selling that tractor and I don't know how many thousands of hrs it had on it as the hr meter broke way back when.Yes I would rather have new also if time was not a factor in getting all his land mowed and would meet his other objectives.
Herb

 

[stumpfield]

Time is not a factor. I won't be mowing the entire 120 acres. Maybe a few hundread feet along the road and round the structures. I just want something easy to manuever, safe and it's the right tool for the job. I read Pete's other post that someone actually hated the HST and trade back to a gear transmission? Wow, I thought HST is a luxury upgrade (cost more, less HP) for the convenience. When I drive a car with automatic trans, I don't miss the stick at all.

 

[daTeacha]

Presuming you really mean 10 to 15%, not degrees, your land is pretty flat. A 100% grade is a 45 degree slope, so your statement puts your at between 4 and 7 degrees, which is very slight compared to what a lot of guys here work with. A shallow slope on a roof is 3/12, or about 25%, which is about the flattest part of my ground.

Based on that, you should be able to run all around the property without too much concern about falling over, unless you get stupid and carry a loaded bucket with the bottom higher than your front axle.

The L 3400 will work well, as will most any tractor in the 30 hp range. My FIL farmed several hundred acres here in Ohio while milking cows and raising hogs and chickens. All he used was his WD-45. The deciding factor on size is how much time you want to spend getting a given chore done. If you like lots of seat time, go with the smaller one. If your time is precious and you view using the tractor as work, find the biggest one you think can afford, then get the next size larger after the salesman tells you about the financing deals they have going on right now. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[stumpfield]

Yea. It's 10 to 15%, not degrees. What's the difference between the L3400 and L3430? Standard L series vs. L30 series. I looked the Kubota website but don't know enough where to look.

 

[DavesTractor]

Stumpfield,
You probably aren't too far from Galt when you get down to the valley. Check out Ted at Horning Equipment. He has Branson and Mahindra, both are good heavy tractors at a fair price.

 

[IslandTractor]

Most people like the HST transmissions and would not go back to gear. As in most things there are exceptions both legitimate due to specific characteristics of gear vs hst and what I would characterize as iconoclastic; some people just like to be different. In general for mowing and FEL work, HST transmissions are preferable. Make sure you get a cruise control if you will be doing a lot of mowing.

 

[rk246]

There are two familes in this size with Kubota, the L2800/3400 and the Grand L series, which has the L 3130, 3430, 3830, all in the same size frame basically and the larger frame and loader size the L4---'s which there are three of. The grand L series has several extra features that the more base model L3400 does not, but they are mostly just convienence features, ie, telescoping 3 pt arms, cup holder, fancier cockpit, upgraded electronics, tilt steering etc, The Grand L series ends up running about 4-5k more than the more base model L3400, as for a work horse I think the L3400 is great, it only depends on if you want the extra features or not...

 

[rk246]

Oh and as for HST it is very nice, I ran gear tractors of my families doing real basic tasks for several years and the HST is so easy and nice to run, but you do lose a few pto horsepower for the HST usually about 3-4, so just buy a little bit bigger hp tractor than you want with HST and you will never notice the decreased HP. My property is very hilly and the HST makes it very nice to drive around on, I hardly ever use the brakes because the HST does such a good job of stopping you...

As for dealers go look at all the different tractors in your area, they all have some very good features, then decide on a couple models, maybe try out the Hst and the Gear and decide on which you like better, then you can usually get the dealers to bring out the tractor/ tractors for you to try out on your property and see what works best for you....