Whats the best "all-around" grease

[DieselPower]

Okay, so it is a lubricant in dry oxygen free environments. But sometimes our equipment needs to work in environments where there is air. Moly and Tungsten disulfide are good EP additives, but much research has been dedicated to cut down the anti-lubrication affects of moly rust.

jmf

BTW, if you want to read the whole article that contains the excerpt below, click here.

Actually the excerpt came out of a trade publication, April 1996 issue of Lubricants Engineer.

I'm still curious where you have ever seen a properly formulated Moly grease that promoted rust/abrasion especially in vehicle and equipment applications.

 

[jmfox]

Oxidation is a known problem that lubrication endeavors to prevent in equipment. The fact that molybdenum oxidizes is generally acknowledged. When you add a material like moly into grease, you are adding a rust potential directly to moving points with each greasing application. If you search moly and abrasive or friction you will find patents that hope to solve the moly problem. Many EP greases use alternatives that do not rust. I will call Lucas today to see what they have to say about their EP grease without moly.

jmf

 

[jmfox]

I did get some information from a chemist at Lucas today. He explained that extreme pressure (EP) is accomplished with lubricants (timken 40lbs), and their additive formula is proprietary. Moly on the other hand is for "shock" mitigation only (not pressure). Lucas is in fact working on a moly additive for their EP grease that will be available this summer. I hope they figure out a way to avoid the anti-lubricating trade-off introduced by moly additives. This turned out to be course on grease after all. It sounds to me like EP and Moly needs to be on the tube.

jmf

 

[phyxer]

Well crap! I guess I'll have 2 guns then; one for the loader (Moly EP) and one for everything else (EP without Moly). Dang it, I so wanted to only need one grease gun. You'd think with all of our advancements we would have been able to come up with a one-stop-shopping grease

Troy

 

[DieselPower]

Not sure what Lucas is talking about but there are numerous Moly greases on the market that perform perfectly in wet, outdoor, oxygen rich enviroments. I have personally seen thousands of pieces of industrial equipment, mining equipment, agricultural equipment, vehicles, power generation plants and construction equipment and can't say I have ever seen any rust/abbrsion problems using Moly fortified grease.

And as far as a 40 lb timken load rating goes that is horrible for any grease.

"Moly on the other hand is for "shock" mitigation only (not pressure)." What???? Moly is a extreme pressure additive.

 

[DieselPower]

Well crap! I guess I'll have 2 guns then; one for the loader (Moly EP) and one for everything else (EP without Moly). Dang it, I so wanted to only need one grease gun. You'd think with all of our advancements we would have been able to come up with a one-stop-shopping grease

Troy

No, you don't need two grease guns. Pick a good Moly grease and don't worry. There are hundreds of thousands if not millions of pieces of equipment being lubricated with Moly fortified greases with no problem. Most industrial equipment manufacturers actually spec the use of Moly fortified grease. If Caterpillar thought that a Moly grease was going to turn their equipment into a rolling rust ball they wouldn't spec a 5% Moly grease.

 

[jmfox]

From what I understand an EP rating only needs to meet the 40lb timken test. I believe this can be done without the help of solid lubricant additives. Lucas is actually 70lb. Moly can often be found in the same wrapper, but it is more of a emergency responder than business as usually. I will probably use a good Moly grease for bucket action and good quality EP for everything else.

Besides oxidation, I found that: "molybdenum disulfide may decompose and release sulfur, causing corrosive wear, depending on conditions, and its lubrication working mechanism may be assumed in terms of iron sulfide coating formation by the released sulfur." (See pg 5)

jmf

 

[DieselPower]

Hmm, let's see, since Molybdenum disulfide decomposes around 400 deg. C. in air unless you plan on using your tractor in a blast furnace I wouldn't worry to much. Molybdenum disulfide is actually used in grease to add to it's heat resistance due to it's ability to withstand high temperatures. Since a large majority of engine oils also contain Molybdenum disulfide you might want to stop using engine oil in your engines, maybe the air will lubricate it better. Oh wait, that won't work either since many parts of a engine are made using Molybdenum disulfide, better just remove the whole engine and hook up to a horse. And you seem to be missing the whole point that sulfur is what makes Molybdenum disulfide such a good lubricant in the first place. It's the two layers of sulfur atoms between the molybdenum that allow it to slide during shear, the effect is the self lubricating properties.

As far as Timken load ratings go, I wouldn't recommend a grease with only a 40 lb rating if my life depended on it. I recommend EP greases to have a 80 to 100 lb Timken rating along with a good 4 ball wear scar reading.

 

[phyxer]

Ok then Diesel Power, will the Mystik JT-6 EP with 3% Moly be a good "one grease gun" grease? Thanks for all of your help.

Troy

 

[jmfox]

Actually, Moly is good to 1600 degrees and would be the better option in a blast furnace. In fact its cousin Moly-D is used in heating elements. It seems like you have an investment in moly grease. What brand do you recommend?

jmf

Hmm, let's see, since Molybdenum disulfide decomposes around 400 deg. C. in air unless you plan on using your tractor in a blast furnace I wouldn't worry to much. Molybdenum disulfide is actually used in grease to add to it's heat resistance due to it's ability to withstand high temperatures. Since a large majority of engine oils also contain Molybdenum disulfide you might want to stop using engine oil in your engines, maybe the air will lubricate it better. Oh wait, that won't work either since many parts of a engine are made using Molybdenum disulfide, better just remove the whole engine and hook up to a horse. And you seem to be missing the whole point that sulfur is what makes Molybdenum disulfide such a good lubricant in the first place. It's the two layers of sulfur atoms between the molybdenum that allow it to slide during shear, the effect is the self lubricating properties.

As far as Timken load ratings go, I wouldn't recommend a grease with only a 40 lb rating if my life depended on it. I recommend EP greases to have a 80 to 100 lb Timken rating along with a good 4 ball wear scar reading.