Window troubles

Paddy · Mar 31, 2011

Built a new home and we bought some high end tripplepane windows. Soon after the check cleared, $50k, we noticed water leaking in on the sills. Called our siding guys and they asured us, "not our issue". Dry spell and no more issues. But now spring is here and they are still leaking. I'm an enginerd so I think, "let's do some experiments". There was a suspect joint on the windows so a I did a water test. ( this joint is where the nail fin snaps in) First I covered this joint with simple masking take and took the hose to it. Not some powerful spray but just to let it run down. Results, no leaking. Next, I remove the tape and do it again. Leaks big time.

Contact window manufacture and agent/salesman. I get the "really, problems??" Agent is great and came to my home and I repeat the water test. He is on our side and agrees there is a big problem. We have an extra window laying around waiting for the garage to be built. So agent and I remove the nail fin to see how these put togather. Take many photos and send to Manufacture. They readily admit, therte is a missing seal!!!

They have proposed doing some top seal using a product. I go to the website of "siad product", and send E-mail and ask if this product is OK for this sitiuation?? They reply "maybe/maybe not" we should test it. So now I'm thinking what is the long term looking like. So then I hold this detail back and ask the manufacture if anyone else reported this issue? They say no. Google it and shure enough, some one else has had this issue and report crappy service.

In my humble opinion, the only way to make it right is to replace the windows. Or some big cash refund. Ready to get lagal avice...

Paddy

Rustyiron · Mar 31, 2011

$50K, Wow, hope that was for more than just the windows! It sounds from your description, that it is not just a sash (the moving part with the glass in it) problem, and if a seal is missing in the frame somewhere, I would positively not accept anything other than replacement. That prob. means removal of a bunch of siding and hopefully tyvek and other sealing around the nailing flange of the window as well as any interior trim and painting!! A big problem, I hate to say it but I'd hire a lawyer asap, and have a letter sent to the manufacturer and the dist. Sorry about your problem. But remember it can be fixed with a bunch of $$$ and some time. What a drag! Good luck
PS If it turns out to be a sash proplem, that's an easy fix.

Paddy · Apr 1, 2011

Yes, the cost included doors and windows. All the windows are casements or fixed. Here is the bad part, the windows are set behind EIFS. EIFS is exterior insulated finish system. Fancey way to say synstetic stuco. The only way to pull the window is to cut the foam/fiberglass mesh/stuco back to expose the nail fin. Surely expensive to repair.

Paddy

northwind318 · Apr 1, 2011

Hi, You need to also address any Water that gets behind EFIS System, just because you have water leaking around the windows its probably a sure bet its also getting in the Wall stud bay.You need to get a check for mold.I built many houses the Window fix is pretty easy addressing the water in the wall is another story. .Contact a Lawyer who has dealt with Construction Problems ,Or call the Building Dept for advise

richamor · Apr 1, 2011

Paddy said:
Ready to get lagal avice...Paddy

I would have no further contact with the window manufacturer. Hopefully you have written documentation, records, photos, etc of the history of your problems. I would take this to an attorney and let them advise you of your next step. It sounds like you're getting the run-around and any "fix" will be a half-assed attempt to get you to shut up long enough for it to become an "old" problem no longer cover under warranty.

Paddy · Apr 1, 2011

Northwind,

The windows are caulked nicely to the stucco. This is an ICF home so no gap or space behind the stucco. The leaking area, where nail fin snaps in, has been confirmed as the only source of leak. As stated above, we proved this via taping over the nail fin gap. Sense then, we have sealed the gap with high quality electrical tape. No leaks as of now. Sills are still exposed on the inside so we can see even the slighest a mount of water.

Paddy

Mousefield · Apr 1, 2011

richamor said:
I would have no further contact with the window manufacturer. Hopefully you have written documentation, records, photos, etc of the history of your problems. I would take this to an attorney and let them advise you of your next step. It sounds like you're getting the run-around and any "fix" will be a half-assed attempt to get you to shut up long enough for it to become an "old" problem no longer cover under warranty.

I would have to agree. Take lots of pics and document everything well.
Our house, which is now about 11 years old, had to have all it windows replaced about 6 years ago. Bad seals on the inside of the thrermopane. Company, called Jeld Wen Windows Canada, was great to deal with, sent out a rep. Only about ½ the windows, including the patio door, had condensate on the inside. He recommended to the company that all the glass be replaced. They did send all new glass and I had to pay a local company to remove old and install new. Cost was only $600.00, think that was a really good deal as there were about 36 sealed units. In my case they only replaced the glass, they did not have to replace the frame. I strongly urge you to look at getting them all replaced, even if they are not leaking now, good chance the rest will in the future. Wish you good luck.

bigtiller · Apr 1, 2011

If it is a Pella wondow, they had a problem and they know all about it.

Marveltone · Apr 1, 2011

I've worked for the same high-end window manufacturer for 20+ years and have been involved in window building, new employee orientation, public tours and field service. In that time I have seen the good, bad and the ugly in both ours and our competitors' products. The company you bought the windows from should stand 100% behind that product, and you, as a customer, deserve full satisfaction from said product... no ifs, ands or buts. Now, that being said, I don't know if you bought from us or somebody else. I don't care. Your satisfaction is all that matters even if it costs the company more than the initial sale.

Keep in contact with the manufacturer and make sure they make everything right: Windows, siding, walls, carpet, anything that may have been damaged in the failure or process of fixing said failure. Use the legal system only as a last resort. Remember, they have more lawyers than you.

Good luck, and keep us posted.

Joe

Obed · Apr 3, 2011

Paddy,

A friend of mine built his house around 2004. He acted as the GC. He bought Peachtree windows for his brick house. Peachtree had a good reputation as a top window manufacturer. After my buddy's windows were installed and the brick siding was completed, he noticed many of the windows did not operate correctly. I don't remember the exact issues he had. He contacted his window guy and showed him his windows. The window guy agreed that the windows were substandard. They ended up replacing all the windows in the house with Anderson windows and no charge to the owner.

According to my friend, Peachtree had been purchased by another company and the quality of the windows went down as a result.

When we had the windows in our new house installed last year, we were extremely **** about how the framers installed them. The discussion about our window installation is documented here on my house building thread. We made sure they had the installalation instructions and used them. We observed the framers looking at the instructions and following the written steps as they installed them. The installation instructions were quite detailed. I'm pretty certain that had we not been insistent, they would have skipped several of the steps specified by the manufacturer. We made sure that the windows were flashed properly and were installed reasonably square. In spite of our efforts, we still had a couple windows that were not a square as we would have liked them.

We did not like the original framer who worked on our house build. When the house got near to the stage where the windows would be installed, we decided that there was no way we could let the original framer install the windows, even though that was part of his contract. We knew he would never go to the detailed effort specified in the installation instructions and figured our windows would end up out of square and leaky if he installed them. So we paid off the original framer to get him to go away and hired a different framer to fix the existing framing issues, finish the framing, and install the windows.

Good luck to you on your window issues. I hope it all works out for you. It will be well worthwhile to follow up and make the installer/manufacturer give you solution that works for the long haul. You have spent enough money to expect a top product. I feel for you in your situation. Having built a house, I understand the stress that such things can cause. Also, be really nice to your wife if you are married. House building issues can strain a marriage; I speak from experience. I'm just very fortunate that I married a gem who, for some unkown reason, put up with me during our project.

Obed