Wired driveway alarm

[3Ts]

Had a situation that needed EMTs to show up at my place at 3 AM. Everything turned out well, but got an education on visibility. I've encouraged brush to grow between the road and the house. At 3 am if you haven't been to our house you're probably not going to find the driveway. So, EMTs strongly suggest we take a different approach. I'm planning on changing all that around and we'll have to put lights out there. I've looked at solar lights and they are just not dependable enough since we have multiple cloudy days, etc. - I have solar lights near the house and I would not depend on them for EMT guides so I'm looking at running conduit and wires all the way out to the street entrance. I plan to light the entrance and put in a strobe that can be turned off or on. Since I'm doing all this, I might as well put in a wired driveway sensor as well. I see the magnetometer style and have one closer to the house, but I'm more interested in a light beam style or something similar since the magnetometer style misses cars and delivery trucks on occasion.

Is there any sensor that can be powered by 120vac and send the signal back to the house also by wires? I can run 2 conduits (or more) if needed. I've not measured the distance yet, but it's probably in the 250' range with trees and shrubs blocking line of sight which is why I want to go with wires.

 

[mikester]

I'm not quite clear what you are trying to do. Yes there are such things as power line communications.

If you are burying 120V lines you can also bury low voltage data lines at the same time. I'd bury conduit and leave space for snaking extra lines in the future.

So far my experience with driveway alarms is that the solar powered IR motion sensing wireless ones have worked better than the magnetometer style. Strategically placed cameras are also great for checking on false alarms.

250 feet is pretty close so wireless might be a good option for you.

 

[Will S]

I was in electronic security system business for 40 years, and installed plenty of various types outdoor detection equipment, for detecting the presence of on foot, and vehicle entry.

This is the one (vehicle detector) that I found to be the most reliable, false alarm free, and is what I installed at my own house when I build here in 1996. It is still working as it should. They also made a model that included an adjustable floodlight relay timer, for turning on remote floods. I had that at my previous place, and it was there for probably 10-12 years, and was still working when I sold that place.

There are other systems that use UHF radio signals, that might work for you, but if I installed one of these, I would fabricate a battery eliminator, powered from the residence, as these things drain batteries in just a month or two.

I know you said your unit falses if you stand over the mag sensor, but unless you are wearing steel toe shoes or have a large metal object nearby, this should no happen. The probe, of course, must be burried parallel to the edge of the lane or driveway, at correct depth, and not near any metal objects, inclusinf hot rocks (rocks containing high ferrous metal content).

 

[jmc]

OP, sorry but this is kinda related...

I'd like to do that on my 3000' foot driveway. My power line from the road is buried along that driveway. IIRC, there was some talk about sending the internet thru power lines since (reportedly) the two signals didn't interfere with each other. Anybody know of such a thing?

 

[TheMan419]

Had a situation that needed EMTs to show up at my place at 3 AM. Everything turned out well, but got an education on visibility. I've encouraged brush to grow between the road and the house. At 3 am if you haven't been to our house you're probably not going to find the driveway. So, EMTs strongly suggest we take a different approach. I'm planning on changing all that around and we'll have to put lights out there. I've looked at solar lights and they are just not dependable enough since we have multiple cloudy days, etc. - I have solar lights near the house and I would not depend on them for EMT guides so I'm looking at running conduit and wires all the way out to the street entrance. I plan to light the entrance and put in a strobe that can be turned off or on. Since I'm doing all this, I might as well put in a wired driveway sensor as well. I see the magnetometer style and have one closer to the house, but I'm more interested in a light beam style or something similar since the magnetometer style misses cars and delivery trucks on occasion.

Is there any sensor that can be powered by 120vac and send the signal back to the house also by wires? I can run 2 conduits (or more) if needed. I've not measured the distance yet, but it's probably in the 250' range with trees and shrubs blocking line of sight which is why I want to go with wires.

Since you are running cable for power anyway....

what about running ethernet as well. Then you could use a Ring Camera (or one of many other brands) and have it alert when it senses traffic down the driveway. That way you get not only the alert but video as well. Video not necessary for EMT traffic, but good for other security purposes. So 2 birds etc.

Glad the visit from EMS turned out well. Hope whoever needed their services returns to good health soon.

 

[3Ts]

Going the route of burying 120v cable, I would put it in conduit for sure. Since i'll be doing the trenching, the trench will be 18" wide because that's how wide the backhoe bucket is and also how wide my compactor is when I backfill. So, yes, multiple conduits would be buried so data lines are separate from power. I had not thought of running ethernet out there, I'll have to think of how I'd pick it up. All the wires I'm planning would not come from the house, but from the pump house instead. It's at the edge of reception and not sure wife will be happy with where a repeater would need to be. This will require some thought.

One thing I neglected to mention - There is a lot of iron ore rock here which is why I want to go with something other than a mag sensor. The iron content is enough that gravel can be picked up with a magnet. I did know this would be a problem for the mag sensor I bought, but it's working better than anything else I've tried to use, just doesn't always trigger. I suspect the speed of the vehicle is part of the detection algorithm. And fence posts and fence rails are also steel.

With the ethernet, there are security cameras that will trigger based on the video image, so you've got me thinking along those lines now.

The EMS visit was for me with wife's insistence. I got to ride in an ambulance for the first time (It was a much rougher ride than I'd ever imagined.) I had a followup with my doctor a few days later and I've been cleared to resume all my normal activities.

 

[2manyrocks]

Are you having to dig this with a backhoe because of trees and rocks as opposed to burying cable?

 

[ponytug]

Yes, iron rich rock is going to add to the challenges for a magnetometer sensor, but unless you have a nearby ham radio antenna the magnetometer control relay should be adjustable enough. Mine is alongside my driveway, but in your case, I would think about placing it lengthwise in the middle of the roadbed and then playing with the sensitivity. Mine is about 40' from the main road, and if I turn up the sensitivity, it will alert on vehicles driving by in the main road. I have it turned down just below what a large truck generates. If you can install loop sensors, they will be more specific.

One thing about optical and IR systems is that animals and fog can often trigger them.

I would second the idea of running shielded underground (gel filled) Ethernet rather than a specific alarm cable, or at least in addition to a dedicated cable. How far is it from the pump house to the house? There are a variety of Ethernet repeaters and wireless antennas suitable for long distance, both for the gate to the pump house and pump house to your home. Someone once said to me that there are two kinds of buried conduit; this that have leaked and those that will leak. Given your location, it might be worth considering continuous conduits rather than jointed PVC.

All the best,

Peter

 

[TheMan419]

There are a variety of Ethernet repeaters and wireless antennas suitable for long distance, both for the gate to the pump house and pump house to your home.

All the best,

Peter

or thinking about it. He is running power out there. He can just use a wifi repeater/antenna system to bridge from the drive entrance back to the house. Most of those are line of sight though so might need to do some testing to see if that would work over a hard wire connection. Also gives some flexibility to add additional IoT items out there in the future.

We have a wifi repeater on top of our large barn. It provides pretty good wifi signal over most of the 18 acres. So if I want a camera somewhere I have signal, all I need to do is power it. Lots of options for that these days.

 

[3Ts]

Yes to trees and rocks. We have a dirt driveway and I'm thinking about going down the middle of it as being the easiest. Some of it will have to be dug with a pressure washer around the trees assuming the roots are not setting on bedrock. I don't really want to damage the trees. I went out and measured everything and I'm a little off, but not to bad. From the router it's 75' to the outside wall where the cable penetrations are. From there it is 180' to the pump house, but about 120' of that is concrete slab. From the pump house to the road is just a couple feet short of 300. I also have conduit from the house to wife's studio which has the underground gel filled internet cable and I have an access point in the studio. It is 110' from there to the pump house. But her studio has 2 layers of metal foil in the walls and the windows have some sort of metalized tinting so signal reception is poor but possible thru the windows.

I like the idea of a repeater. I might be able to get the wife to agree to a post half way down the driveway which should be visible from the street and the pump house, and one more relay to the house/studio. I have an unused CAT6e cable in the corner of her studio porch I put in when it was being built. It has visibility to all the buildings and half way down the drive.

Come to think of it, I have an unused conduit in her studio. It's on the opposite side from the pump house, but I could run cable from there. The cable length from there to the pump house would be about 160' since I'd have to go around and up and over. So I'm looking at about 460' of underground internet cable to get to the street. How far can I go before I need a signal booster? The pump house has a heater to keep pipes from freezing, but I have no idea how hot it gets inside, I'll have to check and also be sure any electronics can handle the heat, don't really want to air condition the pump house.