Would you buy a vehicle that uses hydrogen?

[dubba]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( We must first embrace nuclear power )</font>

I agree. Most people do not understand that hydrogen is not a fuel <font color="green"> source </font>, but rather a fuel <font color="red">medium </font>.

 

[Highbeam]

Yes, we can't (almost never in the US) dig a hydrogen well and pump it. We have to spend big amounts of electricity to split hydrogen from oxygen in water and then the hydrogen gives us that power back for motoring when it recombines with oxygen to form water. Look at it as a gaseous battery that will drive an engine.

I believe that electricity will be around for a long time to provide for us and with the powerlines in place we could actually make the hydrogen anywhere we want. Maybe even at the gas station. We have all the electricity we will ever need from the nuclear powerplants with none of the typical nasty emissions to our air.

The quickest way to get over fears and worries about nuclear waste and storage of spent materials is to see how many spent reactors and materials are already being stored in the desert. Just one of those hundreds of spent reactors with its 30 year life could have produced mucho power. The nuclear cruisers in the navy use 2 reactors, every submarine uses one, I'm not sure about the big carriers but I could assume two or more. I am not a big fan of burning coal, oil, or gas to make hydrogen to burn in our cars but I realize that it will be required until the nuclear industry picks up "steam".

 

[TBrown]

I posted awhile ago that I was going to commute on my moped this year. I don’t recall getting much of a positive reaction… most people thought it was unsafe, or unlikely to save me much $$$ in the long run.

I’ve put around 200 miles on it since April. I don’t go out of my way to ride it, only on short trips where I would normally have driven my truck. If the weather is nice I ride it to and from work and I’ll ride it to get a haircut or attend a fire meeting… things like that. I’ve used just over two gallons of premix. I don’t feel it’s any less safe than riding a bicycle, in fact I happen to live on the route for the Tour de Tug Bicycle tour/race and I’ve never seen any of those bicyclists wear the protective gear I do. It does take me 3 to 4 minutes longer to get to work, but my time is not so precious that I can’t leave for work 5 minutes earlier. Nobody here on TBN is that pressed for time, if we were we wouldn’t be reading this thread.

I don’t consider riding my moped to be any inconvenience; if there’s a threat of rain or it’s a little too brisk outside I drive my truck. My V8 Dakota does not get 20 mpg on short trips, but even if we say it does I’ve still used 7-8 gallons less gasoline and I didn’t have to buy a $20,000 hybrid vehicle or get rid of the gas-guzzling pickup I love to do it.

Anyway, The ENV hydrogen motorcycle that is going to be sold in California this year is a motorcycle in name only… it has the performance and range of a scooter. It’s also projected to cost over $6,000, two to three times what a brand new scooter costs. If the hydrogen to fuel the ENV were free, you’d still have to put a thousand gallons of gas through the conventional scooter before you made up the difference in cost, and I don’t think the hydrogen will be free. If there is a similar disparity in cost between gasoline powered trucks and hydrogen powered trucks, it will be nigh on to impossible for the average individual to make economic sense of such a purchase. I realize the economies of scale will kick in after awhile and drive the price down, but that’s in the distant future. The prices of the current crop of hybrids haven’t dropped much, and some of them have been around for three years now.

So no, I guess I wouldn’t buy a hydrogen vehicle… at least not for many years. I think there are less painful ways to cut back.

 

[Highbeam]

Along those lines, there are many full sized motorcycles that approach 100 mpg but can also run on the freeway and such. My college commuter was a Honda XL200, and got 90+ mpg. Even if you are only a fairweather rider, reducing your consumption is just as good for the bottom line as paying less for fuel.

Turns out California has big plans for hydrogen. They describe making it out of fossil fuels at first. The gas itself floats away and is no less or more dangerous than gasoline. By weight it has more energy than gasoline but by volume it has less so you need a larger/lighter fuel tank. It can be used in piston engines or in fuel cells to make electricity to drive motors. It would appear that our current engines and trannies could be retrofitted to use hydrogen much like they would be converted for propane. The more efficient use of hydrogen would be through a fuel cell but also more complicated and expensive.

 

[flwiii]

I would drive a hydrogen vehicle if one was available at a resonable price and the government would allow me to make my own hydrogen. It would be the run around town car.

In fact I would like to heat and cool my house with Hydrogen. Saw it on one of those "Ask This Old House" shows. Some college had developed a way to produce electricity by converting water to hydrogen, then they would convert the hydrogen back to water to heat and/or cool the place. It seemed like a pretty cool closed system.

 

[flwiii]

Hindenburg. There I said it.

If you really look at it, the Hindenburg burned up. It didn't explode. Had it been filled with gasoline, there would have been no one to rescue. Their bits and peices would have been scattered across several counties.

Hydrogen is far less explosive than gasoline.

 

[rox]

France has all nuclear power for their electricity. They make the reactors all the same. AND it is the only country that has developed the technology for eliminating the nuclar waste. I dont'knwo how they do it but they do. They clean it some how.

 

[midlf]

There are no technical challenges to nuclear, only political ones.

 

[hwp]

Fuel cells sound great but 95% of the hydrogen currently used in them comes from natural gas - so what is the point? /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

[MossRoad]

<font color="blue"> France has all nuclear power for their electricity. They make the reactors all the same. AND it is the only country that has developed the technology for eliminating the nuclar waste. I dont'knwo how they do it but they do. They clean it some how. </font>

You may want to look into that a bit more. /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif While they are very good at reducing the amount of waste, there is waste and it is being stockpiled until they can figure out what to do with it. Read this article then search for a few more regarding France and nuclear waste. /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif