X540... PLEASE HELP

[VTtractorguy]

After reading through your OP again, I agree it shouldn't be stalling at full throttle if it is warm, but at anything less than full throttle warm I am not surprised given my experience with 2 540s. I was initially surprised at how violent the engagement of the deck is on the 540. Grease all of your pulleys (the Zerks) and change to a 5W30 synthetic.

Thanks for your imput. I'll grease everything today. I wonder if this is unique to the X500s or if the X300s and X700s do it as well.

 

[2Malamutes]

Thanks for your imput. I'll grease everything today. I wonder if this is unique to the X500s or if the X300s and X700s do it as well.

X700 has a hydraulic clutch, so it is best engaged at low RPM and then the throttle ramped up for the least strain on the PTO. Since the X300 also has the electric PTO clutch, I imagine that it would be a similar engagement to the X540 although I've never tried one.

 

[dbdartman]

I engage the clutch in my X304 (17HP Kaw 1-cyl) at about half-throttle without it stalling. The sudden load does slow the engine but it's governor picks it back up almost immediately. Then again, this is only a 2-bladed deck & if I read between the lines correctly the 540 has a 3-blade deck.

 

[VTtractorguy]

I engage the clutch in my X304 (17HP Kaw 1-cyl) at about half-throttle without it stalling. The sudden load does slow the engine but it's governor picks it back up almost immediately. Then again, this is only a 2-bladed deck & if I read between the lines correctly the 540 has a 3-blade deck.

Yes, it has a 54 inch w/three blades.

 

[kennyd]

Just a thought here, but you aren't trying to engage the blades when the deck is down and in the grass are you?

 

[VTtractorguy]

Just a thought here, but you aren't trying to engage the blades when the deck is down and in the grass are you?

Good thought, but no it stalls when it is fully up and over my driveway

 

[ATCtech]

I have a new x540 with a 54" arriving in the morning to replace my LX178. I'll let you know what the PTO start effect is on that one shortly.

 

[ATCtech]

Ok, about 8 hours on the meter and here are my observations. The throttle definitely wants to be at near-full to engage the mower. There's no stalling at all, but it does momentarily load the engine (for maybe a second) and it lets out quite a 'chirp' as it starts the deck.

Otherwise, NO complaints!

Bob

 

[Rick_CT]

I have a Toro/Wheeel Horse 522xi with a Kohler Command 22HP that will stall out with a cold engine at full throttle when I engage the 54" deck. Once the engine is up to temperature it will engage at partial throttle, but the manual does say to engage at full throttle. To get past the cold engine stalling, I found that just before engaging the blades, I move the choke lever to half choke, engage the blades, let them come up to speed for a second or two, then take off the choke. Works great for me, no more stalling when cold. Maybe worth a try.

Rick

 

[VTtractorguy]

Ok, about 8 hours on the meter and here are my observations. The throttle definitely wants to be at near-full to engage the mower. There's no stalling at all, but it does momentarily load the engine (for maybe a second) and it lets out quite a 'chirp' as it starts the deck.

Otherwise, NO complaints!

Bob

Hi Bob:

Thanks for your observations. My dealer gave me a new set of plugs and that seemed to help a bit. It now has about 25 hours on it and it appears better, although I did stall it the other day. I have to let it warm up for a good 2 minutes at full throttle otherwise I run the risk of it stalling. Mine chirps as well. Apparently it's normal for these machines.

What's interesting is when I am done hosing the deck down after mowing, not only does it engage much more smoothly but there is no chirp. Obviously the clutch and/or belts are slipping when wet. I'm no engineer, but it seems to me that Deer should somehow change the PTO clutch to allow it ease into engagement or incorporate some sort of lubrication. Water helps, but I'm not going to hose it down every time I want to engage the deck.

But it won't matter any more... I'm trading it in on a 2305!! The X540 is a great cutting machine (I give it that hands down), but I just don't think it will ultimately suit my needs. And if the engine stalls in the hot summer with the deck, what will it do in the dead of winter at 10 degrees with a snow blower? I really don't want to invest in the blower, chains, weights, cab, etc. and find it's problematic.

At any rate, it sounds like your engine is a bit stronger than mine. Perhaps the compression on mine is off a bit or there is something else not right. Good luck with yours!

 

[LBrown59]

The stalling started right after I changed the oil.

Why did you change the oil in a brand new tractor???

 

[LBrown59]

Hi Bob:
.. I'm trading it in on a 2305!!
!

Good move but
to bad you didn't go with the 2305 in the first place.

 

[VTtractorguy]

Why did you change the oil in a brand new tractor???

I changed it at the 8 hour mark as the manual says to do. All fluid levels are right at the mark. Greased everything (several times). So I'm not sure what the problem was. Changing the plugs did help so perhaps the gaps were slightly off on the factory ones. As I mentioned, letting it warm up for a minute or two seems to solve the problem.

At any rate... you are right. I should have bought the 2305 to begin with. I'm not losing much on the trade and my dealer is treating me right, so I'm just looking forward... You live and learn...

 

[ATCtech]

You are most welcome. I drooled at the X749 briefly (and the price tag) and quickly realized that it wouldn't fit through the doors of my shed. (**** it! <GRIN>) I have a walk-behind blower and tiller, so the X540 is strictly an up-scale lawn mower and towing tractor for me.

You mentioned "25 hours" and "greasing several times". You haven't blown a rear seal out of the deck spindle bearings by chance have you? The manual says greasing with "a couple of shots" at 50 hours. If the spindles are losing grease quickly that would account for the extra resistance to starting the blades.

Bob

 

[LBrown59]

1*I changed it at the 8 hour mark as the manual says to do.

2*At any rate... you are right. I should have bought the 2305 to begin with.
I'm not losing much on the trade and my dealer is treating me right, so I'm just looking forward... You live and learn...

1* That's right I forgot That garden tractors require the first service well before Sub Compacts do.

2*I spoke to you from experience on that one.
I bought a CC GT 2554 garden tractor when I really wanted a Kubota BX1500 then turned around later and bought the BX1500.
I should have gotten it in the first place.
Had I done that My savings account would be several thousand dollars fatter than it is now.

 

[LBrown59]

You are most welcome. I drooled at the X749 briefly (and the price tag) and quickly realized that it wouldn't fit through the doors of my shed. (**** it! <GRIN>) I have a walk-behind blower and tiller, so the X540 is strictly an up-scale lawn mower and towing tractor for me.
Bob

That's my main hang up with the x700 JDs to much money for a garden tractor and not enought tractor compared to a sub cut for the same money or there abouts.

 

[ATCtech]

FWIW, and I know this is an old thread, my X540 has now started doing the same thing. I put the 14 bushel bagger on it about 3 weeks ago and in the last week with cooler weather (40-50 degree F ambient air temps.) the engine stalls when the deck is engaged cold. I'm almost done bagging leaves and I'll take the collection blower off and try it without that extra load. I'm at about 23 hours now. If it's still a problem the dealer will be contacted and I'll mention this thread too.

Bob

 

[Neil Clemmons]

I have an x500 with a 48" deck and it will stall when the engine is cold. Once i engage it at full throttle once, I can reengage it at a lower throttle as long as the engine is warm. So I think there is just not enough torque on the cold engine.

neil

 

[Eric Barney]

As a very experienced automotive guy, I would like to add some ideas to this discussion.

I currently own a JD LX188 with a 48" deck, 17 HP water cooled V twin, and an electric PTO. Cold stalling while engaging the mower is a problem I believe can be caused by (1) too much grease in the blade spindles, or the grease is too heavy. The blades will turn easily by hand, at a slow RPM. Try to spin them quickly is a whole different thing. As an experiment, I disassembled the spindles, cleaned all the grease out, then packed the bearings with Moly lube. (CV joint grease) The spindles spin much more freely, and take less effort to get spinning. All other pulleys, idlers, etc. are in perfect condition.

While this certainly improved the stalling, it is not the only issue. The X540 has nearly 10 more HP than the LX188. It is driving the same size, or only slightly larger three blade deck. Why would it even slow a little during PTO engagement? My theory... Fuel management! The reason the engine stalls is due to the carburetor. this is especially true when the engine is cold. Or not fully warmed up.
Utility engines feature very simple fuel requirements. They are meant to run at constant RPM's. Because of this, the carburetors lack accelerator pumps, power valves, and other features that an engine that needs to have when instant throttle response, and a large variation in RPM range is needed.
Small sized carbs are less prone to throttle lag, or hesitation than larger carbs are. (Air velocity)
Since our tractor engines are controlled by RPM governors, the actual throttles are not really open very much when the operator has the throttle at full. (And there is no load on the engine.)
When the PTO engages, the sudden torque load causes the governor to 'snap' open the throttle butterflies on the carburetor to try to get the engine back up to operating RPM's This causes a severe hesistation or stall since the carb is not designed for quick throttle response. The larger carb on the X540 will be more prone to this than the much smaller carb on the LX.

Features like the accelerator pumps would solve this problem, but would cause others. Cost, reliablity, emmissions to name a few. Electronic fuel injection is a mature technology that should be in place on the X540. It is used on the X728. I'll bet that engine does not slow much when even the largest deck is engaged. EFI will also provide the correct amount of fuel under all temperature conditions. No stall, even when cold.

My new X540 has arrived, and I will keep a close watch on this issue. I will post any comments, and possible solutions if I find them.

Preventive measures will include: Changing the engine oil to synthetic as soon as the break in period has passed. Using fuel additives to combat ethanol corrosion, and using very high quality, low drag lubes in the spindles.

 

[jdphan]

did you notice this post is almost 4 years old.