Rear-mounted winch?

[Andy2dotO]

Hiya. I've recently gotten a 4500Z to clear and maintain very hilly property in central California. So far, it climbs and descends with considerable control, and I'm making serious progress clearing out the poison oak that has made this acreage untouchable to date. Hooray.

Still, I keep finding myself in this position:


I've read the advice about using the mower deck to lift the front wheels and shift them out of the path of the tree, but on this slope (which, in this picture, looks negligible -- it's not. It's about 20 degrees) that just doesn't work for me. Loose ground isn't helping at all.

I've finally learned the lesson (after cutting down two trees to free the tractor): Don't try to mow close to the uphill side of the tree -- it's just too easy to slide into this position on loose steep slopes.

Still, I keep thinking that if I had a rear-mounted winch, I could pull the rear end uphill just enough to clear the stump, and refrain from cutting yet another oak down. If you look at it, I have plenty of anchor points at my disposal.

Anyone ever mounted a winch to the back of their Ventrac 4500? If so, any advice? If this is a dumb idea, can you help me understand why?

Thanks!

 

[bcp]

I had the same happen with my BX once. This pulled the whole tractor sideways about 3 feet.

Maasdam 4 ton cable puller



A mounted winch will often be in the wrong place, and sometimes pulling only one end will not work.

Bruce

 

[Andy2dotO]

Thanks, Bruce. I had a come-a-long and a few ratchet straps tied off to high points trying to drag it uphill, but just couldn't get enough "oomph" on them to make a difference. Still, it was a tiny winch and simple ratchet straps.

I should upgrade my come-a-long, and find some better anchoring material.

That looks like a great option. I'll never stop thinking "This is a job a machine should be doing," but won't shy away from putting some elbow grease into the effort.

Thanks again,

A2.O

 

[CobyRupert]

Cut the tree down!

Yep, been there, done that,
...with a Steiner that I drove doing lawn care around condos/golf course one summer.
My problem wasn't a tree like that, but I'd slide sideways down and be along the edge of the condo. The tractor had dual tires on each corner & I couldn't turn one way or the other without rubbing the condo, and not being able to turn enough to get away. Solution was to disconnect the mower & then be able to turn enough without banging it.

 

[Andy2dotO]

Yep. That's where I ended up. Eventually, I'm gonna get wrapped around one of the trees I, or more importantly, my wife loves. I need an alternative, and it looks like a better hand winch is the ticket so far.

Locked around a condo? They'd just have to fire me -- I'd screw that up in an instant.

 

[lennyzx11]

I hate it when that happens!

 

[Andy2dotO]

Gah! So, fess up. Did you...
A. Cut the tree down or
B. Remove all attachments, destroy your back moving them, reconnect, and tell nobody until now?

Either way, this makes me feel better. Thank you.

 

[oosik]

Either a heavier come-a-long or Hi-Lift jack to move the rear over. The convolutions of attaching an electric winch will be a difficult situation. OR, just be more careful when mowing on the high side.

 

[johara1]

Man, just lift the machine up with the hydraulic and articulate away from the tree and set it down articulate the other way, and do it a again and again til you are free...... same as in a ditch or sunk in the mud...... jim

 

[Andy2dotO]

Either a heavier come-a-long or Hi-Lift jack to move the rear over.

Agreed! Upsized hand winch and better rigging materials inbound!

The convolutions of attaching an electric winch will be a difficult situation.

I was initially looking at hydraulics, and chatting with a fabricator I'm lucky enough to know locally. Seemed feasible, but we both questioned how effective this would be.

Just be more careful when mowing on the high side.

Well, yeah. Obviously I screwed up trying to squeeze around that tree on that slope. I'll learn eventually.

 

[Andy2dotO]

Man, just lift the machine up with the hydraulic and articulate away from the tree and set it down articulate the other way, and do it a again and again til you are free...... same as in a ditch or sunk in the mud...... jim

I had read your post earlier (That's actually what helped me find this forum -- thanks for the advice!), and I tried that solution for a good long while this time. I just couldn't get the front end to stay put once I lifted the mower to articulate the other direction -- it just kept sliding back against the tree. I think slope+loose, wet clay dirt just prevent that from working in this specific situation. Still, I can see how that would work with some grip, or some uphill assistance from a static anchor (tree, deadman, etc.).

I'm sure I'll get the chance to try your solution out again. =0)

 

[dfkrug]

I have been there, too. Even a 20% side slope is pretty steep.

How did I get out? I had a 2nd tractor with AG tires to pull sideways. I don't have that now, but the tires make a huge difference. My R4s are terrible when it comes to sideways traction, let alone forward traction. Turf tires are not good for this either. Not having a second tractor now makes me extra cautious. Too dry or too wet, plus a side slope: no bueno!

I like the dually setup, but AGs would be heaps better, IMO. Those tires look more like turf tread.

 

[Andy2dotO]

How did I get out? I had a 2nd tractor with AG tires to pull sideways.

Second tractor you say? Took me five years to convince the missus this one was required here. Still, I'll get to work. =0)

Good point on the tires. These grip pretty well forward/backward to 30+ degrees, but slip laterally pretty easily at anything above 20 degrees so far.

 

[johara1]

I had read your post earlier (That's actually what helped me find this forum -- thanks for the advice!), and I tried that solution for a good long while this time. I just couldn't get the front end to stay put once I lifted the mower to articulate the other direction -- it just kept sliding back against the tree. I think slope+loose, wet clay dirt just prevent that from working in this specific situation. Still, I can see how that would work with some grip, or some uphill assistance from a static anchor (tree, deadman, etc.).

I'm sure I'll get the chance to try your solution out again. =0)

Never lift the mower, it will help pull you away......only lift it is to articulate the other way. some times you may have to play around a little. sometimes you work it around till you are going up hill and you can get away easier..... jim

 

[MountainBuck]

This just happened to me.

My tree wasn't that big so I cut it down.

I have the 3 point hitch which currently has a draw bar on it. I put some blocks under it and *thought* that I was going to easily pick up the rear end and "articulate away."

But that didn't work. I couldn't pick up the rear end with the hydraulics. Not quite sure why but didn't mess with it after it wouldn't work after a couple tries. That's when I cut the tree down.

 

[lennyzx11]

Gah! So, fess up. Did you...
A. Cut the tree down or
B. Remove all attachments, destroy your back moving them, reconnect, and tell nobody until now?

Either way, this makes me feel better. Thank you.

Option B. I had the added fun of the quick hitch was sitting on the angled trunk of the tree and wouldn’t drop enough to get out from under the rotary cutter.
So it had to be removed also.

Of course this was all down at the far end of the place making a 1/2 mile walk necessary to get a heavy pry bar to move everything.

 

[prs]

If you remove the front caster wheels, the mower frame might get enough traction to use the articulation to push yourself uphill away from the tree, pole, guy wire, whatever. With the front casters on, no way now how. The good thing is, you live and learn.

prs

 

[johara1]

If you remove the front caster wheels, the mower frame might get enough traction to use the articulation to push yourself uphill away from the tree, pole, guy wire, whatever. With the front casters on, no way now how. The good thing is, you live and learn.

prs

Wow, I'm glade you told me that..... I have been doing wrong since I can remember, and it just worked when I got stuck in a ditch yesterday and I didn't take the caster wheels off....LMAO.... jim

 

[prs]

I probably have my casters installed wrong; I did not realize the body of the tough cut mower was supposed to drag along on the ground so the blades can scalp the dirt. I have my casters set to hold the mower about 7" above ground level. Bless your heart.

prs

 

[Andy2dotO]

Hmm. This makes me wonder. Are those casters adjustable? I'd love to get the deck a bit closer, but don't want to jam it against every contour on the hill.

I'd go check, but I'm stuck in the office, and won't see the Ventrac again for a week.

Yes, I am experiencing separation anxiety. =0)