Buying Advice Another looking for help on purchase

[GeneDoc]

I have 100+ acres of rolling land in Rhinelander (WI), mostly wooded, for which I am trying to get a tractor. In the past, I have rented Bobcat skidsteers (e.g. T650) and 8500# mini excavators (love the thumb!) to do the work and have liked their size, but don't like the inconvenience of having to rent. A big benefit of renting is I don't have to know how to do any maintenance. I want a tractor to help maintain trails, pull stumps, and maintain small food plots. I have a 25hp DR brush mower towed by a Mule ProFXT, so I don't need a mower. I also have a 72" plow for the Mule, so don't need that now. The land is mostly dry, but there are many wet areas. I had to teach myself how to get a mini-excavator unstuck a couple times. Thank goodness I had a bucket! So, hopefully the need and land type is somewhat clear.

I am in the category of having more money than tractor-related brain power, so would appreciate any and all help. I have been considering units in the $20-25K price range, namely Kubota and JD, looking to start with a unit with a front loader, but eventually being able to add a backhoe. I have been looking mainly at Kubota and JD based on talking to the farmers I work with and they dealers ~45 miles away, though I know there is some interest in Mahindra, which also has a dealer 45 miles away. The Kubota B3350 had caught my eye, but late last night I learned about the regeneration issue, whatever that is, so now I'm wondering if I should be leaning on the B2650. It seems the JD 2032R is a reasonable comparison by price and power, but I don't know enough about the units to know if the 2032R is actually closer to a BX23S and comparison with B3350 is inaccurate. I'm not trying to start a green/orange flame war here.

Added into the mix is a used JD 4320 with 690hours that's not too far away. It's at a dealer, which gives me a little confidence, but I am concerned about buying used as I don't know the first thing about large engine maintenance. I'm teachable and willing to get dirty, but could be easily swindled on a hidden problem.

So, with all of this babbling. I am looking for input on if I'm looking at reasonable units, right size units, and frankly have no clue what options would be good to get at purchase instead of waiting down the road. I would rather not spend the money on a B3350 and backhoe at the start, but I'd rather get a larger tractor to start and then add the backhoe later instead of getting a smaller unit that comes with a backhoe and wishing I had more power.

Thanks for any and all input. I appreciate it in advance.

 

[nybirdman]

If you like Kubota;look at a L2501.Very popular model for Kubota.I have operated a "B" and found it to be o.k. but the small "L" series seems to be more tractor for not much more money.
We have two "L's" in the family and one Grand L.

 

[oldballs]

My "B" does everything that I need to do. But my 3 acres is not wooded and no really big jobs are required. On my wish list would be a jump up to a Kubota L3901 size which adds quite a bit of heft to doing bigger chores. I can't comment on the regeneration problem on the new units. ... and I'm only thinking of the Kubota line which I am a bit familiar with.

Happy hunting,
Mike

 

[bspeedy]

I think you will find a tractor very useful for some of the things that the Mule is currently helping with. I would not be satisfied with a DR type mower so I would ditch that for a tractor mounted rotary cutter. Same thing with a plow (I'm assuming it's a 72 inch disc harrow?). I'd use the tractor for that. Tractors are not ideal tools for stump removal unless a backhoe is attached.

For that acreage and your wishes, I would look for a Grand L or MX series Kubota (or an equivalent size in the other brands).

I'm assuming the JD 4320 you looked at is the modern 4320 and not the old 2wd version from the 1970's. If so, it's the right size and weight for you, I think. 48 hp, heavy frame. I don't know the reliability record of this particular model, but at 600 hours, it should have thousands of hours left in it's life. The average CUT owner puts 100 hours per year on his tractor. Don't fear used machines. Have them checked out by a friend or paid mechanic. 100 bucks for a couple hours of time from someone knowledgeable can save you thousands.

 

[Thomas]

Check out Kubota L's with HST,as other posted couple more dollars but well worth every dime.

 

[Ricn]

Second on l2501, mine is more than expected and so comfortable to set on. My neighbor just got his but with backhoe attached and using it every day on his place. The l series are very easy on and off for us old timers as well, a real plus!
Ricn

 

[jeff9366]

DEERE 4320 SPECS: TractorData.com John Deere 4320 tractor information

Does the Deere 4320 have a Front End Loader?

Personally, I would prefer the stability of the Deere 4320 at 3,900 pounds bare tractor.
Deere 4320 is a made in Augusta, Georgia model. It should be dependable.
Hours are low. Probably one owner, which is desirable.


The Kubota L2501 is going to feel like a Tonka toy after the heavy equipment you have rented.

Whatever brand of tractor you choose I recommend a bare tractor weight of ~~4,000 to 6,000 pounds.
You need some grunt and loader carrying capacity for 100 acres of woods.



You have not described what tasks you foresee for the Backhoe.

I have a $400 Bucket Spade. Mounted on the bucket of the Deere 4320 Bucket Spade will accomplish 40% of Backhoe tasks.

Do you have enough work to justify an $8,000 Backhoe rather than a $400 Bucket Spade?

You need to remove the Backhoe to access tractor Three Point Hitch.

LINK: Tractor and Skidsteer bucket spade shovel

 

[GeneDoc]

Thanks for everyone's thoughts.

When I saw the information on the JD 4320, I called the Kubota dealer and asked what he'd match it against for a similar price. I also asked his opinion about the B3350 vs L3301HST. He said he'd put the L3901 at $24,500 to keep it below the JD price.

@Jeff9366, great thoughts:
1. Yes, I mentioned what I'd rented in case my limited experience mattered. I know I'm very much a novice, but the equipment I rented was great and I was afraid I'd be disappointed with lawnmowers with light weight attachments.
2. The JD 4320 has more on it than I understand and the pictures are limited, but they do show the edge of a loader. It is listed as 4WD, hydro, R4 tires, CX400 self leveling, skid loader hookup on bucket, 1 rear remote, 540 rear pto, 3 pt hitch. With my limited knowledge, it all sounds great (ala Charlie Brown's teacher, "blah blah blah"). Glad to hear people think the hours aren't a big issue. Still don't have a clue how to find a mechanic when the place is 90 miles away.
3. When I used the mini-excavator, it was primarily for boulders and stumps, though it did an amazing job of simply grabbing small trees and ripping them out at the roots. No need to dig out a stump if the whole tree was just ripped out of the ground. After I'd figured that out, I kicked myself for the chainsaw time I'd spent, where I'd been careful to leave a stump the skidsteer could manage.
4. Your idea of the Bucket Spade is amazing. Big thanks! I've never even heard of it. That would absolutely be plenty for the beginning and would likely allow me to put off the backhoe purchase, probably indefinitely. Were I to have a very large job, probably should just go back and rent a mini-ex.

BTW, the post & tree puller is also impressive and further shows I don't need a backhoe:
Tractor Forks, Bucket Forks, Loader Forks

So, it looks like I'll need to figure out if the power of the JD4320 balances out my worries about a machine without a warranty over a L3301HST with less power and heft but with a warranty.

Thanks again all!

 

[jeff9366]

GeneDoc

The JD 4320 has more on it than I understand and the pictures are limited, but they do show the edge of a loader. It is listed as 4WD, hydro, R4 tires, CX400 self leveling, skid loader hookup on bucket, 1 rear remote, 540 rear pto, 3 pt hitch. With my limited knowledge, it all sounds great. Glad to hear people think the hours aren't a big issue.

You need to confirm the loader. The other kit is excellent. Ask if the rear tires are 75% liquid filled/"loaded" which improves tractor stability on slopes.
The engine hours are low but having one owner is more important. Tractor reliability is heavily influenced by the prudence and experience of the operator(s). A one owner tractor is more likely to have been operated prudently and maintained properly than a multi-owner tractor. (Well maintained diesel tractor engines run 12,000 hours before overhaul.)

For woods work I would talk to Deere about installing expanded steel as armor under the tractor. HST solenoids, hydraulic lines and filters are vulnerable under the tractor in the woods. I have expanded steel armor under my tractor and it has been bullet proof in the woods since simple installation.
LINK: expanded steel armor site:tractorbynet.com - Google Search


Still don't have a clue how to find a mechanic when Deere is 90 miles away.

Ask your neighbors. Ask tire dealers and NAPA store employees in nearest town, ask local welding shop. (You will need the welding shop from time to time.) Search internet for mobile tractor service. Deere is second to Kubota in number of units "out there". T-B-N can be very helpful as tutorial for routine preventative maintenance, somewhat helpful if you need real repairs.

I am glad my Kubota dealer is six miles from my property. I fuel and grease my tractor but at age seventy I have the dealer pick up the tractor and do everything else.

It is a rare new tractor that does not need adjustments during the first 200 hours in the field. With 690 hours it is highly probable the Deere has been completely debugged.

DEERE 4320 T-B-N THREADS: (keep in mind there is a 1970's model Deere 4320 as well as the contemporary Deere 4320):
Deere 432 site:tractorbynet.com - Google Search


3. When I used the mini-excavator, it was primarily for boulders and stumps, though it did an amazing job of simply grabbing small trees and ripping them out at the roots. No need to dig out a stump if the whole tree was just ripped out of the ground. After I'd figured that out, I kicked myself for the chainsaw time I'd spent, where I'd been careful to leave a stump the skidsteer could manage.

Many share your experience and chagrin, including me. After renting tracked equipment you will be appalled at how UNSTABLE a wheeled tractor is under front end load.

Ask if Deere 4320 rear tires are 75% liquid filled/"loaded" which improves tractor stability on slopes. Ask if rear wheels are adjusted as wide as tractor design allows.


4. Your idea of the Bucket Spade is amazing. Big thanks! I've never even heard of it. That would absolutely be plenty for the beginning and would allow me to put off the backhoe purchase.
VIDEO: tractor bucket spade attachment - YouTube

BTW, the post & tree puller is also impressive and further shows I don't need a backhoe:
Tractor Forks, Bucket Forks, Loader Forks

The other wonderful bucket attachment for woods work, light grading and opening a small garden is a Ratchet Rake, which can be purchased "drop ship" through the T-B-N store, button at top of this page.

~~You may want a Backhoe....eventually.

VIDEO: ratchet rake - YouTube

LINK: Ratchet Rake site:tractorbynet.com - Google Search


I need to figure out if the power of the JD4320 balances out my worries about a machine without a warranty.

It is the WEIGHT of the Deere that is important, not the horsepower of the engine.
Tractor weight Vs tractor horsepower: https://www.google.com/search?sourc...0i131k1j0i22i30k1j33i22i29i30k1.0.PXL-tuGOtqU

Tractor warranties are NOT inclusive. 75% of what new tractor owners think should be warranty repairs are classified as operator error by tractor producers.

Kubota has sponsored KTAC (Kubota Tractor Acceptance Corporation) insurance which covers many (not all) tractor repairs @ $400/year. KTAC is more comprehensive than Kubota tractor warranty. KTAC covers TRANSPORTATION for repairs.

As Deere finances equipment purchases like Kubota, I expect Deere offers similar insurance.


Fill in your location within your T-B-N Profile.

 

[GeneDoc]

jeff9366

Thanks for excellent information. You've given me quite a punch list for a call to the dealer. Thank you very much for your generous assistance.

The JD4320 is from 2012. I'm attaching images from the sale site on the off chance there's any other useful information there.

It was interesting reading posts about using Rimguard (sugar beet byproduct) vs antifreeze/water vs RV water antifreeze vs windshield washer fluid vs axle weights. Will need to look into this, but not a deal breaker on used vs new if it's not in the JD4320, as it certainly isn't in the L3301 new. Funny thing is I'm seeing posts from some saying manufacturers don't recommend filling tires and also posts talking about maintenance on filled tires being problematic. I have no data either way, but random internet information can be as confusing as it is helpful. It seems the majority of posts favor using filled tires and I even found reference to tools that would let me fill tires myself, albeit losing some of the density provided by Rimguard.

Got sucked into reading about tire filling and the tangent took me into a realm I'd never thought about -- rear ballast. I do plan to do heavy lifting with the FEL, so I'm glad I read more about the need for ballast. Some folks have been pretty creative when coming up with ballast, so it's great to see ideas. I have welding equipment, so may be able to MacGyver something for the job.

For good or bad, my land has little in the way of slopes. There are a few areas of 20-30 foot elevation change, but that's an exception and most trails cross areas of 2-4 foot change.