Are Electric Power Co's Liable for Damage?

[greasemonkeyok]

Start here:
KY Public Service Commission Consumer Services Complaint Form

If they are like most other regulatory agencies, they will respond best to polite but persistent contact. Remember, they are political, and the electric companies have more contact with them. But if they see that you are going to draw a lot attention to an unfixed problem, they don't like being in the camera field of view.

Several years ago I purchased a couple of "hospital" grade surge suppressors and placed them on both legs of the 220v near the main. That seems to have helped. Two different factors on suppression, how much power (amps) they can absorb, and how quickly they clamp down on the surge. The quick devices usually will not hold very much power, and a lightening bolt has a lot of power.

Oh, and I almost forgot, the more customers with the same complaint, the more likely the regulators will put pressure on the utility.

Finally, if you are going to install multiple ground rods, hopefully one of the hams on this board will educate you about something they call "ground loop." It can cause interference on some devices.

 

[2manyrocks]

Now they say, a cow may be rubbing against a power pole causing the problem. LOL.

Must be a really big cow or a very skinny power pole.

 

[ultrarunner]

Must be a really big cow or a very skinny power pole.

Generating lots of static electricity...

 

[MikeD74T]

.... Now they say, a cow may be rubbing against a power pole causing the problem. LOL.

If the cow's causing the problem it has to be at a pole with a loose mechanical connection, at a switch , transformer, etc., it ain't just the wiggle in the wire. Contrary to what the power companies promote most of the problems do come from their loose grounds. Your home ground only serves as backup to theirs. The farm near me, largest dairy operation in NH, refused to connect to the power company ground & opted for their own engineered ground system -a large buried woven copper mat to isolate themselves from stray power. Power company refused at first until it was pointed out that the farm also owns a dozen homes in the immediate area & could justify starting their own power network. MikeD74T

 

[Lineman North Florida]

Contrary to popular belief most power company's will work with you to solve your problems by either coming out and checking everything out and changing out connections at your weatherhead and the pole and usually installing a voltage recorder that will record the voltage at your meter 24 hrs a day, this info can be downloaded and will show if there is a problem on the power company's side.I have gone to many of these calls through the years and it runs about 50/50 meaning about 50% of the time it's something on the power company's side, a connector that was put on 30 years ago sometimes fail, nothing lasts forever. If it is affecting a lot of customers they are going to be getting a lot of calls and they should put it together that they have a larger problem ie regulator hanging up etc.

 

[Lineman North Florida]

Well, actually I contacted a board member of the provider and a engineer came out the next day and walked all the lines in the area and found 1 tree limb that may cause trouble when the wind is blowing. They cut it and we still have the same problem. Now they say, a cow may be rubbing against a power pole causing the problem. LOL.[/QUOTE You don't need an engineer, you need a lineman, someone who can do more than walk the lines and look, you need someone who will check voltage, climb the pole and check connections at the transformer, install voltage recorder etc. If the power company doesn't give you any help after calling them the Public Service Comission in your state probably will. Good luck.

 

[Ken]

I'm retired power co. employee. and one time a rancher with large metal barn was griping about the 256K Transmission line causing his barn to shock the animals. Didn't call power co. but went to PSC then they came down on the PC. We went out to his farm He was steaming about our sorry lines. We showed him his Elec. fence controller was tied so hot wire was causing the problem.
Never said he was sorry about his actions just pulled the plug and walked away.

Worked when ice had the lines down every where and people would stop and yell at us for not working on there lines. instead the the transmission lines.

A lady used a butcher knife to attempt to remove the house meter to put on a "Borrowed "meter so the in between meter readings would not show the usage got the shock of her life and Sued Power Co. for having dangerous equipment attached to her house.

What ever the power problem work with the Power co to fix. it is not designed in to cause you agrivation.
ken

 

[ultrarunner]

I'm retired power co. employee. and one time a rancher with large metal barn was griping about the 256K Transmission line causing his barn to shock the animals. Didn't call power co. but went to PSC then they came down on the PC. We went out to his farm He was steaming about our sorry lines. We showed him his Elec. fence controller was tied so hot wire was causing the problem.
Never said he was sorry about his actions just pulled the plug and walked away.

Worked when ice had the lines down every where and people would stop and yell at us for not working on there lines. instead the the transmission lines.

A lady used a butcher knife to attempt to remove the house meter to put on a "Borrowed "meter so the in between meter readings would not show the usage got the shock of her life and Sued Power Co. for having dangerous equipment attached to her house.

What ever the power problem work with the Power co to fix. it is not designed in to cause you agrivation.
ken

Local utility began rolling out Smart Meters... I have a house meter that powers two things... A sprinkler timer transformer and a 12 watt night light... that's it.

Over the last 10 years the usage averaged 1 to 2 Kw per month with the old meter... since the new meter has been in my usage has increase 4 to 6 fold. Everything is the same except for the new meter...

Because the usage is so low, I still have to pay the $5 monthly minimum either way... it got me thinking because not a day goes by without a story in the news about someone experiencing large increases in usage after the meter install.

How does anyone really know what is being used... gas station pumps must be certified and calibrated regularly as well as the scales in markets and airports...

Seems power company customers have to take the word of the company?

 

[Mace Canute]

Local utility began rolling out Smart Meters... I have a house meter that powers two things... A sprinkler timer transformer and a 12 watt night light... that's it.

Over the last 10 years the usage averaged 1 to 2 Kw per month with the old meter... since the new meter has been in my usage has increase 4 to 6 fold. Everything is the same except for the new meter...

Because the usage is so low, I still have to pay the $5 monthly minimum either way... it got me thinking because not a day goes by without a story in the news about someone experiencing large increases in usage after the meter install.

How does anyone really know what is being used... gas station pumps must be certified and calibrated regularly as well as the scales in markets and airports...

Seems power company customers have to take the word of the company?

It sounds like your old meter was a "clockwork" style meter and the "smart" meter is of course electronic. An electronic meter will register any and all wattage used while the old style meter might not register any usage if the wattage is small enough...just not enough oomph to overcome the stiction of all the gears.

Here in Canada, "Measurements Canada" is

responsible for ensuring the integrity and accuracy of measurement in the Canadian marketplace.

THEY are the ones that tell the power companies what meters to send in for testing and they set the accuracy limits. Residential meters here have a tolerance range of plus or minus 3% (and since it is unrealistic to test ALL meters, samples were taken of those which had been in service for at least 5 years) and commercial ones are plus or minus 1.5% (and ALL of those were tested every five years). MC determine what meters get sampled and tested. If more than a certain % of those meters are outside the tolerance ranges, ALL the meters in that manufacturing batch get changed. (They keep records of that for that specific purpose) It was part of my job to exchange meters for sample testing purposes and recall purposes, besides installing new meters also. Some of the old clockwork style meters were up to 60% slow (no typo). You can easily understand how the new meters would give the impression to the customer that he was betting billed for much more than he was using when in fact he was just starting to get billed what he actually used.

Out of my 35 years as a Journeyman Lineman, I worked 16 of those as a District Operator. A fair part of the District work centered around meters and investigating customer complaints about large bills from meters that the customers thought were registering too much..."fast' meters. In ALL my time working for the provincial electrical utility, I heard of just two meters that were indeed "fast". One was on a farm transformer pole that had been hit by lightning...we assumed it was damaged by the strike...and I actually found one that was fast in an apartment and for that one, I have no idea why it was fast, it just was. I also had a couple of meters that the hands would slip on the shafts that they were mounted on. That made for some weird readings and they were a real bear to figure out what the cause was. The reads would go way high and way low with no rhyme or reason. Over the years, literally thousands of meters passed through my hands, hundreds of meter accuracy verifications also, but only just a couple of actual verified inaccurate meters that caused the customer to be overbilled. The vast majority of the clockwork meters would cause the customer to be underbilled by varying percentages for years.

 

[MikeInMaine]

I was wondering if our Electric power providers could be held liable for "power surges" and "Lower Voltage" that damage computers, TV's and most electrical devices in our homes? I don't plan on making this a legal issue, however, our local provider is falling waay short in this area and I would like to know if the consumer has any right to complain? Ken Sweet

Different regions, different power companies, different answers. As an electrician, I've seen & heard of a few examples of our power company accepting responsibility for damage caused by bad power. Typically, electronics aren't damaged by low voltage, but, with some notable exceptions, are very susceptible to high voltage.

Where the power company has ponied-up has been where there has been catastrophic damage -- panels which melted or caught fire. Those are the well-publicized examples. Standing behind their product is something that our local power company is proud of, and I believe that it would pay for any damage caused by delivering bad power. While I have had numerous occasions to call the power company to fix problems on the delivery side, most power quality problems around here originate on the customer side of the service drop.

Around here, if you were to call the power company, it would usually tell you to hire an electrician to make sure that the customer-owned equipment is in good order. On an overhead service, the customer's responsibility begins on the house-side of the service drop connections. If you're having intermittent brown-outs, the power company might come and redo the splices/taps at the service drop, as those can sometimes work loose.

The electrician would make sure that your electrical service is properly grounded: metal underground waterpipe, if available, and two groundrods. The phone, cable, and satellite should all be bonded to the service ground, and those providers should do that for free. All the connections in the panels should be checked and tightened. The busbar in the panel should be inspected by removing some circuit breakers. Poor connections in the panel can cause problems downstream, and can also cause damaging overheating in the panel.

A whole house surge suppressor is inexpensive, and many brands will simply snap into the panel as a circuit breaker would. They are effective, and IMHO a real good idea. This does not eliminate the need for point of use surge protection. Installing surge protection for the other utilities is also a good idea. I have heard that phone lines carry the most surges, though I couldn't say whether most of these would cause damage. I have seen telephone modems and DSL filters get fried.

If you are in a lightning-prone area, be sure to protect your well pump wire, as it can bring lightning energy into your house. I disagree with the poster who suggested that underground power might be less prone to lightning effects. Underground wires will act as antennas, and as we all know, lightning is trying to reach earth. I have seen a number of cases where the lightning followed underground wires, and tree roots, to get into houses. Lightning protection for underground telephone lines is SOP.

The power company does have equipment which can monitor the incoming power, though it can be difficult to convince them to install it. There are also some electricians who are equipped to do the same, though that service might be somewhat costly. I don't know if the new "smart meters" are able to provide that kind of information, but it would be great if they could. They are just beginning to install them in Maine, and I don't know much about them.
Mike