Fram Filter Problem - From another forum

[Diamondpilot]

While I agree Fram is not the top of the line filter I use about 100 oil filters a year and would say nearly 1/2 of them are Fram. Quakerstate Filters are my first choice but many times can not get them so its Fram. I have not had a single issue and just think how many WalMart and all the major parts places sell everyday??? Anything can fail and maybe this one did but you would have a better chance of winning the lottery and waking up next to Kelly Pickler. (MY DREAM) lol

Chris

 

[sw03]

Go to Bobistheoilguy.com it all started when he began cutting oil filters apart and found the bypass valve in Fram filters to be a chunk of cardboard.

There are better filters out there...there are a few makers and it is possible to get the same filter as K & N or Mobile 1 after learning who makes them...since their version is 1/2 the price of the 'premium' names and is the same filter...

Bobistheoilguy sucks..They are losing sponsors like made..The new owner is lower the bar I feel....I would not put much faith in it. Not what is was when Bob owned it, sad..

Best filter, full flow, is Amsoil Eao..Pricey but the best and lasts...I use Purolator on my Kubota since it is the only one that fixes and priced correctly for my hours...And the UOA's come back fine.

 

[crazyal]

Bobistheoilguy's forum is full of people who say the problem with Fram isn't the design or it may fail but that price wise you can get better (I disagree since the large chain autostores sell you 5 quarts of oila nd either an STP or Fram for a discounted price). There are a few on there who say it sucks and say they've seen it first hand but have little to no proof or point to Russell W. Knize's study to prove their point. However Knize has had an engine failure he blames on a Fram filter and is bias.

At the end of the day Fram sells more filters than anyone else. if they were so bad then we would have heard about it, can you say class action?

 

[KennyV]

At the end of the day Fram sells more filters than anyone else. if they were so bad then we would have heard about it

To see how bad they are ... cut one open, compare it to almost any other brand you also cut open. You are overlooking a lot if you do not note any difference.

Will you have a failure using Fram... NO ... For decades engines had no filter, used rather poor oil, (remember bulk oil?) and engines were, compared to today, not very precisely assembled or machined. With all that going against them they lasted quite a while.

Having seen what is inside the average filter, I will choose a manufacturer that has a better quality reputation.

I know of a burger chain that sells more burgers than the competition... That dose not indicate they are necessarily good for you... will consuming their product kill you outright? Probably not... but I think I'll try something of a different quality.
Fram has enjoyed a bad reputation for some time now... I suspect they will continue to do so... KennyV

 

[firefighter jim]

I've used Fram filters (and others) since the sixties. Never had an engine problem nor a filter problem. Will continue to use them.

 

[Bird]

I've used Fram filters (and others) since the sixties. Never had an engine problem nor a filter problem. Will continue to use them.

My dad owned a service station and an auto parts store over 50 years ago. We stocked Fram, AC, Wix, and Purolator oil filters (can't remember whether we had any other brands or not), but Fram was by far the biggest seller. And I can't recall ever hearing a complaint about any of the brands until Bobtheoilguy on the Internet.:laughing:

 

[brokenot]

I've read three or four different "oil filter comparison" websites over the last few years, and they all pretty much have one thing in common:

No actual testing is done. Somebody with a hacksaw cuts them open and reports what they see. They include all sorts of irrelevant data such as the square inches of area the filter media contains when folded out, but they ignore the fact that different filter media types perform differently. (Funny thing is, they often say that the media itself is different.:confused2 Saying one cannister contains 200 square inches and is therefore better than another one that contains 150 square inches means little unless you're comparing apples-to-apples.

Engine manufacturers set forth minimum requirements filters need to meet. The SAE tests filters to make sure those specs are met. Stuff like first pass efficiency, size of particles the media traps and passes, bypass valve opening pressures, etc. are all actually tested.

Any website or message board that "compares" filters without testing them is a complete waste of time.

As for this issue:

There is alot of reports of a chevy v8 that has lifter noise on startup w/ these filters as the cardboard lets the filter drain and the engine starts w/ the lifters dry...changing filter brands stops the noise.

Yes, some small blocks do have lifter noise on startup. BUT.....if the oil filter is the genuine cause of the problem to begin with, then the owners manual and maintenance manual should specify a filter that by design alleviates the issue. If Chevrolet didn't spec a special filter, then all they're doing now is looking for a scapegoat after the fact because they dropped the ball somewhere along the lines themselves when they designed the oiling system. Long story short, if engine "A" they build calls for a certain filter part number in the manual they printed and it doesn't make noise on startup with that filter installed, then engine "B" they build that they spec the same filter for shouldn't make noise on startup either.

If they tell you that the noise can be "fixed" by switching to a filter they didn't say was required from the get-go, well.....that's just a Band-Aid for whatever the real problem is.

 

[Dargo]

I've read three or four different "oil filter comparison" websites over the last few years, and they all pretty much have one thing in common:

No actual testing is done. Somebody with a hacksaw cuts them open and reports what they see. They include all sorts of irrelevant data such as the square inches of area the filter media contains when folded out, but they ignore the fact that different filter media types perform differently. (Funny thing is, they often say that the media itself is different.:confused2 Saying one cannister contains 200 square inches and is therefore better than another one that contains 150 square inches means little unless you're comparing apples-to-apples.

Engine manufacturers set forth minimum requirements filters need to meet. The SAE tests filters to make sure those specs are met. Stuff like first pass efficiency, size of particles the media traps and passes, bypass valve opening pressures, etc. are all actually tested.

Any website or message board that "compares" filters without testing them is a complete waste of time.

As for this issue:



Yes, some small blocks do have lifter noise on startup. BUT.....if the oil filter is the genuine cause of the problem to begin with, then the owners manual and maintenance manual should specify a filter that by design alleviates the issue. If Chevrolet didn't spec a special filter, then all they're doing now is looking for a scapegoat after the fact because they dropped the ball somewhere along the lines themselves when they designed the oiling system. Long story short, if engine "A" they build calls for a certain filter part number in the manual they printed and it doesn't make noise on startup with that filter installed, then engine "B" they build that they spec the same filter for shouldn't make noise on startup either.

If they tell you that the noise can be "fixed" by switching to a filter they didn't say was required from the get-go, well.....that's just a Band-Aid for whatever the real problem is.

I've rebuilt engines that needed rings, honed cylinders, crank journals and entire short blocks due from poor oil filtration; allowing contaminants to continue to circulate through the engine. The most common denominator? Junk Fram oil filters.

I have news for you, filter media and filter media surface area does play a huge role in how effective an oil filter is. If you're so convinced otherwise, do the paper towel test with a used Fram filter media. The media is not only unacceptably short on surface area, but also rips and is pierced easier than any other filter membrane I've ever seen. You can poke your finger through the media with almost no resistance. It's a joke!

Fram filters have a stamped metal flap on metal to stop flow back from upper engine. Yeah, that's a brilliant idea. That's going to hold well. The other "valve" is in place for when the filter membrane becomes plugged to the point of reducing oil flow. It opens under pressure to allow oil to continue to flow. Since they know their membranes become plugged easily, the flapper opens so easy that who knows how much of your oil is actually filtered or just run through the bypass.

I can crush a Fram filter with my bare hands. Personally, I'd like a filter can with a bit more strength than my Budweiser can. I'm not going to risk my engine on something that cheap. I absolutely refuse to even consider a Fram filter on even a lawn mower engine. If the engine runs, it's worth enough to put something better than a Fram filter on! There is a reason that Fram is the cheapest filter and why it's the best seller at Walmart. It's for the Walmart type of customer; where price supersedes all other factors.

As far as the stories about "well, I ain't had no problems with a Fram filter", I have a 1962 235ci inline 6 cyl that has 200k miles on it and it didn't come from the factory with an oil filter and never had one on it! Oil filters were options then and that engine never had that option. I'd contend that no filter at all is better than a Fram filter. I heard that if Fram improves their quality by at least 100%, Harbor Freight may consider carrying them. LOL

 

[crazyal]

To see how bad they are ... cut one open, compare it to almost any other brand you also cut open. You are overlooking a lot if you do not note any difference.

Will you have a failure using Fram... NO ...

So visually it's not as good in your opinion as other brands, hardly scientific. But that's exactly what is being said over at Bob's. They work OK but for the money you can get a better filter.

 

[clemsonfor]

i agree that media size has an effect but i think he saying that a certain material only needs x area vs another material only needs y area to accomplish the same thing.

Ihave seen frams quality go even further down in the last year or 6 months. When u look in one you use to see a metal thing holding that spring down , now that thing is plastic. I use to buy them if nothing else or prefer them, now i prefer purolator or oe brand name from walmart if availible in my application. I buy pruprtlator plus if onsale at advance after seeing some guy on youtube cuttin open these filters.