Mahindra Max 28XL or Kubota B2920?

[DavesTractor]

Yes, I though about the leverage too. And the mahindra MAX doesnt lift as high (IIRC) as my loader. But still....comparing MY L3400 to a MAX28 (which I know isnt apples to apples), it would take ALOT of leverage to over come a 33% weight difference in the machines.

And BTW, your mahindra isnt really heavy. Comparing the Max to a kubota-B to a Deere 20-series, there is only a few hundred pounds difference.

The real differences in weights are in the 30-60HP range. If it was nothing but an ALL AG or Tillage tractor, then sure, the more weight the better. But most tractors in the 30-60 HP range are considered "utility" tractors that do ALOT of things. And for me, a tractor that weight 2x's more would really limit its ability in less than ideal conditions.

From the front edge of the bucket to the center line of the front axle is 46" on a Max22/25. It would be interesting to know the measurement on your Kubota. Of course a longer measurement gives higher lift, so there is a trade off. I think it is cool that you have a pressure gauge in your system. Neat feature.

Your comment on the Mahindra only being a few hundred pounds heavier? Well a few hundred pounds is a bunch percentage wise on a SCUT or small CUT. We aren't talking about full size ag tractors where one weighs 8500 and the other weighs 8900.

As always, I appreciate your posts.

 

[DavesTractor]

I try and stay out of these, but I don't believe it for second. They won't say how they are comming to this conclusion, but based upon the production numbers from their investor reports, they don't build nearly enough machines to make this statement across their entire HP range. If its true in some sense, its some narrow sliver of the tractor business, but they won't tell anyone what the criteria is.


Mahindra says they built 80-90,000 in the stock report (about 12k went outside India). The US market is 250,000 or so right?


...not trying to pick a fight, I'm just honestly intersted.

I actually went over all of this for you more than once in the open forum, but to save you the time of looking it up, the "narrow sliver" is the 85HP and lower range. That covers the vast majority of tractors sold in the USA, not a narrow sliver.

The last numbers I had for the USA market was 2010, and for ALL HP the total was roughly 150,000 tractors. 2010 wasn't a banner year for the lower HP tractors, but I doubt the USA market is up to 250,000 units. We aren't counting riding lawn mowers.

Mahindra built over 200,000 tractors in 2010. 2011 was better, and we are up again in 2012. Far and away most were built by Mahindra themselves. In the USA, there is a big market for smaller tractors, so a lot of the USA market is Mitsubishi built product.

I can probably do some research and be a little more specific about 2011 total market, Mahindras exact production for FY 2011, etc. But in return, I'd like Kubota's exact production for the same time period. Just a fair exchange of information if you want to discuss this further.

As a large and well respected Kubota dealer, you should have access to such information. We are just a single store operation in rural northern California, but an email to the right person puts those numbers at my fingertips and I'd be glad to discuss this further.

Neil, whenever we get into this friendly debate, every 6 months or so, I like to remind people that I have the utmost respect and admiration fror Kubota. They have a good product and a good dealer base and I have no issues with Kubota. So neither you or any Kubota owners should take my enthusiasm for Mahindra in any was a a disparagement towards Kubota. I am just stating the facts.

 

[LD1]

From the front edge of the bucket to the center line of the front axle is 46" on a Max22/25. It would be interesting to know the measurement on your Kubota. Of course a longer measurement gives higher lift, so there is a trade off. I think it is cool that you have a pressure gauge in your system. Neat feature.

Your comment on the Mahindra only being a few hundred pounds heavier? Well a few hundred pounds is a bunch percentage wise on a SCUT or small CUT. We aren't talking about full size ag tractors where one weighs 8500 and the other weighs 8900.

As always, I appreciate your posts.

I am not at home right now, but I will measure the cutting edge-axle CL when I get home.

I know a few hundred #'s on a small machine matters. But even if you figure percentage wise, the Max isnt like most other mahindra models. If a mahindra weighs 5000lbs, most others are in the 3k range. Thats MUCH more of a difference than a 1600lb vs 1800lb tractor when we are talking about ballasting for a FEL. Heck, you could have 200lbs difference just in who is driving the tractor:laughing:

Back to the loader comparisons....And this is just informative, NOT argumentative:

Max 28 with a 1.77" x 15" cylinder will lift to 82.7" and go to 2.6" below grade. Total range of travel of 85.3" with a 15" stroke cylinder. That is a 5.68:1 ratio.

IE: bucket raises 5.68" for every 1" of stroke.

L3400 with a 1.77" x 21.7" (IIRC) cylinder will lift to 95.3" and a depth of 5.9". Total of 101.2". Thats a ratio of 4.66:1

So it seems that the kubota would have a slight mechanical advantage over the mahindra using the same sized (diameter) cylinder if I am recalling the stroke length correctly on the kubota. The kubota loader and frame is also heavier by about 300# so that would take away a bit of the advantage too.

What does the mahindra run for PSI do you know?? I think the kubota is only 2300-2400.

 

[DavesTractor]

....Heck, you could have 200lbs difference just in who is driving the tractor:laughing:

.....What does the mahindra run for PSI do you know?? I think the kubota is only 2300-2400.

Hey, now you are getting personal! :laughing: I am good ballast, and that is to make my tractor safer. Now to have some ice cream.

Mahindra's PSI is similar, right in that range.

 

[oldnslo]

Hey, now you are getting personal! :laughing: I am good ballast, and that is to make my tractor safer. Now to have some ice cream.

Problem with using us for ballast is that we sit to high and this makes them top heavy

Bring on the ice cream:thumbsup:

 

[s219]

My loader is rated for 1400lbs lift. How much do you think it lifted? What does a 2x2x2 boulder weigh?

A 2x2x2 cube of stone would weight about 950#. A sphere that fits in the same cube would be about 500#.

 

[DavesTractor]

Here is a video that one of our guys quickly put together. It shows a Max 25 TLB, the little brother to the Max 28XL TLB lifting 900# and breaking out 1700# before it lifted the back of our little 3500# forklift. Notice the back of the Max25 did not lift off the ground with 1700# hanging from the bucket. No doubt it was getting light, but it was still stable.

So it would be a grunt, and I wouldn't really recommend it, but I suspect this little guy could move the propane tank mentioned earlier in this thread.

I think having the loader up fairly tight to the tractor helps keep the tractor stable even with maximum lift. Had we not installed the backhoe, we would have absolutley needed ballast of some sort, but not a rediculous amount.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rqmmfYgTFlU"]Mahindra Max 25 lifts the back of a forklift! - YouTube[/ame]

 

[XSKIER]

Dave, that's AWESOME!

Now shoot a video of the MAX28XL scooping up that fork truck, and then running with it! All compliments aside, I don't think any L3800s or 3038Es would accomplish that task! Congrats on a Superior Compact Utility Tractor!

 

[DavesTractor]

Dave, that's AWESOME!

........ Superior Compact Utility Tractor!

That is what Scut means? I like it!

It didn't surprise me that it lifted 1700# using the curl, but it did surprise me that the rear tires on the Max 25 stayed firmly on the ground with only the backhoe for counterweight.

 

[LD1]

Here is a video that one of our guys quickly put together. It shows a Max 25 TLB, the little brother to the Max 28XL TLB lifting 900# and breaking out 1700# before it lifted the back of our little 3500# forklift. Notice the back of the Max25 did not lift off the ground with 1700# hanging from the bucket. No doubt it was getting light, but it was still stable.

So it would be a grunt, and I wouldn't really recommend it, but I suspect this little guy could move the propane tank mentioned earlier in this thread.

I think having the loader up fairly tight to the tractor helps keep the tractor stable even with maximum lift. Had we not installed the backhoe, we would have absolutley needed ballast of some sort, but not a rediculous amount.

Mahindra Max 25 lifts the back of a forklift! - YouTube

Nice Vid.....BUT.....It may just be an optical illusion, but I could swear that if you pause theat video @ 1:56 and again @ 2:11 it looks like that lift cylinder is bowing:confused2:

In all of this rambling though, I totally forgot about curl force. I have been talking (and I guess we may not have been on the same page) about LIFT ONLY. When I lifted my propane tank (~1400-1500lbs), it was LIFT only. Curl was NOT used. And I was rigged @ the cutting edge. So Yes, that max probabally would have lifted it but ONLY with curl.

This has now got me wondering how much I would actually be able to lift if using curl function as well. Because I never do that when lifting something to move because that adds WAY more stress on the lift circuit. In that vid, if you went into relief @ 900lbs lift, and you almost doubled that with the curl, that means them cylinders and hoses are seeing almost double relief pressure as well :EEK: