ordinance to ban tractors

   / ordinance to ban tractors #41  
Nobody wants to live next to something that pulls down the value of their neighborhood. So zoning was invented to try and help adjoining properties be compatible with each other. Problems almost always arise when the neighboring properties usage changes. For example, if somebody builds a development of expensive $750,000 houses next to an acreage-style country home, there might be conflicts.

Both land owners have the right to do what they want with their land. The developer has the right to build expensive houses, and the acreage country home owner has the right to keep their acreage country home. But if those rights conflict with each other, then somebody has to decide who's right allowed and whos is not.

In this example, those two uses can cause problems for each other - like the expensive homeowners wanting paved roads and the acreage owner not wanting to pay the assessment for a paved road. The expensive homeowners wanting a quiet, peaceful place to live, and the acreage homeowner enjoying an early-morning duck-hunt on their property with shotguns at 5 AM. The expensive homeowners not wanting their property value to go down due to the view of rusty, junky-looking equipment and decaying buildings across the street, and the acreage owner thinking that the equipment, although rusty is still useful, and the buildings are just fine for the animals.

The zoning regs try and resolve those conflicts.

The zoning boards often have to decide things one way or the other. Unfortunately for the established land owners, they often decide in the direction of "progress" and "economic development". This means the new development wins and the existing land owners lose.

There are ways to fight these types of things. Legally and also in the forum of public opinion. It only takes a few stories in the paper of how the mayor is taking land from somebody's grandma and giving it to the greedy developers for the mayor to not get re-elected (and thus his boards not re-appointed).

Its a lot harder to fight the process after its too late. Go to every board meeting and every town meeting. Demand copies of all the documents. Definitely talk to a lawyer. I agree with the previous poster that many people don't get involved. The board might not even know that there are people negatively affected by their actions!

Make it clear that if the zoning is intended to solve problem A (contractors parking backhoes in front of their 1/4 acre lots in residential neighborhoods) and you are colleterally effected, but not directly causing problem A (you have a backhoe on a 3 acre lot), there should be an exemption.

If they won't budge on including an ag designation in a township, suggest that the zoning orinance include provisions for a larger, "acreage" residential designation with less restrictions. In many areas, the larger "acreage" developments are seen as the most premium and exclusive neighborhoods of all (watch out for the tax half of this, though).

There are also less-than honerable board members, trustees, and township governers, mayors, etc. These people might have vested interests in the development they are trying to "promote". This is a much harder problem to deal with. Your best bet is to expose them for what they are and hope that they are not re-elected. Dig up the land records of who owns what. Find out who is a business associate of who. Write a column in the opinion page and present your findings (be truthful - don't get sued for libel!).

The weapon of choice these days to defend your land is not a gun, but a pen, a phone, a newspaper article, a lawyer, and some good old fashioned talking to your neighbors.

- Rick
 
   / ordinance to ban tractors #42  
But tar and feathers is so much more visually appealing /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
   / ordinance to ban tractors #43  
<font color="green">if somebody builds a development of expensive $750,000 houses next to an acreage-style country home, there might be conflicts.
</font>

The only conflict here is the millionaire developer who wants to make more millions, and the upper class that move in to these upper class houses. They then want to displace the farmer that's been there for 30 years or longer and putting food on the table. Don't say there's a conflict. There wasn't a conflict before the development came in. The only conflict is greed. The developer bought up cheap land, made millions off of it and now forces the people that were there for years off of the land. And then we just call it progress. That's the long and short of it period.
 
   / ordinance to ban tractors #44  
</font><font color="blue" class="small">( I think most problems that make people mad are at the local level. Go to your local meetings occasionally, introduce yourself and tell them what your interests are. The other people on my board are well meaning, but sometimes just don't understand.

It really is government by the people, you need to attend. I would like to repeal zoning, building codes and many more obtrusive laws but it will take a ground swell of local support around the country. May take a lifetime.

ksmmoto )</font>

The trouble around here is the Pols have figured this out and only have the meetings during the day when Average Joe has to work.
 
   / ordinance to ban tractors #45  
I understand that zoning laws are there to protect property value. What I don't understand is what right do I have to have that type of protection. My 401k plan doesn't have that sort of protection, my mutual funds don't either. Why do we take a different approach when it comes to the value of our houses? We accept that we can lose money on most investments, but exempt our houses from that the through zoning laws. As long as what I am doing on my property does not endanger someone else, or infringe on their rights, I don't see where zoning is Constitutional. I just don't see anywhere in the Constitution where it says we have the "right" to not have our properties value go down.
 
   / ordinance to ban tractors #46  
Having your 50K Mercedes shown up by a 200K tractor just will not be proper.

Egon :
 
   / ordinance to ban tractors #47  
Zoning is always a touchy subject, and its constitutionality has been questioned. It is not necessarily, as tinker put it, to protect property values; it is to create a set of common standards that are beneficial (in the Town Board's opinion) to everyone in the community. Zoning has been ruled constitutional because it supposed to be in the public interest.

There are limits to what the Towns can do. At some point the regulations become a “taking” meaning they go past merely regulating how the property can be used, and instead actually prohibit its use in a reasonable manner (or prohibit a fair economic return on it use). That line is tough to draw. The constitution says that the government cannot “take” anyone’s property without compensating him or her for his or her loss.

There also are limits on forcing existing uses to stop. The common term is “Grandfathered”. The more precise term is “pre-existing, non-conforming” use. With some exceptions new ordinances cannot stop an existing use. For example, I had a case where a house in a single-family area had been used as a five-unit apartment building. The town tried to stop that use. Local zoning ordinances were created in 1927. We proved the property was converted to apartments use in 1923 and used for apartments ever since. The use of the property as an apartment building was ruled a “pre-existing” (meaning it existed prior to enaction of the ordinance) “non-conforming” (meaning it did not meet the ordinance) use, and was allowed to continue. However, if such a use ceases for a significant period of time (sometimes as little as 6 months) the “pre-existing, non-conforming” status ceases and the property has to be brought into compliance with the new ordinances. The “pre-existing” status did not protect against some of the state building codes and the structure still had to be brought into compliance with the building codes for apartments. (Re-reading this I realized this is probably more than most of you wanted to know).

What I find is that often people are afraid to confront a neighbor over something they find objectionable and instead run to their councilman and say "this is wrong, there ought to be a law". The councilman, trying to keep a voter happy, suggests an ordinance to prohibit the activity. The meetings and the ordinances are never well publicized. No one knows the issue is before the board so the only comments the board hears is the people pushing for the rule. What usually happens is the vocal minority wins and we are stuck with a town wide ordinance were some individual intervention would have solved the problem.

What can be done? It’s been said over and over, but go to meetings and pay attention to what they are doing. Once a rule is passed its tough to take it back. I think it’s also important for the town politicians to realize that the majority of the people are silent. Just because a small group is vocal does not mean they represent the community.

As to the farmer/greedy developer/new homeowner debate, just like the farmer has a right to use his land for farming, his neighbor has the right to sell it to a developer. The same farmer who complains about the developer will cry foul if an ordinance is passed affecting his ability to sell his property for the maximum value. It’s all a matter of perspective.
 
   / ordinance to ban tractors #48  
just about 10 years back, my brother and sister-n-law were well involved in the town, attending meetings ect. mostly due to these types of zoneing laws or way village was doing things. anyhow the town had the meetings durring day time (as someone else mentioned so no one working could be there.) they didn't post any info in the town flyer or make public meeting notes redily available. anyhow after a good arguement between them and the NEW MAYOR/trustees the cops began harrasssing them after they started publishing their own paper highlighting what the village government was dooing. soon there after both had been arrested and fined. later they arrested ME said I was letting un-licenced drivers drive my truck! (at the time I didn't OWN a truck however I do now.) They had been living in my home at the time, I was regularry pulled over harrased as well as anyone stopping at my place was done the same way. they are now doing the same thing to my next door neibor.

anyhow the point is that when the government takes power (yes I said TAKES IT) they will not relent as if you disagree then YOU become the criminal not the ones who took the rights form the individual! this is persicution in my books and the zoning and NEW IMPORVED LAWS are just the basic start of things. as others sated it is not hard to get involved unless the coocks are already in the government and the cops back the crooks err politicians. (even worse is lawyers, cops & judges righting laws which keep them in power and give them even more power) the NEW anti Terroerst laws are exactly what we DON'T NEED, just for righting something like this I will probably be "Picked OUT" as a possable subversive and could get wire tap or watched listed...

Anyhow after me getting arrested I called FBI made a report, and about 8 months back the local police chief (one of them who was harrassing and arresting many of the vocal minorities opposing the NEW CHANGES) was infact never regertered to BE a cop or ever passed any public required tests back ground checks or anything else! he has since been FORCED OUT and much of the corrupt power has been slowed, not much mind you but some... I should go back after him and town for the arrest made on me for the $ I spent... (probalby nearly 3K by all figures not even including the scarry feelings I had.) Yep this cop put my brother in jail for 6 months by saying that by brother HIT him, (I was there as was about 15 others, my brother never touched him but it was the COPS WORD which won out in court.) even the cops own witness stated in court that he never say my brother hit him... this is that power thing too much is in the hands of city governments and even federal governments anymore where US the pople are no longer repersented fairly or truthly they rich and powerfull get what they want and the rest get the bill for it...
boy this rant is gettin long. anyhow if they are TRYING to put intoeffect ANY ZONEING get out the word to stop it now. tell everyone about it and get them interested in stopping it... this is probably due to one or two old ladies who think a tractor back hoe or anything else setting besides someone elses place is an eye sore and HAS to be moved, they don't care if it is part of someones living that NEEDS that back hoe to dig footers or new homes or to plant a field full of corn. it is an eye sore to THEM so screw the farmer, construction worker or landscaper who is paying for them(the little old lady) to set at home sucking up the social security money that the worker is putting in there!


anyhow I had enough I got to get away from this post before it gets me madder thinking about the fact that more americans are fighting & dieing for IRAC FREEDOM while our own are being legislated away right here at home..


If "mr DUBBYA" would get more cocerned about HERE then I think things COULD get straightened out. I just don't see it happening EVER as too many people do not care one way or the other they are paying millions for small appartment in NYC Why should they care what happens in rural BFE as long as they have a view of some skyline...

personally I hope they STAY in the city and leave my skyline just as it is Trees, Horses Deer and even the occasional TRACTOR & BACKHOE! /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

Markm /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif
 
   / ordinance to ban tractors #49  
Wow Mark, sorry to hear about your problems, but cut the little old ladies some slack.

<font color="blue">who is paying for them(the little old lady) to set at home sucking up the social security money that the worker is putting in there! </font>
I suspect the "little old lady" has payed more into social security than she will ever get back and deserves ever nickle she gets.
<font color="blue"> probably due to one or two old ladies who think a tractor back hoe or anything else setting besides someone elses place is an eye sore </font>
Remember that one of those little old ladies is your mom. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
 
   / ordinance to ban tractors #50  
</font><font color="blue" class="small">( </font><font color="blueclass=small">The trouble around here is the Pols have figured this out and only have the meetings during the day when Average Joe has to work. )</font>

This is illegal to do in many places and should be fixed in your town. Draw up a petition and hand it over the the idiots that run your town.
 
 
Top