Which 60hp?

[Colby Forest]

Hi there!

New to here and new to tractors, looking for advice. Looking for a tractor with FEL, rear snowblower, grader bar, winch, and backhoe to remove snow on a 1/4 mile drive, haul trees for firewood from 160 acres, grade said drive, dig drainage ditches, and maybe till an acre later. And all the other stuff one does with tractors.

Don't plan on mowing, or haying but who knows what the future may bring?

In our area we have well-established NH and JD dealers, a new Kubota and a new Kioti dealer. The NH dealer has given us a quote on a T2420 with block heater and cab, 12 x 12 hydraulic shift, 4wd, and industrial tires, 2 rear remotes, 270TL loader, 930BH (GH?) backhoe, 84 CSR rear blower and a 7' Rhino 500 rear blade, manual angle: $48,958.00 (+ sales tax). Is he nuts? Are we? Or is this reasonable? We live 30 miles from the closest "city" where Kubota and JD are, 45 from the NH dealer and Kioti. We're almost 200 miles north of Bangor.

Have also seen another thread where someone recommended a TN70 (75?) instead of the T2420/4060. What do you think?

We talked to Kubota dealer about a M5040. They don't seem to know much about their tractors yet. They deal with Honda ATV's and motorcycles. They also sell snowmobiles. The tractors are a new line for them. They seem more like car salesmen. The NH dealer was more laid back and willing to give us the information we were seeking and admitted when he didn't know something. He also mailed us a well-organized printed quote, where the Kubota dealer would just rattle numbers of to us. John Deere just seemed too expensive. Also at the time JD and Kubota could not put a backhoe on with a factory cab. They might have been able to put a Woods or some other on.

 

[flusher]

Hi there!

New to here and new to tractors, looking for advice. Looking for a tractor with FEL, rear snowblower, grader bar, winch, and backhoe to remove snow on a 1/4 mile drive, haul trees for firewood from 160 acres, grade said drive, dig drainage ditches, and maybe till an acre later. And all the other stuff one does with tractors.

Don't plan on mowing, or haying but who knows what the future may bring?

In our area we have well-established NH and JD dealers, a new Kubota and a new Kioti dealer. The NH dealer has given us a quote on a T2420 with block heater and cab, 12 x 12 hydraulic shift, 4wd, and industrial tires, 2 rear remotes, 270TL loader, 930BH (GH?) backhoe, 84 CSR rear blower and a 7' Rhino 500 rear blade, manual angle: $48,958.00 (+ sales tax). Is he nuts? Are we? Or is this reasonable? We live 30 miles from the closest "city" where Kubota and JD are, 45 from the NH dealer and Kioti. We're almost 200 miles north of Bangor.

Have also seen another thread where someone recommended a TN70 (75?) instead of the T2420/4060. What do you think?

We talked to Kubota dealer about a M5040. They don't seem to know much about their tractors yet. They deal with Honda ATV's and motorcycles. They also sell snowmobiles. The tractors are a new line for them. They seem more like car salesmen. The NH dealer was more laid back and willing to give us the information we were seeking and admitted when he didn't know something. He also mailed us a well-organized printed quote, where the Kubota dealer would just rattle numbers of to us. John Deere just seemed too expensive. Also at the time JD and Kubota could not put a backhoe on with a factory cab. They might have been able to put a Woods or some other on.

That T2420 has a 4cyl turbocharged engine and is rated at 51 pto hp. Nice size tractor.

The 2008 model retailed at $31.8K (with cab). Don't know about 2009 models.

I assume that FEL in the deal has a 6-ft bucket like my Mahindra 5525's ML250 FEL that cost me about $5K.

Don't know prices on the BH and the blower. You're on your own there. Assuming $5K each, it's easy to see how that NH dealer's estimate got to $49K.

Good luck on your hunt.

 

[tjkadar]

I would strongly urge you to get around to all the dealers, look at the machines, sit on them, operate them - at least in the yard, and see which tractor fits you the best. I'm pretty sure JD can put on a factory backhoe in that size (if you're talking PTO hp, not engine hp), but you'll be sitting outside the cab to operate it. Take a look at the dealers, find out which one you want to support you. Find out which tractor suits you and then move ahead from there. NH, Kubota, JD, & MF all make great tractors in that size. Kiota and Mahindra make some good tractors in the hp range.

For the cab, my nod would go to JD or MF - slight nod might be to MF based on the transmission choices (JD or MF 5425).

 

[Colby Forest]

Thanks flusher. Yes, 6' bucket. 18" on the backhoe, which is banana boom style. That's $8250.

 

[Colby Forest]

Thanks tj. 60hp is engine, 51 pto.

 

[MossRoad]

Colby Forest

I deleted your other duplicate post at your request.

 

[Birdhunter1]

Since you are going with a cab tractor and talking about using a blade to remove snow I would get a hydraulic blade over a manual angle, it sucks enough climbing on/off an open station tractor (and I'm 28) to move that thing around much less climbing in and out of a cab.

 

[Colby Forest]

Colby Forest

I deleted your other duplicate post at your request.

Thanks. Now I won't look so silly.

 

[Colby Forest]

Since you are going with a cab tractor and talking about using a blade to remove snow I would get a hydraulic blade over a manual angle, it sucks enough climbing on/off an open station tractor (and I'm 28) to move that thing around much less climbing in and out of a cab.

We're looking at the rear snowblower and FEL for snow removal. The blade would be for grading the drive after mud season. Might want hydraulic for that too, though.

 

[Colby Forest]

Hi guys! Still looking. If this helps anyone help me this is the breakdown of the quote on the NH:
T2420, 60hp, 51pto, cab, hydro 12x12, 4WD, R4's, block heater: $29,561.
270TL loader, 6' bucket: $4,566.
930BH backhoe, 18' bucket, banana boom: $8,250.
84CSR rear snowblower, dual hydraulics, 84" cut width: $4,259.
Two rear remotes: $1,400.
Rhino 500 rear blade, 7' blade, manual angle: $922.

Expecting a quote on a Case DX60 any day now.

Have also been considering a Kubota M5040 HDC (50 hp engine) w/cab & LA1153 loader, 2 rear remotes, 4WD, R4's. Tag on it on the lot right now is about $38,822. (Not head over heels about this dealer though)

The rear end on the Kubota looks heftier than the NH and Case. Should I be comparing this to the DX60 and the NH 4060/T2420? Or is it comparable to different models in those makes?

All prices before tax. Uses listed in 1st post. Moderately hilly terrain in Northern Maine.

The more I know, the more I know I don't know.

 

[wkpoor]

Keep in mind unless you are set on new (and more power to ya) when you get into farm tractor sized units you can get a whole lot of tractor for your money used. Also I think this has been touched on but the CUT market compares on engine HP and the farm tractor market compares on PTO or to the ground.

 

[kenstrac]

Try Kioti there DK 75 is 58 hp and with what your looking to do with with the tractor I think R1 tires would be better for your application.

 

[BarryinMN]

I'll be the devils advocate.

An ag cabbed tractor is not frops just rops, not armored for logging in wooded areas. Expect a high maintenance budget for replacement glass, hoods fenders & roofs, lighting; wiring, hydraulic lines and filters torn off underneath, etc. Throw in a gored radiator or 2 from branches.

R4's are lousy in mud, reduce ground clearance, the backhoe frame reduces clearance even further - but the backhoe is useful to get unstuck.

Do you have other primary/secondary machines to put it back upright when it rolls over?

I use an old dozer backhoe & skidloader for logging. The cabbed ag tractor pretty much stays out of the woods.

A snootfull of heavy snow on a 7' blower may stall the engine. A creeper transmission helps to avoid riding the clutch.

Other than that keep us posted on your new adventure

 

[Colby Forest]

Plan on keeping the trails cleared enough to avoid damaging the tractor. Only going to be using it for pulling out downed trees. Can take our time doing it. Won't be felling any near the tractor. Hoping to get a winch for the back of it, therefore the backhoe won't be on it. Aren't R4's more puncture resistant? I believe they have more plys in their sidewalls. Besides, what did they invent tire chains, grill guards and skid plates for?

If we want to do any serious logging, there are plenty of guys with skidders around here looking for work (if the mills are buying).

Not too worried about the snowblower. Have seen one power through almost 4' of fairly packed snow with no trouble. If there's too much, there's always the loader.

Can only (maybe) afford one machine, so has to be multi-purpose. Would prefer new, don't want to end up with a used one someone put the wrong hydraulic oil in

Thanks for the thoughts. There's always more to think about.

Barry-what is in that picture? A bear?

 

[BarryinMN]

Agree R4 are tougher, I have a TLB with them. Mills and loggers here are mostly missing in action.

I have a non turbo 55 hp pto on a 7' blower a full load definitely turns the exhaust note throaty. Your new turbo will have a higher % torque rise but at 51 hp have less overall to play with. Get a larger materials bucket for snow to speed clearing lesser snowfalls. I paid $200 for a rusty 8' junkpile special. $500 for an old ugly 7' blower.

A grapple bucket is invaluable just remember it is an ag loader - cheapest price point tool vs a buncher forwarder.

A box blade may work better than a blade if your road gets rutted. Keep it crowned for good drainage.

 

[Colby Forest]

Was told by the Case dealer that you don't need rear remotes for the backhoe. Supposedly they use the hydraulic connections from the 3-point hitch to connect to the backhoe. Does this make sense to anyone?

Could someone explain the different sorts of hydraulic remotes? I read in another thread a guy had stackables (?), but they were wrong for his tractor.

Have also been considering a Kubota M5040 HDC (50 hp engine) w/cab & LA1153 loader, 2 rear remotes, 4WD, R4's. The rear end on the Kubota looks heftier than the NH and Case. Should I be comparing this to the DX60 and the NH 4060/T2420? Or is it comparable to different models in those makes? Would really appreciate thoughts on what models are comparable across Kubota, New Holland and Case in the 50-60 hp range. Apples to apples...

Thanks for everyone's responses. I've learned a lot from you guys and have a lot more to learn. Keep 'em comin'! What a wealth of information this site is!

 

[BarryinMN]

On the hyd's in a nutshell ag tractors have a cheaper open circuit design which means if the engine is running the hydraulic is flowing thru the valves and back to the tank (transmission cavity) Activating a valve lever blocks off some or all that continuous flow through the branch attached to the lever. The method of getting hydraulic flow from the first valve to the second etc is called power beyond. The dealer is simply attaching the backhoe to the 3pt valve output power beyond & a second hose to tank. Backhoe circuits are operated by its own valves. Either way power beyond or rear ports works if the rear port valve can be locked in an activated position. On my dozer the 2 hyd hoses must be connected when bh removed or the pump deadheads & stalls the engine.

On the tractor model comparisons there are basic price point leaders designed to compete with lesser known manufacturers and more deluxe models with more features at higher prices.

You need to do homework here as there are specific feature contents that may apply to your applications. Example: a cab option is a passenger seat on one model but not available another.

Deere is particularly bad at this making deluxe models without 3pt adjustable links. They are an extra cost option.

Pay particular attention to ballast as it applies to the backhoe option. You need ballast for traction but the bh may limit where & what you can do.

The devil is in the details.

 

[Colby Forest]

Thanks Barry. Have been keeping the ballast question in mind for when not using the bh. Maybe a rear winch would be enough? Oh, on the box blade. Like it, but was just trying to save a some $$. Probably won't have to do a whole lot of grading if I goof off during mud season

What are stackable remotes? How are they different from the other kind? (whatever that is. I'm afraid I'm still a novice at all this. Know a little about tractors, less about the hydraulic systems. Haven't owned a tractor, yet. Can't you tell? ) Deadheading? (Boy what an ignoramus this Colby character is!)

The hyd. connections on the 3-pt on the Kubota looked very inflexible and hard to change to something else. Looked like having rear remotes was a better option.

 

[BarryinMN]

Here is my $10 rear ballast 1000 lbs. Cat 1 pins but will fit my cat II tractor as well.

Stacked remotes is a ham & turkey stacked sandwich - simply bolted together. Usually filled in empty holes on a rear plate.

All modern ag remotes are ISO - push plug straight in pull straight out.

If you can plug a tire chuck into an air hose good to go.

We all start somewhere I was clueless on how to start & run the backhoe in 2002 it's been here since 1980.

 

[davidm479]

Colby have you looked at a Montana ??you will like what you find they just aquared Branson yesterday they are a growing company and will do well --- look at a c5740 6-5-09