Bobcat CT230 and Kioti CK30 side-by-side comparo

[dfkrug]

Just received my new CT230. I still can hardly believe the price....
Under $12.5K for tractor, including bobtach 7TL FEL, AG tires, and
single AUX remote valve. Delivered, including 9% sales tax. That is
considerably less than I paid for my 2005 CK30 with more expensive
R4 tires and no QA FEL bkt.

There are some very interesting differences here....some are better on
the Bobcat, some are better on the Kioti.

> The CT comes with 8-ply AG front tires, so they can be pumped up
to 48 psi. The CK has only 6-ply, and my older Kubotas only came with
4-ply AGs.

> The 7TL FEL comes with a massive 68" bucket with a reinforced upper
lip and a cutting edge that is pre-drilled. Kioti says 60" is the widest
bkt you should mount.

> CT has a horn and CK does not

> CK protects the starter switch from water; CT's switch is fully exposed
to rain and wash water. My new CT has water in the switch already.

> You can turn on the CT's lights without the key....not good, IMO

> The CT's engine speed lever works backward (pull toward you for
higher speed)...what's up with that?

> CT has more safety interlocks, incl a seat switch that will kill the engine
if you try to run the PTO off the tractor, as with a mixer, generator, or
chipper. That has to go.

> The CT's front axle has only one fill cap, down from Kioti's 2.

> CT has gone to a Chinese plastic/aluminum radiator vs. Kioti's
all-brass unit from Samsung

> CT uses a dual element air filter, but it has exactly the same
Donaldson outer filter and housing as the CK. You can use the Bobcat
inner filter with the CK if you want.

> The CT's FEL has very exposed hoses....more so than the CK. Some
protection is needed.

More on the 7TL vs. the KL130 loaders coming up......

 

[t600]

Funny thing is I have a 235 and there are some differences to your 230.
I CAN run pto while not on tractor. Parking brake must be set.
I cant turn on headlights without key on.
Interesting.

 

[vpnwiz]

Funny thing is I have a 235 and there are some differences to your 230.
I CAN run pto while not on tractor. Parking brake must be set.
I cant turn on headlights without key on.
Interesting.

Same experience here with my 235.

 

[dfkrug]

I CAN run pto while not on tractor. Parking brake must be set.

I will play around with the parking brake to see if that makes a diff on use
of the PTO. Does your engine speed lever work backwards?

My CK30 is now more than 4y old, so it is possible and likely that the
newest CKs have changed some things....

BTW, the big Operation and Maintenance Manual that came with my
tractor has the wrong loader info in it. It seems to have specs from the
8TL and not the 7TL.

 

[t600]

I dont know about backwards, you pull toward you for increase, same as my bosses ck30. Same as kubotas also.

 

[dfkrug]

...you pull toward you for increase, same as my bosses ck30. Same as kubotas also.

My CK30's speed control lever needed to be pushed away from you to
increase engine speed. It did have the turtle/rabbit label reversed, however.
I have since moved the CK's speed control to right of the seat. My old
Kubotas and JDs all increased speed by pushing the lever away from you.

 

[gumshu]

Same experience here with my 235.

Same with me.

 

[chazzy]

I dont know about backwards, you pull toward you for increase, same as my bosses ck30. Same as kubotas also.

Same here.
My 1973 Ford tractor (model 2000 3-cyl diesel) increases the engine speed by pulling the hand lever toward the driver. So, I am used to my new CT230's setup.

 

[gumshu]

My CK30's speed control lever needed to be pushed away from you to
increase engine speed. It did have the turtle/rabbit label reversed, however.
I have since moved the CK's speed control to right of the seat. My old
Kubotas and JDs all increased speed by pushing the lever away from you.

The throttle control on my CT235 and Kubota are the same... I pull them towards me to increase speed. I was used to the Kubota when I bought the CT235, so it seemed natural.

 

[dfkrug]

Here is the new cowl. The horn is a great addition....the switch is in
the same place as my custom switch on my CK. Bad news about the starter
switch....no protection from water as with the Kioti. Bobcat changed the
keys and switch from the DaeDong original which has an additional ACC
position.

 

[dfkrug]

Now the 2 loaders.

Published specs show the 7TL loader to be a bit more forceful than the
KL130. It is hard to make a fair comparison from the brichures, however.
Here are my measured field observations:

> The 7TL's boom is made from 2x4x.25 rectangular tubing, bent in the
middle only. The KL130 uses 2x5x.20 rect tubing, made with a continuous
curve. Actual dims are 2.025"x4.025x.250 and 2.00x 4.875x.200 respectively.
The KL130's continuous curve causes some variation of the 2" dimension
from about 1.96 to 2.02.

> The 7TL's Bobtach uses a vertical pin spacing of 8.0", vs. only 5.5 for the
KL130. That should yield a greater breakout force for the 7TL, despite
the longer distance to the bkt lip.

> The 7TL's boom arm spacing is about 4.5" wider. Both have cross tube
designs that do not penetrate thru the arms. The Bobcat's is clearly
stronger, however.

> Relief specs are 2611 for the 7TL, and 2560 for the KL130. My Bobcat
came with reliefs set at 3000. Ooops.

> The boom moment arms are 13.5/67.75 for the 7TL, and 12.5/68.25 for the
KL130. The ratios are .199 and .183, which means that the 7TL will deliver
9% more force at the bkt pin for the same cyl forces.

> But the cyls are not the same: 7TL uses slightly smaller cyls and rods,
ODs are 2.135 and 1.125, while the KL's are 2.170 and 1.18. I do not know
the ID of the 7TL, so ODs are compared. Net cyl forces should be similar if
the 7TL is set at the higher specced pressure of 2611.

> The 7TL uses -6 JIC hose connections, vs. the KL's -5 JICs. The -5s are
hard to find, so I did not even pressure test my FEL until I had it more than
a year. No issue with flow rate.

> The Bobcat's cyls use wire-retained glands, instead of screw-ons. I find
the the wire-retained cyls harder to rebuild. The 7TL also has black chrome
rods....I wonder if they will last longer than regular chrome?

> Finally, the 7TL's FEL hoses hang way down below the tractor. The risk
of ripping out hyd parts below is even worse than the CK30's. And the
CK's risk is BAD. I think the Bobcat must be protected from this kind of
damage. I will fab up a skid plate I think. (The DK/CT3xx tractors are way
better in this regard.)

 

[gaberelli]

> Finally, the 7TL's FEL hoses hang way down below the tractor. The risk
of ripping out hyd parts below is even worse than the CK30's. And the
CK's risk is BAD. I think the Bobcat must be protected from this kind of
damage. I will fab up a skid plate I think. (The DK/CT3xx tractors are way
better in this regard.)

On my CT225 (27HP), the loader hoses are much shorter and do not hang down as low. In fact, sometimes getting them connected can be a huge pain!

 

[Yota_85]

Nice side by side comparison.

Any comments on he loader brackets that attach the loader arms to the tractor. The Kioti & (Rhino) Bobcat look considerably different.

 

[dfkrug]

Any comments on he loader brackets that attach the loader arms to the tractor. The Kioti & (Rhino) Bobcat look considerably different.

Yes, the FEL subframes are considerably different, due to the fact that
the 7TL has wider boom arm spacing. The KL130 FEL subframe hugs the
tractor closer. I suspect that Rhino uses the same or nearly the same
FEL for a number of diff tractors. That way, only the subframes have to
be different.

For some unknown reason, the 7TL has retractable feet for dismounting the
FEL that are set inboard from the boom arms.

 

[Aaron_D]

dfkrug, is that a factory ROPS on your CK? if so, any difference in ROPS between the CK/CT? I would love it if Kioti had a shorter ROPS so my tractor could actually fit in the garage.

 

[dfkrug]

dfkrug, is that a factory ROPS on your CK? if so, any difference in ROPS between the CK/CT? I would love it if Kioti had a shorter ROPS so my tractor could actually fit in the garage.

No, I shortened mine by about 10 inches. The photo shows that the
ROPS on the CT is more than a foot higher than the CK's due to the AG
tires on the CT, which are a bit taller. My origninal ROPS on my CK30
was identical to the one on the Bobcat except that the CT has some
ears welded on for additional flasher work lights. This makes no sense to
me since both tractors already have rear flasher lights built in and the
CT addons are very vulnerable to damage. For some reason, Bobcat has
eliminated the front flashers that are down near the footwells of the
Kioti.

When I modified my ROPS, I opted for square corners so I would have a
good place to mount my work lights INSIDE the ROPS in the corners. My
modified ROPS is still more than a foot higher than my head. My work
light brackets and lights are sitting on my bench waiting for installation.
The relays are in and half of the wiring is done.

On the other CK30 I bought back in 05, the ROPS was also shortened, but
it was done to look stock. This required 3 cuts and sleeved welds on
the existing ROPS, 2 at the sides and one at the top (photo).

 

[wallace]

Okay so the big question???
Why do you now have 2 close to the same tractors?
Do you have a business that you use them for or are you just rich?

 

[dfkrug]

Why do you now have 2 close to the same tractors?
Do you have a business that you use them for or are you just rich?

This tractor was sold so cheap, I could not resist, even if I ended up
owning it until next spring. I have a network of friends whom I assist with
guidance in the areas of mechanical/electrical/construction needs. Often
gratis. I usually try to show them how to do something, rather than do
it for them. The CT will go to a friend who is jumping at the bargain, after I
add a hyd toplink, adjust both relief valves, widen the track, weld on a
loader hook, and probably add a skid plate. Not a business, but I try not
to lose money. I certainly am not looking for work.

Sometimes, I don't have a buyer lined up in advance, so I may sell a tractor
on Ebay or Craigs. That might happen once a year, and the proceeds go
to supporting the next project. I look for things I have not done before so
I can learn about them first hand. I try to indulge my need to make things.
At least with tractors, I have not lost money. With custom or sports cars,
I can practically guarantee losses. BTDT.

So, WALLACE, what is "rich" to you?

 

[wallace]

Rich to me??? Hmmm I'll let you know when I meet someone that is rich.

So just to let you know.....I started out doing exactly like what your doing and one thing led to another and 2.1 million later.....see what I am getting at.
So did you want me to have a Kioti rep stop by to set ya up.

 

[dfkrug]

Hmmm I'll let you know when I meet someone that is rich.

I certainly don't think about myself as rich...I feel I still have to work to
save for retirement, and pay for health insurance (high-deductable,
catastrophic-only, crappy ins). I don't want a big house or a new car
every 3 years, so I guess my standards are low. And costs of many
things are rising, while the value of dollars is falling. Not to mention that
I live in a state that is insolvent.

I have certainly met many rich people, and I have no envy of them.